re: Should There Be A Difference in Punishment for Murder and Attempted Murder?

To get all the way back to the OP, my first post, which has apparently garnered quite a bit of ire, was intended to figure out whether OP actually meant the very vague "difference in outcome" language, or whether they were arguing for something a bit more precise, like that an attempt to commit a specific intent crime should carry the same penalty as successfully committing the same specific intent crime.

Now, I still disagree with the OP regardless, but those are two very different arguments.

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People are charged with attempted murder for planning it but not actually doing anything? Wouldn’t that be conspiracy to commit murder?

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I always thought "conspiracy" merely meant the involvement of more than one person. If a person plans to kill his wife, he gets charged with murder only. If he involves a friend, they both get charged with murder AND conspiracy to commit murder. I could be wrong though.

Conspiracy:

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§26. Criminal conspiracy
A. Criminal conspiracy is the agreement or combination of two or more persons for the specific purpose of committing any crime; provided that an agreement or combination to commit a crime shall not amount to a criminal conspiracy unless, in addition to such agreement or combination, one or more of such parties does an act in furtherance of the object of the agreement or combination.
B. If the intended basic crime has been consummated, the conspirators may be tried for either the conspiracy or the completed offense, and a conviction for one shall not bar prosecution for the other.
C. Whoever is a party to a criminal conspiracy to commit any crime shall be fined or imprisoned, or both, in the same manner as for the offense contemplated by the conspirators; provided, however, whoever is a party to a criminal conspiracy to commit a crime punishable by death or life imprisonment shall be imprisoned at hard labor for not more than thirty years.
D. Whoever is a party to a criminal conspiracy to commit any other crime shall be fined or imprisoned, or both, in the same manner as for the offense contemplated by the conspirators; but such fine or imprisonment shall not exceed one-half of the largest fine, or one-half the longest term of imprisonment prescribed for such offense, or both.

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keakar

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lol

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To get all the way back to the OP, my first post, which has apparently garnered quite a bit of ire, was intended to figure out whether OP actually meant the very vague "difference in outcome" language, or whether they were arguing for something a bit more precise, like that an attempt to commit a specific intent crime should carry the same penalty as successfully committing the same specific intent crime.

Now, I still disagree with the OP regardless, but those are two very different arguments.

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This is not a courtroom. I didnt prepare my statement for all the legal technicalities.

If man 1 and man 2, in unrelated incidents, both go through the same planning and execution of killing their respective wives, but wife of man 2 survives. Why should the punishment of man 2 be less severe because his wife lived?

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Should There Be A Difference in Punishment for Murder and Attempted Murder?

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I've always said the sentence should be the same.

Process vs results...always take process

Both situations were exactly the same, the perp has the intent to kill someone. That's all that is needed. Whether he succeeded shouldn't have relevance to a sentence IMO.

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see the point you are trying to make but you are talking about homicide. I am talking about the charges murder vs attempted murder only.

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It was an extreme example but the point is the same. There has to be a difference, other wise how far down the rabbit hole do you go? It has to work both ways.

Get in a fight and you are the aggressor. Punch someone and they fall awkwardly and die. You could be charged for murder. In your scenario, you can be charged for murder if he doesn’t die. And even a step further, even if you swing and miss why wouldn’t it still be murder? The intent is the same and outcome doesn’t matter, right?

How do you separate shooting and missing, swinging a bat and missing, slashing with a knife and missing, or throwing a punch and missing?

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So would you limit this to attempted murder, or other specific intent crimes as well?

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For the sake of discussion, 1st degree murder and attempted 1st degree murder.

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I'm arguing that once the there has been a conviction for either murder or attempted murder should there be a difference in punishment.

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Yes. To your question...



BUT....


Lets talk about 1st degree murder and life in prison, or execution......

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Why?

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Its easy.. IF you kill someone and are proven guilty, you pay the price. If the victum does not die then it means you got very lucky. BUT should spend at least 25 years in prison.... Lets say you are a 25 year old punk that shoots someone but does not kill them... Give that person 25 years and he wont be the same when he gets out.....