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re: New York police: The press is vilifying us. Stop treating us like animals.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 3:46 pm to 62Tigerfan
Posted on 6/9/20 at 3:46 pm to 62Tigerfan
quote:I don’t think there are a whole lot of independently wealthy street cops out there
Sounds like a good idea, but how many people can just quit their jobs on the spot?
2
Posted on 6/9/20 at 3:50 pm to GreatLakesTiger24
Time for a Blue Strike..let New York find out what its like without them.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 3:59 pm to BayouBlitz
quote:
BayouBlitz
He should knell on your neck
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:04 pm to tetracarbon
quote:Stop shooting unarmed people 41 times the way you did Amadou Diallo.
Stop treating us like animals.
Stop initiating confrontations with unarmed people and then killing them the way you did Patrick Dorismond.
Stop dressing up like postal workers, drawing your guns, and then shooting innocent men who run away from what seems to be a random person pulling a gun on them in the back like you did to Ousmane Zongo.
Stop sodomizing people with broken broom handles in precinct bathrooms, as you did to Abner Louima.
Stop kidnapping, robbing and torturing drug suspects the way officer Jorge Arbaje-Diaz did.
Stop lying about suspects "attacking officers" and falsely claiming in court that there was no video footage of the event showing that you were the aggressors, as you did in the case of Michael Premo.
And the NYPD claims the press is treating them like animals by trying to hold them accountable for their own misconduct? What a joke.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:14 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:
And the NYPD claims the press is treating them like animals by trying to hold them accountable for their own misconduct? What a joke.
You do understand that there are criminals in all walks of life, including the police force?
That's what the justice system is for, to punish those offenders.
A few bad cops out of millions doesn't (and shouldn't) make all cops bad.
You are being stereotypical, which is wrong.
It works both ways.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:17 pm to tetracarbon
quote:
New York police boss Mike O'Meara
Suddenly Unions are awesome again.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:23 pm to tetracarbon
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:34 pm to tetracarbon
The problem is more than "yeah, a few bad apples have murdered and raped innocent people over the years but whaddya gonna do?"
The real problem, one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences due to qualified immunity, a buddy-buddy relationship with the same DA's who would be prosecuting them, and a culture of covering up and lying to protect one another. There will always be bad police. Things will be better when they are reliably called to face justice instead of defended and hidden by their peers.
The real problem, one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences due to qualified immunity, a buddy-buddy relationship with the same DA's who would be prosecuting them, and a culture of covering up and lying to protect one another. There will always be bad police. Things will be better when they are reliably called to face justice instead of defended and hidden by their peers.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:36 pm to tetracarbon
They should quit.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:40 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:
one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences
I disagree with you there.
And if that's one of the main points of concern, it should be discussed openly in a civil discourse.
Throwing chairs through windows and looting TVs doesn't help that cause at all.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:47 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:I hear this a lot, and I mean a fricking lot, but I haven't really seen solid evidence that cops are getting off light consistently for frick ups. I'm open to some stats, solid evidence of a pattern, etc. if someone actually has it.
The real problem, one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences due to qualified immunity, a buddy-buddy relationship with the same DA's who would be prosecuting them
For the record, I am heavily against out of control police, but I try to avoid arguing points without solid evidence of a consistent pattern of the problem.
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 4:53 pm
Posted on 6/9/20 at 4:51 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:
The real problem, one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences due to qualified immunity, a buddy-buddy relationship with the same DA's who would be prosecuting them, and a culture of covering up and lying to protect one another. There will always be bad police. Things will be better when they are reliably called to face justice instead of defended and hidden by their peers.
Sounds like you're a fan of busting up public employee unions.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:00 pm to tetracarbon
quote:Activists have been doing that, for a very long time. Years and even decades of community meetings, marches, letters to the editor, working through the courts, and every other peaceful means you can think of haven't solved the issue. The fact that you don't even realize that these things happened should tell you something about how effective they were.
And if that's one of the main points of concern, it should be discussed openly in a civil discourse
Like you, I also condemn the people who have taken advantage of the situation to loot and rob. Their actions are wrong in and of themselves, and counterproductive to the efforts of the much, much larger group of people who are still peaceful in the face of police violence.
The actions of those people don't mean that police abuses of power never happened and aren't happening right now. We can ignore them if we want, but they aren't going away on their own.
We need to stop viewing the situation as "Police beat and murdered innocent people, but some criminals robbed stores during the protests" and begin viewing it as "Criminals robbed stores during the protests, but police beat and murdered innocent people."
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 5:37 pm
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:16 pm to Kodar
quote:This is a very reasonable attitude.
I hear this a lot, and I mean a fricking lot, but I haven't really seen solid evidence that cops are getting off light consistently for frick ups.
My suggestions:
1. Investigate the cases I mentioned in my above post, all of which deal with the NYPD.
2. Consider the fact that the officer who killed George Floyd already had at least seventeen complaints against him.
3. Read about how Bob Kroll, the Minneapolis Police union head directly stated that officers did not investigate a burglary as a way of retaliating against a former officer who exposed corruption and has gone around orders from the mayor to conduct training on escalating force that was banned by his city. (I apologize for linking to reddit, but I can't find a screenshot elsewhere.)
4. Examine the long history of abuses by the Minneapolis police, which have persisted after years of incremental reforms and civilian oversight boards.
5. Learn about the "Blue Wall of Silence" and how police work to actively keep abusive cops on the force.
Please let me know if you need anything else. If you want more evidence before you decide that police often break the law and get away with it, believe me, it's out there.
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 5:48 pm
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:17 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:
4. Learn about the "Blue Wall of Silence"
aka, the police union.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:20 pm to Chuck Barris
quote:
The real problem, one of the main problems that the protests are trying to address, is that police officers are often able to do those things with no consequences due to qualified immunity
Qualified immunity is there to allow police to do their jobs and not get hammered if they make a mistake, because contrary to popular belief, police will make mistakes. There is no way around it and the fact that people think they shouldn’t is ridiculous.
Are people going to get hurt? Yes.
Are people going to be killed? Unfortunately, yes.
shite happens. Somebody will make a sudden movement in a dark lit area and get shot to only later find out they were grabbing a cell phone. You can’t legislate out of that unless you make police just glorified report Writers that never go after and/or catch anybody.
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 5:21 pm
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:23 pm to tetracarbon
quote:
"Stop treating us like animals and thugs and start treating us with some respect
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:23 pm to tetracarbon
"People are mean to us in the news" isn't serious and they're up there throwing tantrums, presumably because they can't take it out on some unarmed homeless guy or their wives.
The NYPD was also a consistent outlier during the protests in being exceptionally aggressive and violent.
The NYPD was also a consistent outlier during the protests in being exceptionally aggressive and violent.
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 5:25 pm
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:27 pm to Kodar
Also, take look at this report from Human Rights Watch, which covered exactly the same issues of unaccountability, brutality and silence that people are protesting today over twenty years ago.
Posted on 6/9/20 at 5:36 pm to brass2mouth
quote:Everyone already agrees that police are just human beings, and will make honest mistakes from time to time.
Qualified immunity is there to allow police to do their jobs and not get hammered if they make a mistake, because contrary to popular belief, police will make mistakes.
The problem with the way qualified immunity often works in practice is that it allows officers to make reckless, entirely avoidable, and often fatal decisions that go against their own training and then write off those actions as just "mistakes."
There is a middle ground to be found between holding officers criminally responsible for errors anyone could make and writing off an innocent man being shot 41 times with "Well, shite happens."
This post was edited on 6/9/20 at 5:39 pm
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