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re: Defense Attorneys, have you ever represented a client that you knew was a colossal POS?
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:34 am to JohnnyKilroy
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:34 am to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
Has something like this ever happened?
Should the state ever get dinged for not following the law?
We just had an attorney state that when the client was obviously or admittedly guilty, he attacked the procedure of the cops/investiagtors/state so it must've happened at some point.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:35 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
Ask the attorney who said that when he had no defense, he would attack cops not following procedure
Well if they didn't follow procedures/the law is that an issue to you?
Or should there be no safeguards or limits to that investigatory/prosecutorial power?
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:35 am to JohnnyKilroy
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:36 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
We are talking about lawyers using whataboutisms
This is now at least your third pivot
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:36 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
he attacked the procedure of the cops/investiagtors/state so it must've happened at some point.
Please cite a single instance of a suspect being video'd committing a crime and then being found not guilty by a jury due to a "technicality"
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:38 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
We are talking about lawyers using whataboutisms to defend obviously or admittedly guilty people. I'm not talking wiretaps in innocent people's homes fishing for crimes
Do you have the same energy for prosecutors who personally don't believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant is guilty yet they have enough circumstantial evidence to build and argue a case against the defendant, using anything they can (including technicalities) to convict, because they feel like they can convince a jury of guilt and get the W? Many even falsify, manipulate, and suppress evidence, and get people to lie in order to support their case.
This post was edited on 3/26/26 at 11:43 am
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:38 am to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
Please cite a single instance of a suspect being video'd committing a crime and then being found not guilty by a jury due to a "technicality"
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:39 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
Did you even read that blog post? This is embarrassing.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:39 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Well if they didn't follow procedures/the law is that an issue to you?
It is. Why should that be tied to the guilt/innocence of someone providing it has no bearing on the facts of the case? I understand the judge's duty to throw things like that out, but why would it be addressed inside of a trial as a means to clear the accused?
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:40 am to JohnnyKilroy
I didn't read, but the defendants in My Cousin Vinnie were innocent without technicality
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:41 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
Why should that be tied to the guilt/innocence of someone providing it has no bearing on the facts of the case?
Again, this is embarrassing.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:42 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
Why should that be tied to the guilt/innocence of someone providing it has no bearing on the facts of the case? I
I don't think you can cite an example of that minor of a technicality working in that way,. especially with the bold.
quote:
but why would it be addressed inside of a trial as a means to clear the accused?
It would be litigated pretrial or outside the presence of the jury.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:43 am to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
Did you even read that blog post? This is embarrassing.
It's the first one that came up, but did you read it?
quote:
For example, you can use the movie to discuss criminal procedure, courtroom decorum, professional responsibility, unethical behavior, the role of the judge in a trial, efficient cross-examination, the role of expert witnesses, and effective trial advocacy.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:43 am to SlowFlowPro
Thib thinks criminal trials are like tv shows and movies. He is literally arguing against make believe stories.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:52 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
The truth is for philosophers and not really applicable
I bet you don’t let your clients say that when they are being sworn in.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:53 am to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
Thib thinks criminal trials are like tv shows and movies. He is literally arguing against make believe stories.
LINK
Posted on 3/26/26 at 11:55 am to Joshjrn
You make a good point. There is nothing moral about killing another human being.
I would argue, however, that the lawyer has freedom of choice while the soldier often does not, at least not when the penalty to disobey orders carries a consequence of jail or death.
The very basis of fighting a war in many cases, is purported to be a moral one. It is made out to be a battle of good vs evil, and the reasons why you consider your side is good are morally good reasons. As long as civilians aren’t targeted and children aren’t used, I would consider the war to be ethically good. Even the brutal killing of the enemy can be considered ethical since it will bring a faster end to the war itself. And there is nothing more ethical than self preservation. My point is, what is considered morally and ethically good or bad in war align, regardless of whether the war is just.
In the legal profession, lying is not only okay, it is absolutely necessary to do the job (ie provide a defense to a scumbag that is guilty). The ethics involved in doing this directly contradict the morals. And unlike the soldier, the choice is not life or death.
Sorry for the long reply. If you wouldn’t have made such a good point, my answer could have been shorter
I would argue, however, that the lawyer has freedom of choice while the soldier often does not, at least not when the penalty to disobey orders carries a consequence of jail or death.
The very basis of fighting a war in many cases, is purported to be a moral one. It is made out to be a battle of good vs evil, and the reasons why you consider your side is good are morally good reasons. As long as civilians aren’t targeted and children aren’t used, I would consider the war to be ethically good. Even the brutal killing of the enemy can be considered ethical since it will bring a faster end to the war itself. And there is nothing more ethical than self preservation. My point is, what is considered morally and ethically good or bad in war align, regardless of whether the war is just.
In the legal profession, lying is not only okay, it is absolutely necessary to do the job (ie provide a defense to a scumbag that is guilty). The ethics involved in doing this directly contradict the morals. And unlike the soldier, the choice is not life or death.
Sorry for the long reply. If you wouldn’t have made such a good point, my answer could have been shorter
Posted on 3/26/26 at 12:28 pm to Thib-a-doe Tiger
The Anti-Shuttling provision is, at its heart, a Constitutional issue protecting the right to speedy trial. The state authorities also broke the law.
This was litigated to the Supreme Court in 2001 and the decision was unanimous
The state broke the law, and the law in question specifically demands dismissal.
This was litigated to the Supreme Court in 2001 and the decision was unanimous
The state broke the law, and the law in question specifically demands dismissal.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 1:41 pm to Joshjrn
quote:That's a statistic that should make a lot more people ask, 'why?'
And this also ignores that 75-80% of all criminal defense representation is done by public defenders.
Posted on 3/26/26 at 3:33 pm to tokenBoiler
quote:
That's a statistic that should make a lot more people ask, 'why?'
That is simple economics. Apparently, 60% of people don't have $1000 they can use for an emergency, which means they can't afford to hire an attorney for even a simple misdemeanor charge.
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