re: Sitting outside at times like this, I think of the soldiers in WW1...

Seems the only way to cope with that terror is to convince yourself that you are already dead.

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Yes, but it won’t be the same kind of war we saw a century ago.

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I absolutely agree

But I took OMLandsharks comments to mean that we (as in society today) wouldn’t put up with the horrors of war... we would just walk away

I’m not sure there really is a choice. There is an aggressor (In my example that could be radicalized Muslims who are fighting for an afterlife) and the defenders (who are fighting to survive). I fail to see how people would walk away from that situation at a higher rate than WWI because of what we know today. Once you set those parameters the war can get as ugly and brutal as it wants, surrender is unlikely.

We like to look at the total numbers of lives lost after the fact and say what a waste.

But, In the moment, generals believe the next battle will be the one that turns the tide for their side. And to surrender would mean all the previous lives were lost in vain. With that mentality it’s not hard to see how things can continue on.

Those aspects of human nature have not changed

The Sonic Slush Salient

They probably just downvoted because it’s a little bit of a read.

That’s why I broke it up with pictures, to illustrate the conditions those men lived and died in far more poingnantly than my words ever could.

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Vietnam was paradise compared to WWI. I am absolutely proposing that the Boomers would not have put up with WWI and do exactly as I am saying.

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LOL....As a millennial, you wouldn't know Paradise if it fell on you. All I ever hear from your generation is whining. You can't judge the Boomers or say what they would or would not have put up with. That's because your idea of hell is when you don't have cell phone service.

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I feel sure that any generation the Boomers on would have killed their superior officers and ran for it in such conditions

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the French army literally did this during ww1

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WaWaWeeWa

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OMLandshark

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Both your arguments are valid from my point of view. It’s true, human nature hasn’t changed since WWI, what has is the technology that is used not only in war but to get the citizenry information. They brought Vietnam into your living room. That changed things on a scale that is hard to quantify.

Sure, if emotions or pride or anger or whatever it is that causes humans to kill each other on such a massive scale were to reach the fever pitch it did during the Battle of the Frontier in the outset of the First World War; if that happened today, it would be a very short war. They had censures back then and the only way to get information was to either be in the battles or by reading the newspaper everyday. Even though, they wouldn’t have gotten a lot of information from the newspapers because of the amount of censuring that was going on.

We have 24/7 news coverage and can reach the other side of the world at the mere click of a button via the internet today. The soldiers fighting could fight that style of war because they’re soldiers. “Ours not to reason why, ours but to do and die.” But as soon as the scenes started rolling into living rooms on Fox News or CNN or World News Tonight, there would be outrage from the citizenry and the war wouldn’t last long at all.

I understand that, but the “Old Contemptibles” of the BEF were pretty much the only people going into the war who had fought in anything before the war. The British, for the most part, had a professional military, albeit small. But they fought probably better than anybody at the outset of the war because they were hardened professionals, they just didn’t have the numbers.

But I do think there’s something to be said in regards to how quickly the nations got their war machines going. Hell, the Schlieffen (sp?) Plan revolves around knocking the French out before the Russians could mobilize and the Russians surprised everybody with how quickly they got to East Germany.

Fr33 I'm bookmarking this one for your next reinstatement plea.

Well done, buddy.

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What are your thoughts?

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Well, from an American standpoint, I’m pretty glad the war turned out the way it did, it moved world trade here and made us the biggest financial power in the world all while we lost (relatively) few men.

But from a European standpoint and stretching to the Middle East, I think it would’ve been better had the Germans won in quick succession. There is much to be said about the saying “the only way to make war humane is to make it short”. And had the Germans defeated the French before the British could get in the war with their citizens and colonies, then turned to Russia, obviously an entire generation of Europeans don’t have to suffer for it.

I can’t say heads or tails on the WWII not happening. I think had the French been defeated it stands to reason that maybe one of their men in the conflict form the mindset of Hitler.

I also don’t think the Czar lasts either way, Russia just put down a revolution barely a decade prior to the conflict and its people hated the Czarist regime. I’m not saying that they would turn to Communism, maybe they would’ve anyway. It’s hard to kill an idea. I do not, however, think Lenin ever makes it back to Russia. I wonder often how much different things would’ve been had Trotsky taken control and not Lenin.

But yes, as a whole, I think Europe would’ve been better off if the Germans had won. World War One ended the golden age of European culture. They will never get back to the heights they were at in 1913.

Hell, it stands to reason that the Japanese wouldn’t have had the nuts to bomb Pearl Harbor had the Germans won the war. I know that’s a little off topic but it goes to show how influencial the war was on a worldwide level.