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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 10/11/22 at 3:57 pm to lsu777
Posted on 10/11/22 at 3:57 pm to lsu777
quote:
i hate to take up for OML but the dude was on here and the PT in December and January and hell almost all last year until the invasion saying we needed to commit american troops to protecting ukraine and taiwan.
he isnt some putin cock sucker, anything but.
he sees that putin doesnt have an off ramp and OML fears nuclear weapons being used and the thought of that for him is so devestating it causes paralysis where he is willing to bow down to putin.
We can disagree on this. No problem there.
Maybe as you suggest he is just mentally deficient and paralyzed, but I don't assume that people are just negligent short thinkers. By now he must be able to see that his advocacy to cut off support for Ukraine would have a very predictable result. He must have some mental ability to associate the action and its obvious consequence. To think him incapable of understanding the consequence of his repeated and repeated and repeated proposal would be to disrespect him in a manner I won't do. He has to be able to see that his cowering knee bending would only serve Russia's goals.
This post was edited on 10/11/22 at 4:07 pm
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Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:02 pm to doubleb
quote:
They keep talking corruption, but I googled top ten corrupt nations in Europe and Ukraine was not in the two lists I quickly found.
I think the corruption argument is a farce in the vein of college football programs paying players prior to NIL. All the major programs were doing it. SMU got the van hammer because they’re SMU. Miami and UNC did not because they’re Miami and UNC. Auburn is Auburn. Well, Ukraine is SMU. The rest of the western world is generally the CFB powers. They’re all doing it within themselves, with each other, with lower tier countries. Time to time scapegoats are needed. Ukraine became it.
Just my very simplistic opinion. It all irritates me, but we aren’t above it either. We’re Alabama. Ukraine is SMU.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:06 pm to CitizenK
quote:
Russia actually had an agreement with NATO and a seat at NATO's table. Putin crapped all over it.
Madeline Albright crapped all over it before Putin even came into power.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:10 pm to OleWar
Nary a train transited the Kerch Strait Bridge since the fire/explosions.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:12 pm to doubleb
quote:
My reference backs up what I posted.
Russia didn’t conquer and annex Crimea in a day. It took several weeks.
It did go fairly quickly, but it took time.
Even further, the narrative that Russia had Crimea by the time the interim government was set up, which is completely false by the way, also ignores what happened in Crimea itself, where there was another coup. But Russian interference in Ukrainian politics is okay because of some dastardly coup that started after months of protests because Yanukovych decided not to sign a FTA with the EU. The Crimean coup that took place on the evening of Feb. 27th, 2014, the same day as the interim government in Kyiv was formed, deposed the PM of Crimea in favor of a PM from the Russian Unity Party, which represented the only 4% of the electorate in the previous election. We have to willfully ignore the fact that armed men stormed Crimean political buildings too. It's just nonsense all the way around, straight Russian propaganda repeated without any thought or care.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:13 pm to OleWar
quote:
Madeline Albright crapped all over it before Putin even came into power.
Thank god for that, given the way Russia has treated its other agreement with NATO, it would have spelled the end for that alliance.
This post was edited on 10/11/22 at 4:14 pm
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:13 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:I guess we'd need to define "interfere".
Again, the argument you seem to be making is that it is okay for Russia to interfere in Ukrainian politics
For example, Putin influenced Yanukovych to push back from EU negotiations. Is that interference? Electoral shenanigans in 2004 got Yanukovych "elected". Russian interference? Maybe. The Orange Revolution overthrew the 2004 result. Western interference? IDK, but Soros definitely played a role.
But interference doesn't get much more blatant than the overthrow of a free, fair, internationally-observed 2010 election via an orchestrated coup d'etat in 2014.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:16 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
I guess we'd need to define "interfere".
What?
quote:
The Orange Revolution overthrew the 2004 result. Western interference? IDK, but Soros definitely played a role.
Oh, you are one of those people.
quote:
But interference doesn't get much more blatant than the overthrow of a free, fair, internationally-observed 2010 election via an orchestrated coup d'etat in 2014.
So you would agree that what occurred in Crimea was also an example of blatant interference by Russian interests, where the PM was deposed and another, directly pro-Russian PM was installed, correct? Or is this okay for you? Do you need some evidence of Russian involvement or can I invoke it a la Soros with no reference at all?
This post was edited on 10/11/22 at 4:18 pm
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:18 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
But interference doesn't get much more blatant than the overthrow of a free, fair, internationally-observed 2010 election via an orchestrated coup d'etat in 2014.
Ukrainians were quite unanimous in their taking to the streets and having Russian snipers inported to shoot them didn't help Putin's podna like intended. Heck, Putin should have learned something back then to not think that his widening the invasion on Feb 24th was going to topple anything
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:18 pm to crazy4lsu
Your responses never make any sense. What country are you from?
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:22 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
But interference doesn't get much more blatant than the overthrow of a free, fair, internationally-observed 2010 election via an orchestrated coup d'etat in 2014.
But it’s not worse than invading a country in 2022 to topple a duly elected president in 2019.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:22 pm to OleWar
quote:
Your responses never make any sense. What country are you from?
The US. I'm not surprised you can't follow. I believe you are the guy who called Olivier Roy a Maoist, as though that was relevant to his book of first-person sources on Afghanistan. You are a real moron.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:25 pm to mmcgrath
Oh my!
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:26 pm to doubleb
quote:Agree.
But it’s not worse than invading a country in 2022 to topple a duly elected president in 2019.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:31 pm to crazy4lsu
To even know who the French Maoist is and that it bothers you, means you are either one, or all of the above; an autistic, a foreigner, or have a higher degree in international politics
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:32 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:Interference? At least.
So you would agree that what occurred in Crimea was also an example of blatant interference by Russian interests
I thought we were talking political interference. Obviously, war/invasion is cardinal amongst modes of "interference".
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:32 pm to OleWar
quote:
To even know who the French Maoist is and that it bothers you, means you are either one, or all of the above; an autistic, a foreigner, or have a higher degree in international politics
Incorrect on all counts. Nicely done dumbass.
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:33 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Interference? At least.
I'm talking about the events of February 27th, 2014 in Crimea. Do you know what I'm referring to?
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:35 pm to crazy4lsu
A leftist piece of shite then?
Posted on 10/11/22 at 4:39 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
When we organized a coup to unseat the democratically-elected, fairly-elected president
Yeah, just another pathetic, anti-American, Russia-loving trolling liar.
This post was edited on 10/11/22 at 4:40 pm
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