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re: Building of berms must stop says government
Posted on 6/23/10 at 1:24 pm to Mudminnow
Posted on 6/23/10 at 1:24 pm to Mudminnow
quote:
I highly doubt the feds have listened to scientists regarding building of the berms. Curious as to the reasoning.
What have the scientists been saying about the berms? Honest question, because I haven't heard a single scientist weigh in one way or another. I know Nungesser supports it, but he isn't a scientist.
I've always been a bit leery of the berms -- this is not a minor undertaking and there's a possibility these things could lead to unintended consequences.
1
Posted on 6/23/10 at 2:08 pm to reverendotis
quote:
I'm predicting Billy Nungesser will administer something reminiscent of a "finishing move" from Mid South wrestling to at least one federal official before this is over with.
cue the Oklahoma stampede on barry.
Posted on 6/23/10 at 2:28 pm to HeadSlash
quote:quote:
I'm predicting Billy Nungesser will administer something reminiscent of a "finishing move" from Mid South wrestling to at least one federal official before this is over with.
cue the Oklahoma stampede on barry.
I'm hoping for an old-fashioned JYD "thump".
Posted on 6/23/10 at 2:35 pm to Bard
I'd like to see the DDT myself... Posted on 6/23/10 at 3:47 pm to TigerNAtux
TigerNAtux
Onto a steel chair covered in thumb tacks and broken glass.
Onto a steel chair covered in thumb tacks and broken glass.
Posted on 6/23/10 at 3:54 pm to Mudminnow
quote:seriously though, LSU getting the 5M for research doesn't really top the list of priorities atm
Its being held up by the Feds, Jindal and Riley. LSU has yet to receive a single penny of the 5M promised and contract signed by BP
Posted on 6/23/10 at 5:22 pm to HeadSlash
quote:
cue the Oklahoma stampede on barry.
Billy's "frame" precludes any of the high flying stuff. I've got him figured as a brain-buster kind of guy.
In my mind I can see Thad Allen or one of the underlings from the Corps of Engineers giving a briefing about why they are having to wait for this and why that has been delayed and Billy standing next to them has his "I can't listen to any more of this shite" moment.
That's when the hammer is gonna drop and I don't get the impression that he cares who is there when it happens.
Posted on 6/23/10 at 9:00 pm to Cold Cous Cous
quote:
What have the scientists been saying about the berms? Honest question, because I haven't heard a single scientist weigh in one way or another. I know Nungesser supports it, but he isn't a scientist.
I've always been a bit leery of the berms -- this is not a minor undertaking and there's a possibility these things could lead to unintended consequences.
Rob Young is a professor of coastal ecology at Western Carolina University and director of the Program for the Study of Developed Shorelines
Rob Young
Rob Young: Scientifc American
Greg Stone: LSU - sand transport expert; direct of coastal studies
Legnthy but several professors and their view points
This post was edited on 6/23/10 at 9:02 pm
Posted on 6/23/10 at 9:03 pm to Mudminnow
LINK
More long-term harm than good?
State leaders are not consulting independent scientists about the plan or considering questions about its long-term effects on the coastal environment, says Gregory Stone, a professor of oceanography in the School of Coastal and Environmental Studies at Louisiana State University.
“The governor has not been open about sharing details,” said Professor Stone. “This is a mammoth engineering project, and it can be done, but it’s being done willy-nilly. It’s foolish to embark on a project of this scale without establishing potential negative impacts on currents, on coastal erosion, on wildlife habitat, on a whole range of environmental issues.”
The governor’s plan could be improved before implementation, says George Paul Kemp, vice president of the Audubon Society’s Louisiana Coastal Initiative and a former professor of coastal geology at LSU.
“A lot of it seems wishful, but that’s not to say that elements of the plan should not be moved on,” says Mr. Kemp, who met Monday in Venice, La., with EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson and a White House representative to discuss the federal response to the disaster.
Kemp says he and other ocean scientists are encouraging state and federal officials to focus efforts on the many tidal inlets and passes in the oil-affected areas. Kemp and Stone both said that boom can be effectively used to redirect oil toward existing barrier island beaches, preventing it from reaching inland wetlands.
Stone worries that if the state defies federal authorities on emergency dredging, federal funding for long-term rebuilding projects might not be available. Since hurricane Katrina, which nearly erased many barrier islands off the Louisiana coast, the state has tried to get funding to rebuild its eroded coastline. Sand that is available to permanently rebuild the beaches is limited, and emergency dredging could use those resources.
More long-term harm than good?
State leaders are not consulting independent scientists about the plan or considering questions about its long-term effects on the coastal environment, says Gregory Stone, a professor of oceanography in the School of Coastal and Environmental Studies at Louisiana State University.
“The governor has not been open about sharing details,” said Professor Stone. “This is a mammoth engineering project, and it can be done, but it’s being done willy-nilly. It’s foolish to embark on a project of this scale without establishing potential negative impacts on currents, on coastal erosion, on wildlife habitat, on a whole range of environmental issues.”
The governor’s plan could be improved before implementation, says George Paul Kemp, vice president of the Audubon Society’s Louisiana Coastal Initiative and a former professor of coastal geology at LSU.
“A lot of it seems wishful, but that’s not to say that elements of the plan should not be moved on,” says Mr. Kemp, who met Monday in Venice, La., with EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson and a White House representative to discuss the federal response to the disaster.
Kemp says he and other ocean scientists are encouraging state and federal officials to focus efforts on the many tidal inlets and passes in the oil-affected areas. Kemp and Stone both said that boom can be effectively used to redirect oil toward existing barrier island beaches, preventing it from reaching inland wetlands.
Stone worries that if the state defies federal authorities on emergency dredging, federal funding for long-term rebuilding projects might not be available. Since hurricane Katrina, which nearly erased many barrier islands off the Louisiana coast, the state has tried to get funding to rebuild its eroded coastline. Sand that is available to permanently rebuild the beaches is limited, and emergency dredging could use those resources.
Posted on 6/23/10 at 9:35 pm to Mudminnow
Thanks for the links, mud. Good stuff.
Posted on 6/24/10 at 8:07 am to wilceaux
Berm building beats the alternaive.
Posted on 6/24/10 at 8:41 am to TJG210
quote:
......is this real life or a Confederacy of Dunces? This whole episode makes GW's handling of Katrina look like a sparkling example of great leadership.
not even close. It is ridiculous. It does not make sense, but it does not paint a prettier picture of the former regimes disaster planning. I will also add one was a natural disaster not a man made one. I do agree it's frustrating waiting for the next bad decision to be made.
Posted on 6/24/10 at 12:05 pm to Mudminnow
Thanks mudminnow. This is the kind of attitude I don't like:
The old politican's fallacy--
1) We need to do something.
2) Building the berms is "something"
3) Therefore, we need to build the berms.
quote:
At stake, Mr. Nungesser said, are Louisiana’s seafood and sport-fishing industries. “If we don’t do something, shame on us,” he said.
The old politican's fallacy--
1) We need to do something.
2) Building the berms is "something"
3) Therefore, we need to build the berms.
Posted on 6/24/10 at 12:21 pm to Cold Cous Cous
Posted on 6/24/10 at 1:02 pm to mikeytig
quote:
Berm building beats the alternaive.
Short-sighted, dumb berm building does not.
I trust scientists that have studied these ecosystems their whole careers a hell of a lot more than people that have no clue what they are talking about (Nungesser and Jindal).
Posted on 6/24/10 at 1:18 pm to wilceaux
What has the worse long term, irreversible effect? Oil in the marsh grass root system or sand berms that can be torn down if need be? Build the berms, clean up the oil, remove the berms if they are causing damage. Stop the oil first. Pretty much a no brainer to me!!
Posted on 6/24/10 at 5:04 pm to Brouss
quote:
What has the worse long term, irreversible effect? Oil in the marsh grass root system or sand berms that can be torn down if need be? Build the berms, clean up the oil, remove the berms if they are causing damage. Stop the oil first. Pretty much a no brainer to me!!
This sounds as though it could have come straight from the mouth of Billy himself.
Posted on 6/26/10 at 12:49 am to Mudminnow
talking with mud tonight, he makes a good point against building the berms. good info he provided.
Posted on 6/26/10 at 1:24 am to sheek
yeah, I'm also gonna give mud credit. He made some excellent points. Although I still think they should build the berms. 
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