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re: .
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:00 pm to Tuscaloosa
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:00 pm to Tuscaloosa
They've said repeatedly it was an annual eval. People don't understand training versus operational sorties. Training usually just means flying for proficiency not necessarily instruction and unless Army does it different no formal instruction occurs on a check ride.
The sortie would be logged/accounted for as an operational sortie if they were hauling passengers, equipment or accomplishing other tasking. Otherwise it gets logged as "training sortie" most of which are just logging currency and accruing hrs/experience.
Then there are upgrade, initial qualification, requal, recurrency, additional training for eval downgrades etc... But in a line squadron those would be the exception.
The sortie would be logged/accounted for as an operational sortie if they were hauling passengers, equipment or accomplishing other tasking. Otherwise it gets logged as "training sortie" most of which are just logging currency and accruing hrs/experience.
Then there are upgrade, initial qualification, requal, recurrency, additional training for eval downgrades etc... But in a line squadron those would be the exception.
2
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:02 pm to TorchtheFlyingTiger
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:04 pm to WeeWee
quote:
A temporary pause
Relax man. Its called a safety stand down trust me no Army Aviation is flying in that area
quote:
The military does have to train its pilots to fly in congested skies at night
Absolutely. As mentioned above the nature and type of training will tell a lot.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:04 pm to TorchtheFlyingTiger
It did turn, maybe 5-10 degrees to the right.. those dots are its history and shows a slight change in direction.. to me it looks like the Blackhawk did have the regional jet in sight. So they turned a little right to get some additional room, they failed to realize where the runaway was and that the regional jet would also be turning left right into their path. They then either lost visual on it or it was to late once they realized the jet was turning
Obviously speculation and we won’t know until the ntsb release there initial report. I don’t know shite about dca airspace and especially don’t know anything about the helicopter procedures in that area.
Obviously speculation and we won’t know until the ntsb release there initial report. I don’t know shite about dca airspace and especially don’t know anything about the helicopter procedures in that area.
This post was edited on 1/30/25 at 9:07 pm
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:07 pm to gaetti15
quote:You can probably simulate that pretty effectively with drones and computers. Heck, fly around NJ with all the drones...
Idk id like my military pilots to know how to handle densely trafficked areas at night time.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:07 pm to TorchtheFlyingTiger
quote:
Then there are upgrade, initial qualification, requal, recurrency, additional training for eval downgrades etc....
This has to be it right? Instructor Pilots dont ride around for fun.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:08 pm to Lakeboy7
quote:
No. And thats what I want to see. But, and I'm not sure how it got out, there was a leak that there were night vision devices on the aircraft. If they were doing night vision training with devices in that clusterfrick the Army is going to have to step up and own this.
The Army has already begun a AR 15-6 Investigation which is the standard investigation tool, I would suspect the Investigating Officer is at least an 06 and a pilot. NTSB will also conduct a separate investigation.
The data is available in both aircraft this shouldnt take long to find a cause.
That would make alot of sense.
Based on what i know from training, this is in all likely a combo of pilot error and ATC. Although I would lean more pilot error because they confirmed visual. And they were in VFR. I can see why the ATC should have had a more serious response when CA popped up.
But without everything in front of me i couldn't place a percentage error split. Maybe 70/30 pilot error
This post was edited on 1/30/25 at 9:09 pm
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:08 pm to mmcgrath
quote:
You can probably simulate that pretty effectively with drones and computers. Heck, fly around NJ with all the drones...
You are an idiot but it was funny
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:09 pm to gaetti15
quote:
You can only simulate so much before you have to experience these things in real life.
This is an insane take. They don't belong near a congested commercial airport runway. 67 people died bc of our stupidity in having this be a thing.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:10 pm to Lakeboy7
quote:
Sec Def said it was Annual Training, so its safe to assume the pilot doing the training and the Instructor Pilot (maybe) are reservist
Yeah reservists aren’t flying gold tops.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:11 pm to nola tiger lsu
quote:
This is an insane take. They don't belong near a congested commercial airport runway. 67 people died bc of our stupidity in having this be a thing.
Ok so how do these pilots contain the skill to navigate densely trafficked areas in night time conditions?
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:17 pm to gaetti15
quote:
Ok so how do these pilots contain the skill to navigate densely trafficked areas in night time conditions?
Answer: I'd rather them experience it in a controlled environment...which if done properly and fully staffed would be perfect for ATC near a busy airport and military installation.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:17 pm to gaetti15
Same way we trained for the upper end reactor casualties on a submarine. Training simulators. We weren’t going to risk running a feed line rupture drill resulting in a reactor meltdown on a 1 billion dollar sub. Same can and is done for pilots. If a simulator isn’t good enough, you engineer a better one. 67 people are dead because the army fricked this up.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:18 pm to Who_Dat_Tiger
quote:
it wasn’t… clearly stated it was the craziest I saw. I thought that’s what this site was for, sharing wild off the wall shite?
Baw you know 80% of the posters on this site have an extra chromosome and doesn’t possess reading comprehension skills.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:18 pm to gaetti15
quote:
Ok so how do these pilots contain the skill to navigate densely trafficked areas in night time conditions?
Not by putting innocent lives in danger, you have to simulate or have multiple military aircraft exercises, not playing around innocent lives. It's such a basic concept.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:18 pm to TheGasMan
quote:
Same way we trained for the upper end reactor casualties on a submarine. Training simulators. We weren’t going to risk running a feed line rupture drill resulting in a reactor meltdown on a 1 billion dollar sub. Same can and is done for pilots. If a simulator isn’t good enough, you engineer a better one. 67 people are dead because the army fricked this up.
Once again don't get me started on shaming the army....as I am a Navy guy
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:19 pm to jcaz
quote:
Yeah reservists aren’t flying gold tops.
Can still be good pilots, just dont do it everyday.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:19 pm to nola tiger lsu
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:21 pm to gaetti15
With the communication tools available in 2025 I seriously doubt Gold Top PAT flights ever save any American lives. Last night it cost 67 lives though.
Posted on 1/30/25 at 9:21 pm to 257WBY
Maybe you know.
Wouldn't the glide slope for a runway be a big absolutely not no fly zone for anything except landing aircraft?
Seems the airplane on approach would be totally helpless to do anything due to low airspeed and low power. Why would any helo ever be anywhere near that approach area
Wouldn't the glide slope for a runway be a big absolutely not no fly zone for anything except landing aircraft?
Seems the airplane on approach would be totally helpless to do anything due to low airspeed and low power. Why would any helo ever be anywhere near that approach area
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