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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 10/18/22 at 3:38 pm to
Posted by klrstix
Shreveport, LA
Member since Oct 2006
3576 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 3:38 pm to
Actually...

That is a self destruct button...

Posted by Tigris
Cloud Cuckoo Land
Member since Jul 2005
13136 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 4:08 pm to
quote:

An army with one finger ...


Any army and nation that has earned a one fingered salute.
Posted by Highthoughts
Member since Sep 2022
313 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 4:21 pm to
quote:

Russia has literally never invaded a member of NATO. No other way around it.


Why don’t you read this out loud to yourself very slowly?

Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139041 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:00 pm to
quote:

Why don’t you read this out loud to yourself very slowly?


quote:

Highthoughts
Did your post sound better when your fingers were hitting the keys?
Posted by Kentucker
Rabbit Hash, KY
Member since Apr 2013
20055 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:01 pm to
quote:

There was no request for NATO to disavow their membership, i.e., their protection under a nuclear umbrella and defense treaty would remain.


One nation cannot dictate the dealings of another nation. Russia has zero right to tell Ukraine what to do, or any treaties it can make.

You seem to think that Ukraine belongs to Russia. That’s foolish.

quote:

Can you not understand how a country being entwined by a NATO military python would feel threatened?


NATO is a defensive organization. Look that word up since you don’t seem to understand what it means.

The group came about because of the threat of Soviet aggression. It persists and has grown because of Russian Federation aggression, perfectly exemplified by the invasion of Ukraine.

You seem to be just another Putin shill. Y’all seem to be rotating through on about a 6-week to 2-month schedule. AmIright?
Posted by WestCoastAg
Member since Oct 2012
150151 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:05 pm to
quote:

Can you not understand how a country being entwined by a NATO military python would feel threatened?
then maybe Russia needs to look inward and ask themselves why multiple of their former soviet satellites/republics so willingly push for inclusion into NATO and the EU while countries in our sphere of influence arent clamoring to join Chinas or Russias
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139041 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:09 pm to
quote:

Actually...

That is a self destruct button...
Oh, for sure. It's a murder-suicide button. That is what mutually assured destruction is.

Now then ...
explain that to the nitwits here saying,

"Hey there Puuuuut'n.
Yew threatn'n us wiff Nooookes?
Haw, Haw!
Breeeeng it duuude.
Weee'l nooooke yew rat back.

Winnnnning!"
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:25 pm to
quote:

Oh, for sure. It's a murder-suicide button. That is what mutually assured destruction is.


It's a deterrence strategy which goes out the window if one party decides to use that deterrent offensively on a third-party, as the strategy dictates an equilibrium on the use between two parties. Unfortunately, none of the arguments you've laid out have shown that Russia is an actor interested in de-escalation, since you apparently think that it is okay for Russia to dictate terms to organizations of which it is not a member. All the responsibility for de-escalation isn't Russia looking at their security interests and realizing they are exceedingly stupid and outdated, but rather the West capitulating at every turn, over and over, to redress both post-hoc and ad hoc Russian claims.

In what is most ironic, Russia's behavior the last twenty years completely justifies the maximalist approach suggested by Wolfowitz.
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:27 pm to
quote:

then maybe Russia needs to look inward and ask themselves why multiple of their former soviet satellites/republics so willingly push for inclusion into NATO and the EU while countries in our sphere of influence arent clamoring to join Chinas or Russias



That level of self-introspection is only reserved for the West, where we have freedom of speech to the extent that an American can repeat Kremlin talking points verbatim and act as though those statements are the only allowed viewpoint. We couldn't possibly suggest the Russian elite are out-of-touch or incapable of adapting to the world as it is. No, we have to cede to each and every one of their demands, including sacrificing the sovereignty and the security of NATO members for the sake of Russian security. It's cowardice disguised as prudence.
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8170 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:33 pm to
Home, a great visit with the grandkids, they grow up too quickly. Got to tour the US Armor Museum at Ft. Benning. That was an awesome experience and I would highly recommend it to anyone remotely interested in Armor, be it US, German, British, or others.

I haven't paid much attention to the war, only what I've picked up from the thread. I have to say, I've been somewhat surprised we haven't seen more aggressiveness from the Ukrainian army. Every day they wait gives Russia another day to prepare. Ukraine certainly had all of the momentum on the battlefield as summer ended. But now? Maybe they are more stressed than was thought? Or maybe the weather has just forced a halt to operations and the war is in a stalemate until the ground freezes enough to support armor. They have been supposedly building combat power in the Zap area, what's it doing?

Russia appears to be totally punched out other than the ability to send in missile strikes and drone swarms. Russia hasn't made any significant gains in months. The wave of mobilized troops that are joining the front are going to face a brutal experience in the coming months. How they handle it could set the stage for the next phase of the war.
This post was edited on 10/18/22 at 5:35 pm
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139041 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:40 pm to
quote:

One nation cannot dictate the dealings of another nation.
Tell it to Serbia. Tell it to Iraq. Tell it to Afghanistan. Tell it to Panama. Tell it to Grenada. Tell it to Cuba.
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:44 pm to
quote:

Tell it to Serbia. Tell it to Iraq. Tell it to Afghanistan. Tell it to Panama. Tell it to Grenada. Tell it to Cuba.


What he meant to say was that one nation cannot dictate the dealings of another nation populated by white people.
Posted by Obtuse1
Westside Bodymore Yo
Member since Sep 2016
30520 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:48 pm to
quote:

I've rarely ever seen revisionist history kick in so quickly and so thoroughly.


For whatever reason this post made me pause and think. I decided we could call early game revisionist history propaganda and be mostly accurate.
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:49 pm to
quote:

Tell it to Serbia. Tell it to Iraq. Tell it to Afghanistan. Tell it to Panama. Tell it to Grenada. Tell it to Cuba.


Again, the US is the lone superpower. It makes the rules. During the CW, there were plenty of instances where the USSR dictated terms to other nations, including one of the countries you listed. This isn't the retort you think it is. If the Russians wanted a multi-polar world, then they shouldn't have lost the Cold War. The world isn't fair, and no amount of 'whataboutism' will ever change that.
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139041 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:50 pm to
quote:

It's a deterrence strategy which goes out the window if one party decides to use that deterrent offensively on a third-party, as the strategy dictates an equilibrium on the use between two parties.
You are far brighter than that. Russia has thousands of nukes. One or two deployments has no impact whatsoever on capacity.
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:50 pm to
quote:

What he meant to say was that one nation cannot dictate the dealings of another nation populated by white people.




Lol but he used Afghanistan, which is ironic. I could have replied with Czechoslovakia etc., but it was a nonsensical point.
Posted by MountainTiger
The foot of Mt. Belzoni
Member since Dec 2008
14958 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:51 pm to
quote:

Well political has finally made this unreadable

Indeed.


Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8170 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:52 pm to
Spot on
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
139041 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:53 pm to
quote:

Again, the US is the lone superpower.
Defined as??
Because the thing you and multiple folks here ignore is that by nuke measures, there are TWO superpowers; Not one !
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 10/18/22 at 5:55 pm to
But it still describes an equilibrium between two parties. The entrance of a third party without nukes changes the equilibrium.
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