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re: Today is the 157th anniversary of one of the worst defeats in U.S. military history

Posted on 12/13/19 at 3:44 pm to
Posted by DemonKA3268
Parts Unknown
Member since Oct 2015
21240 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 3:44 pm to
quote:

a bunch of pussies on the Poli Board.


And here you are, how convenient

Posted by geauxbrown
Louisiana
Member since Oct 2006
28003 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 3:48 pm to
Yea, Jackson wasn’t the man you wanted to try and flank.
Posted by Mahootney
Lovin' My German Footprint
Member since Sep 2008
12179 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 3:49 pm to
Like Alabama, the only one that can beat us is ourselves.
Posted by RollTide1987
Baltimore, MD
Member since Nov 2009
71722 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 4:38 pm to
quote:

Jackson wasn’t the man you wanted to try and flank.


It almost worked though. A single Union division made the assault into Jackson's line and threatened to cut his position in two if properly reinforced. Despite having another division in support, Meade was left entirely to his own devices inside Jackson's lines before he was forced to fall back due to overwhelming pressure. Had he been supported by the tens of thousands of reserve troops within shouting distance....who knows?

At the end of the day, the Battle of Fredericksburg was mishandled by incompetent Union leadership at the highest echelons of command. Burnside just might be the worst general in the history of the U.S. Army. Funny thing is, if he were alive today, he might actually agree with that sentiment. No one doubted Burnside's abilities more vigorously than Burnside himself.
Posted by windshieldman
Member since Nov 2012
12818 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:11 pm to
quote:

Burnside just might be the worst general in the history of the U.S. Army.


I don’t understand why they even had him with such high command to begin with. Thank you for all the Civil War topics, they are fun to read.
Posted by CarrolltonTiger
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
50291 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:18 pm to

quote:

Glad America turned it around under Grant/Sherman and won that war...aren't you?


Cleveland, Detroit, Newark,Chicago, etc, probably aren’t but I’m glad the South didn’t get stuck with all the obsolete agrarian workers.
Posted by deltaland
Member since Mar 2011
103867 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:30 pm to
quote:

It is well that war is so terrible, for we should grow too fond of it."


This is true. One of the main reasons our Govt is allowed to get involved today in so many conflicts is because the loss of American lives are pretty minimal.

If it was still like WW2 with hundreds or thousands reported daily we wouldn’t do that shite
Posted by Roll Tide Ravens
Birmingham, AL
Member since Nov 2015
51956 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:33 pm to
Burnside and his sideburns completely failed. It’s amazing how inept the Generals leading the Army of the Potomac were until Grant arrived (though Meade technically was still the head of the Army of the Potomac under Grant who was general-in-Chief of the Union armies).

Fun facts: Ambrose Burnside’s facial hair is where the term “sideburns“ comes from. He was also the first president of the National Rifle Association.
This post was edited on 12/13/19 at 5:35 pm
Posted by windshieldman
Member since Nov 2012
12818 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:36 pm to
quote:

Fun facts: Ambrose Burnside’s facial hair is where the term “sideburns“ comes from.


Interesting, I absolutely did not know that. He had some nice ones


This post was edited on 12/13/19 at 5:38 pm
Posted by FightinTigersDammit
Louisiana North
Member since Mar 2006
46425 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 5:49 pm to
quote:

Fun facts: Ambrose Burnside’s facial hair is where the term “sideburns“ comes from. He was also the first president of the National Rifle Association.


More fun facts: The camp followers of Joe Hooker's army were called "Hooker's girls", later shortened to "hookers".
Posted by RollTide1987
Baltimore, MD
Member since Nov 2009
71722 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 7:40 pm to
quote:

I don’t understand why they even had him with such high command to begin with.


He had success in command of smaller units on the North Carolina coast in late-1861/early-1862. In that period of the war, the smallest of victories could make you nationally famous and the next best hope to end the war. He was also a very likable guy. He smiled easily and remembered everyone's name. He was just a shitty field general.

The famed Civil War historian Bruce Catton probably said it best:

quote:

Burnside had repeatedly demonstrated that it had been a military tragedy to give him a rank higher than colonel. One reason might have been that, with all his deficiencies, Burnside never had any angles of his own to play; he was a simple, honest, loyal soldier, doing his best even if that best was not very good, never scheming or conniving or backbiting. Also, he was modest; in an army many of whose generals were insufferable prima donnas, Burnside never mistook himself for Napoleon.
This post was edited on 12/13/19 at 7:44 pm
Posted by windshieldman
Member since Nov 2012
12818 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 7:45 pm to
Sounds like he was a good man though.
Posted by TigerJeff
the Emerald Coast
Member since Oct 2006
16356 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 7:47 pm to
Outstanding.
Posted by elprez00
Hammond, LA
Member since Sep 2011
31624 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 7:56 pm to
If Jackson is alive at Gettysburg the battle likely goes very differently. Jackson was an excellent battlefield commander
Posted by Langland
Trumplandia
Member since Apr 2014
15382 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 8:01 pm to
Could you sum this up with one sentence and fewer than thirty words?
Posted by Jester
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
34717 posts
Posted on 12/13/19 at 8:07 pm to
I love how people who glorify the confederacy are the same people who get offended when anyone does anything that they believe disrespects the United States of America. I wonder what Alanis Morissette thinks about it.
Posted by RollTide1987
Baltimore, MD
Member since Nov 2009
71722 posts
Posted on 12/14/19 at 7:46 am to
quote:

If Jackson is alive at Gettysburg the battle likely goes very differently.


The battle doesn't happen if Jackson is alive.

quote:

Jackson was an excellent battlefield commander


We'll agree to disagree on that. He was definitely a competent tactician but I wouldn't call him excellent by any stretch of the imagination. His biggest strengths lay in the art of maneuver and manipulation of force. His actual tactical abilities are overrated.
This post was edited on 12/14/19 at 7:48 am
Posted by windshieldman
Member since Nov 2012
12818 posts
Posted on 12/14/19 at 1:54 pm to
quote:

The battle doesn't happen if Jackson is alive.


I agree with this, some of the others under Lee tried to talk him out of it, but he more than likely would have listened to Jackson. I'm not sure if that's your reasoning why it wouldn't have happened. Just seemed like Gettysburg was a disaster waiting to happen no matter the strategy.
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