re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

quote:

---

most of this thread disagrees with me.

---

there ya go.

I'd like to get back to some more of the remarks that UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace made today in the House of Commons:

quote:

---

Mr Speaker, we will be the first country to donate Western main battle tanks. And, we will be bringing a further squadron of our own Challenger tanks to higher readiness in place of the squadron sent.

Even as we gift Challenger 2 Tanks, I shall, at the same time, be reviewing the number of Challenger 3 conversions to consider whether the lessons of Ukraine suggest that we need a larger tank fleet.

We will also build on the Army’s modernisation programme – at pace. Specifically on artillery, I am accelerating our Mobile Fires Programme. So instead of delivering in the 2030s it will do this earlier this decade. I have also directed that, subject to commercial negotiation, an interim artillery capability is to be delivered.

After discussion with the United States and our European allies it is hoped that the example set by the French and us will allow those countries holding Leopard tanks to donate as well. I know there are a number of countries wanting to do the same. No-one is going it alone, as I have said.

---

quote:

---

Doubling down on the success of our basic training of Ukrainian military in 2022 in the United Kingdom, we are also now increasing this number this year to a further 20,000. Canada, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, Lithuania, Norway, New Zealand, the Netherlands have already joined this effort and I’m pleased to say we are now going to be joined by a group of Australian military to train in this country as well. Leaving their summer to join our winter.

---

A few thoughts:

1) Britain's Challenger 3 conversions are going to be expensive. And, if "the lessons of Ukraine suggest that we need a larger tank fleet," then the only place to get those is from the United States. And if the UK is going to field Abrams tanks, then it's possible to see them ultimately sending more Challengers to Ukraine.

2) Wallace said that "a number" of allies want to donate Leopard tanks to Ukraine. That would support Kubela's assertion that five countries have told him that they wish to donate. There is still time to organize a total commitment of 150 tanks for Ramstein. The fact that the UK's package announced today was so impressive will put pressure on other allies to do the same.

3) Another 20,000 new Ukrainian troops going through a thorough and proper basic training in the UK really pays off in the long run. Unlike Russian mobiks who get rushed to the front with no training, Ukrainian soldiers will continue to fight like professionals.

Needs to be deported to PT and the proper long thread brought back

quote:

---

Ppl who never served

---

This shows how out of touch you are.

quote:

---

Are we legally obligated to protect Taiwan by treaty? And besides, countering China is much more important than defending a bunch of spoiled white people in Europe who would rather than entitlements over being to defend themselves against a 2-bit army like Russia.

---

It's a lot more than Taiwan and has been since 1941. At sea, Pax Britannia was replaced by Pax Americana. Chaos in the sea lanes means at a minimum temporary high inflation as goods/services go up to a price to be sustainable for providers if just in the USA. Bitching and moaning about present inflation is more about everything being so completely inexpensive for half a century, including gasoline, adjusted for inflation.

You can forget a lot of restaurants having customers able to afford them more than once a week, back when eating Burger Chef (no BK or Mickey D around my neck of the woods) was a special expensive treat for kids at most once a week. Growing up in a family of above average income, we were able to eat out once a week at Mexican restaurant in the 50's and 60's. This when Europe was dependent on petrochemicals, plastics, crude oil and refined products from the USA. Everywhere else in the world was really really backwards.

Younger generations really don't have a grasp of history.

So now you are moving the goal posts, because many of the posters that drive this thread are indeed vets, and this..

quote:

---

This thread is hilarious. Ppl who never served or wouldn’t join control this thread

---

..has nothing to do with this..

quote:

---

I didn’t name specific users, but I’d assume most combat veterans, like myself, are tired of this war and do not support it.

---

Umm if ppl haven’t been in combat they don’t need to be searching the web and thinking their opinion is strong on this war.

Also if one served they should know Ukraine isn’t going to win this and this is bringing our country down. Along with the propaganda and factors in this war.

I’ll stick with my argument that combat veterans have a lot different thoughts than someone who never deployed to a combat zone.

Some interesting news in this Washington Post article about the advanced training that's beginning in Germany to equip Ukrainians in combined arms operations. Here are some key excerpts:

quote:

---

GRAFENWOEHR TRAINING AREA, Germany — The Pentagon’s top general on Monday visited two sites in Germany used by the U.S. military to enhance the fighting skills of their Ukrainian counterparts, offering encouragement to those on the training field and directing the American soldiers instructing them to squeeze as much as possible into the newly established program before the Ukrainians return to war.

---

quote:

---

The general’s visit marked his first trip to this facility in the muddy Bavarian countryside since Russia’s invasion of Ukraine nearly a year ago. The base, covering roughly 90 square miles, began hosting Ukrainian forces in 2014, when Russia annexed Ukraine’s Crimean peninsula. It’s now the site of a newly expanded regimen for the Ukrainian military, which sent a battalion of more than 600 soldiers to spend up to six weeks learning how to layer tanks, artillery and other weapons to maximize their effects ahead of an expected counteroffensive against Russian forces entrenched on Ukraine territory.

---

quote:

---

Milley also visited another Army headquarters in Wiesbaden, west of Frankfurt, where a planning conference with Ukrainian military officials was underway. Journalists were not allowed to observe the meeting, and details about it were not disclosed.

The general’s travels in Germany came as senior civilian officials with the Biden administration visited Kyiv itself. Wendy Sherman, the deputy secretary of state; Colin Kahl, the undersecretary of defense for policy; and Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser, met with President Volodymyr Zelensky and other senior Ukrainian officials.

The Ukrainian soldiers began arriving at Grafenwoehr late last week and commenced their training on Sunday. Milley observed them on a marksmanship range and familiarizing themselves with U.S.-provided Bradley infantry fighting vehicles

---

quote:

---

Milley is expected to spend the week in Europe, also visiting an installation used as a way station to move weapons into Ukraine and meeting with senior allied military officials. On Friday, he will join Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin at Ramstein Air Base in Germany for the latest meeting of the Ukraine Contact Group

---

I would love to have been a fly on the wall at the planning conference, as Ukraine works out the execution of its upcoming offensives.

quote:

---

We’re discussing policy that is directly related to the war in Ukraine. A discussion which stemmed originally from the amount of aid the US and other countries or giving to Ukraine.

---

That is politics baw and it is not supposed to be on this board per chicken's edict last month.