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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:23 pm to StormyMcMan
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:23 pm to StormyMcMan
Not Ukraine/Russia related but the tensions over the Kosovo new ID/license plate law is boiling over again. The Serbs of Kosovo are withdrawing from government institutions in Kosovo.
quote:
@Faytuks Serbs in Kosovo withdraw from all political institutions including the, assembly, the government, the judiciary, the police and the administrative staff in the four municipalities in the north" -
Serbian members of the Kosovo police force are taking off their uniforms
All Serbian MPs are submitting their resignation to the Kosovo Parliament - Blic
"This is serbia" flags raised in northern Kosovo by local serbs
quote:
@Faytuks · 1h Russian media has jumped on the situation in Kosovo, with Readovka claiming that "Kosovar police officers are required to report to the service and arm themselves within an hour"
2
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:26 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
They do need to negotiate and to me a solution is Russia retreat back to their country and they not getting any Ukraine territory
I think you just hit the nail on the head for what I was saying. Why would Russia accept this?
The huge issue I see is that they legitimatly annexed the territory, from Russias point of view anyway, and would give it up for a promise of NATO staying away? I don't see that happening short of a coup in Russia.
But let me know if you are seeing something I'm missing.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:26 pm to Burhead
Good idea for a separate topic
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:27 pm to WDE24
quote:
Putin has, as he always had, an off-ramp back to Russia. That you propose that in sincerity is why I asked the question.
That is naive to think Russia just packing it in and saying my bad is an offramp. Here is a fact no matter how long Ukraine can hold Russia off all it will take is one nuke and Ukraine is done. Russia has to feel like they won some things for them to reel it in otherwise they are to far in to pull out now. Negotiations are a give and take not saying Russia deserves anything but you have to let them try and save face.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:33 pm to StormyMcMan
quote:
think you just hit the nail on the head for what I was saying. Why would Russia accept this?
You have to try another route. Putin constantly spoke about NATO at his front door so call his bluff and agree to that. Will it work I don't know but you cannot use tunnel vision or you will fail. Denying any chance leaves Putin with few options now that he is knee deep in this. He can back out with nothing, which is ego nor Russia's will allow, or he can use a nuke which ends Ukraine and starts ww3... maybe. So do you try different solutions and be willing to give Russia something or ignore negotiation and most likely all of end up in war?
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:33 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
If Ukraine didn't have our military support and weapons it would have been over months ago.
Most of NATO has American weapons but the Ukrainians would kick their arse because they have a trained military with 1,000,000 + troops and battle experience.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:34 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
That is naive to think Russia just packing it in and saying my bad is an offramp. Here is a fact no matter how long Ukraine can hold Russia off all it will take is one nuke and Ukraine is done. Russia has to feel like they won some things for them to reel it in otherwise they are to far in to pull out now. Negotiations are a give and take not saying Russia deserves anything but you have to let them try and save face.
If Ukraine wants to go that path, more power to them. But I don't think it would be appropriate, at all, to try to pressure them into that. Because at which point world powers pressure tiny countries into giving into a belligerent that invaded them, just because that belligerent is a nuclear power, we can just drop all pretense of there being rules and norms within the international community. The world basically becomes a race between the US and China as to who can gobble up land quicker.
In short, Russia deserves absolutely fricking nothing. And if Ukraine wants to keep punching Russia in the mouth, I'm not going to be the one to tell them to stop.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:39 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
Ukraine wants to go that path, more power to them. But I don't think it would be appropriate, at all, to try to
It would be inappropriate to the Ukraine people to not try it. We won't continue to give billions in support for eternity. What happens when that ends and the Ukrainian people are left to their selves.
This post was edited on 11/5/22 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:40 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
Putin constantly spoke about NATO at his front door so call his bluff and agree to that. Will it work I don't know but you cannot use tunnel vision or you will fail.
But what has Putin done or complained about Sweden and Finland joining? Finland alone put more of NATO at his doorstep than Ukraine would have. Granted Turkey hasn't agreed as of yet, but those countries attempting to join NATO had already called the bluff.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:40 pm to WeeWee
quote:
Most of NATO has American weapons but the Ukrainians would kick their arse because they have a trained military with 1,000,000 + troops and battle experience.
I hope you're wrong, in my opinion you are, because that would mean NATO would not have a chance against Russia.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:42 pm to StormyMcMan
quote:
But what has Putin done or complained about Sweden and Finland joining? Finland alone put more of NATO at his
He threatened there would be a price to pay if they joined so yes he did complain. Now will he follow through?
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:47 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
So yes it had value and yes taxpayers money was used and will be used again to replace it. Why try to dance around that fact?
No dancing around the fact that it costs money to destroy weapons beyond expiration date. No dancing around the fact that most of what is being sent will NEVER be used and costs money to store and maintain, or destroy. No dancing around the fact that some of what is being sent is obsolete and our own military doesn't want them. No dancing around the fact that the budgeted and spent are two separate things. No dancing around the fact that Putin threatened allies via treaty and legal obligations.
So are you economically illiterate too?
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:53 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
That is naive to think Russia just packing it in and saying my bad is an offramp. Here is a fact no matter how long Ukraine can hold Russia off all it will take is one nuke and Ukraine is done. Russia has to feel like they won some things for them to reel it in otherwise they are to far in to pull out now. Negotiations are a give and take not saying Russia deserves anything but you have to let them try and save face.
How about fricking no. You dont start a war for no reason and get a chance to "save face". Not going to happen.
More and more coffins are showing up in Moscow and St Pete, not the Stans. This can end when the Russians want it to end, not before.
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:54 pm to CitizenK
BTW, how many Bradley fighting vehicles are now sitting at the bottom of the Gulf of Mexico as fishing reefs? It's a bunch of them
Posted on 11/5/22 at 12:59 pm to SOSFAN
quote:
It would be inappropriate to the Ukraine people to not try it. We won't continue to give billions in support for eternity. What happens when that ends and the Ukrainian people are left to their selves.
You seem to think it’s all on Ukraine when we all know it takes two to tango.
Ukraine can tell Putin today that if he removes all Russian troops from Ukraine (pre 2014) that they will not attempt to join NATO, but nothing will change. Russia may counter, hoping for a respite, but they aren’t leaving Crimea or Oblasts they annexed.
This post was edited on 11/5/22 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 11/5/22 at 1:09 pm to CitizenK
My wife's brother was so cost observant that the bought a number of cases of caulking on sale. After he died, I went through all of his stockpile of supplies and had to throw all the caulking away as it was hard as a rock. Additionally, loved stocking up on all sorts of hardware items like galvanized strapping of varying sizes. We gave all away is it was never going to be used. He was never going to use it either.
The same applies to what is in storage for the military, much of it during the Cold War. Russia has aq very high rate of dud artillery projectiles buried in fields of Ukraine. Meanwhile the artillery tubes get worn out for nothing.
The same applies to what is in storage for the military, much of it during the Cold War. Russia has aq very high rate of dud artillery projectiles buried in fields of Ukraine. Meanwhile the artillery tubes get worn out for nothing.
This post was edited on 11/5/22 at 1:11 pm
Posted on 11/5/22 at 1:12 pm to doubleb
quote:
You seem to think it’s all on Ukraine when we all know it takes two to tango.
I honestly don't see how you came to that when I've clearly stated was a give and take on both sides. I get it that everyone thinks Russia shouldn't get anything, they invaded and from an emotional standpoint I 100% agree, but this is reality and Russia won't go away empty handed. No, it's not fair but it's reality and that is how we need to approach it
Posted on 11/5/22 at 1:13 pm to SOSFAN
I've seen how many of the Politards are well informed on a Netanyahu thread. Nary a one knows anything about his past, all they see is "overthrow of WEF"
Posted on 11/5/22 at 1:15 pm to Lakeboy7
quote:
How about fricking no. You dont start a war for no reason and get a chance to "save face". Not going to happen.
That's emotions talking and I would agree but it's not reality. So what do you propose? NATO enter the war? We keep providing Ukraine and the war last for decades or worse we don't give Putin any options and he nukes Ukraine? What exactly do you think the end game is if negotiations are not tried and highly encouraged?
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