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re: Ford, GM, Mercedes come clean on EV demand weakness
Posted on 11/1/23 at 11:51 am to AwgustaDawg
Posted on 11/1/23 at 11:51 am to AwgustaDawg
quote:How much cheaper is this Camry?
Every study conducted indicates that cost of ownership for a Tesla 3 compared to the same year model Camry has been, until this year, substantially higher.
Every total cost of ownership of a Tesla Model 3 compared to a vehicle actually the same price or close to it as the Model 3 shows the EV is wayyyyyyy cheaper.
quote:Why are you comparing a car with a $26k starting cost to a car with a $39k starting cost?
Some studies now show the Tesla is less expensive to own than the Camry over 5 years but projections beyond 5 years revert back to the Camry being less costly to own. Both have comparable resell values.
1
Posted on 11/1/23 at 11:53 am to kywildcatfanone
quote:Because you don't understand that it's common for the government to provide incentives for emerging technologies nor do you understand how important it is to not cede entirely the EV industry to China.
Yep, this bugs me more than anything about EV's
IF you understand those 2 things, all this would make a lot more sense to you.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 11:54 am to TopWaterTiger
quote:And the average family doesn't have 2 cars and 1 is just a commuter around town?
said it before and I'll say it again. EV's fit the driver who only makes short commutes to and from work, around town, and to the local stores.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 11:57 am to dewster
quote:
. You may even see fuel stations go the way of blockbuster.
One of the most retarded things I have seen on this site.
And that is saying a lot.
I’m still waiting on the Jetsons transport tubes to happen.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:04 pm to shel311
quote:
Tesla is providing all the needed charging network and doing so rapidly, and it's about to go into hyper build mode due to the new cash flow they have with other EVs coming online to the super charging network.
I hope so. And I hope they sprinkle them around a wide variety of locations. Not just fewer giant charging stations with 20+ chargers.
If you don't need gas tanks underground, you can almost add these superchargers to old downtown locations to help boost their viability and also roadside shopping centers. A lot easier to add a supercharger than a gas pump from scratch.
This post was edited on 11/1/23 at 12:07 pm
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:06 pm to shel311
quote:
Why are you comparing a car with a $26k starting cost to a car with a $39k starting cost?
Camry, Malibu, Altima and Accord all start around $25K and usually sell between $28K and $30K.
Which EV sedan costs that so we can use it to compare to the best selling sedans in the market?
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:07 pm to goofball
quote:Agreed
I hope so. And I hope they sprinkle them around a wide variety of locations. Not just fewer giant charging stations with 20+ chargers.
They've come a long ways and are rapidly adding more, but I hope they continue this and make it even more rapid.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:07 pm to goofball
quote:Generally, the most comparable car to a Model 3 by price and class is the BMW 3 series.
Camry, Malibu, Altima and Accord all start around $25K and usually sell between $28K and $30K.
Which EV sedan costs that so we can use it to compare to the best selling sedans in the market?
And total cost of ownership research on those 2 greatly favor the Model 3.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:08 pm to shel311
quote:
Agreed
They've come a long ways and are rapidly adding more, but I hope they continue this and make it even more rapid.
Big problem in Louisiana right now is that our interstate network is garbage. So many people rely on US 190, LA1, LA 22, US 61, etc. and treat them like major highways.
And there are zero superchargers along those routes except where they intersect with I-10, I-12, or I-20.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:10 pm to member12
I’m hugely skeptical of the EV push, but I do wonder how Volvo and Land Rover will deal with this. They went all in on battery/electric cars. Will they change their plans?
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:13 pm to AwgustaDawg
Sounds like the company did a bad job of evaluating thier needs and requirements vs the vehicles they got.
Were they forced to lease them?
Were they forced to lease them?
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:14 pm to Chad504boy
A much better solution would be hybrids. They dont tax the electrical grid like pure EV. Also many people (myself included) drive less than 50 miles a day so the hybrid would handle that. But if I needed to drive farther I can use fuel that is already available.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:14 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
I’m hugely skeptical of the EV push, but I do wonder how Volvo and Land Rover will deal with this.
They are already low volume.
Jaguar is what I'm a little worried about. Not only are they primarily sports cars and sedans while everyone is switching to SUVs....but their buyers are typically older and more weary of EV's.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:22 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
100 vehicles leased and for all practical purposes unusable because of over stated efficiencies and unkown risks
What was the upside of this transition? Reduced fuel costs?
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:24 pm to shel311
quote:
Generally, the most comparable car to a Model 3 by price and class is the BMW 3 series.
BMW 3 series isn't even close to the best selling car in the US though. It's also much smaller than the top selling sedans and known for being very unreliable and requiring costly repairs even before 100,000 miles. Tesla on their worst day damn well better out perform a very high cost of ownership vehicle a BMW.
The Tesla Model 3 with the tax incentive is much closer to a mid range Camry in price. Both are designed to be a sedan for the masses. It's fair to use the Camry as a yardstick to see how far mass market electric vehicles have come.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:25 pm to alphaandomega
quote:
A much better solution would be hybrids.
Yep, easily. Toyota's focus is this instead of straight EV and it makes perfect sense.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:25 pm to alphaandomega
quote:
They dont tax the electrical grid like pure EV. Also many people (myself included) drive less than 50 miles a day
You aren't taxing the grid to charge twice a week in the middle of the night.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:29 pm to shel311
quote:
Generally, the most comparable car to a Model 3 by price and class is the BMW 3 series.
That’s a low bar. BMW is in the basement with Land Rover and Jaguar when it comes to cost of ownership. BMW is not the company they were 20 years ago. Nobody should own one out of warranty unless they are very good friends with a BMW mechanic.
That should not be the benchmark for EV’s. More popular cars from Toyota, Nissan, Chevy, VW, or Honda should be.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:34 pm to dewster
quote:
That should not be the benchmark for EV’s. More popular cars from Toyota, Nissan, Chevy, VW, or Honda should be.
Only with a giant * that it's being compared to cars that it blows away in many categories. If you want apples to apples you need to compare it to cars with at least somewhat similar tech, performance and amenities. Not cloth interior cars with CD players still.
Posted on 11/1/23 at 12:37 pm to member12
All they had to do was listen to their customers.
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