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Message
re: Buncha Palestinians in my neighborhood. Can’t tell if they’re happy about the peace deal.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 11:05 am to SM6
Posted on 10/15/25 at 11:05 am to SM6
quote:
Talk to me about the West Bank then...
Palestinians rejected that as well for 40 years. The West Bank was actually a part of Jordan’s accepted boundaries when it became a member of the UN. During the free for all after the Arab state was rejected Israel, Jordan, and Egypt gained parts of the territory (Egypt in control of gaza not becoming part of country like Jordan and the West Bank).
Palestinians were even given citizenship or residency in Jordan. The PLO and others then kept bitting the hand that fed them including attempting to assassinate Jordan leadership and a successful assassination and also starting stuff with Israel. In 1967 Israel took the West Bank from Jordan’s and gaza and the Sinai from Egypt after Egypt again blocked access to the Red Sea and built up troops along borders with Israel with Jordan and Syria also involved in provocation, and eventually the PLO moved to Lebanon did same shite in Lebanon.
As part of the UN’s acceptance of Ararat’s 40 year late acceptance of the now non existent arab state (with a vague recognition of Israel in separate documents) in 86/87 which again had technically been off the table at that time Jordan then dismissed all its claims to the West Bank which helped them to get rid of their palestinian problem. At some point later a UN international judge declared Israel occupiers back dated to 67.
It was manufactured occupation pushed by the UN increasingly becoming dominanted by arabs and other muslim countries in general assembly decisions. The situation in the West Bank when plan was finally accepted was not the same as it was at rejection in 47 or even in the 1967 agreement to end the 1967 or 73 wars. It wasn’t just Israel making the West Bank a different situation in the ground.
Clinton tried to get his peace treaty which did lay some ground work for various levels of Israel control over the West Bank for defensive purposes, Palestinians controlling day to day ops in some places with Israel in others, and giving back full control over gaza while working towards a more permanent solution in the West Bank. The palestinians rejected finalizing anything on West Bank in part hoping a Republican president would give them a better deal than Clinton.
Israel still completely withdraws from Gaza in 2005 including forcefully removing Israelis, and then after handover Hamas kidnaps an Israel soldier, starts a war and then wins the 2006 election to run all of palestine authority. Hamas then splits Gaza completely away from PA and continues to start wars.
That’s effectively where we still stand. Countries are currently recognizing a state or a country that is split in 2 due to its own accord and has a minimal working govt whose leaders were last truly elected in 2006.
1
Posted on 10/15/25 at 11:11 am to wesfau
quote:
Remains? Where does Israel think the Palestinians have been storing these bodies? Everything has been bombed to shite, so the bodies they want are probably under a bunch of rubble with a bunch of Palestinian civilians.
Hamas agreed to do so as a part of getting Israel to withdrawal. They mentioned some might take longer than others, but they are still delaying on what they agreed to do.
It’s sad you believe all the numbers coming out of the hamas controlled govt structures in gaza while ignoring hamas executing people on the streets after Israel’s withdrawal.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 11:42 am to fightin tigers
quote:
Why would they be unhappy about the peace deal?
Because they can’t kill Jews, duh.
Koran much?
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:06 pm to Philzilla2k
Palestinians are never happy.. that’s why no country in the ME will have anything to do with them.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:22 pm to Slippy
Stick an Israeli flag in your yard. You'll get your answer then.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:34 pm to SM6
The settlements are wild because they will never agree.
The Israelis say is their land the Palestinians say three same. He Israeli mantra is that there is no Palestine.
Yet everyone knows it was called Palestin in 1918 when the new wave of eastern european Zionism really took off.
You had terrorism from Jewish extremist too. Multiple times Britsh authorities were killed or even blown up by Jewish extremist But we only fault the muslims who do that. Bibi calls for the death of Rabin, rabin is killed, by Jews and Bibi becomes the leader off and on for 30 years.
Now i do think Israel deserves to live. They deserve their state. But it's not as cut and dry.
I get the main reason we support them so much is a western nation in the middle east is needed and evangelucals want their prophecy to come true and Jews need to hold Israel.
But the treatment of people in the west bank is pretty bad. They are subjects with less rights because the goal is to make them leave.
But they have been occupying that land for hundreds of years.
I think the only way forward is to stop settlements and give up the westbank to Palestine.
Gaza isn't really ready for self rule.
The Israelis say is their land the Palestinians say three same. He Israeli mantra is that there is no Palestine.
Yet everyone knows it was called Palestin in 1918 when the new wave of eastern european Zionism really took off.
You had terrorism from Jewish extremist too. Multiple times Britsh authorities were killed or even blown up by Jewish extremist But we only fault the muslims who do that. Bibi calls for the death of Rabin, rabin is killed, by Jews and Bibi becomes the leader off and on for 30 years.
Now i do think Israel deserves to live. They deserve their state. But it's not as cut and dry.
I get the main reason we support them so much is a western nation in the middle east is needed and evangelucals want their prophecy to come true and Jews need to hold Israel.
But the treatment of people in the west bank is pretty bad. They are subjects with less rights because the goal is to make them leave.
But they have been occupying that land for hundreds of years.
I think the only way forward is to stop settlements and give up the westbank to Palestine.
Gaza isn't really ready for self rule.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:43 pm to Slippy
Today I learned that Slippy lives in Dearborn, MI
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:48 pm to Napoleon
quote:
I think the only way forward is to stop settlements and give up the westbank to Palestine
Tried it. Wasn't enough.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:52 pm to Napoleon
quote:
I think the only way forward is to stop settlements and give up the westbank to Palestine.
That ship has sailed. It died when Arafat turned it down at Camp David.
There were 8000 Jews living in Gaza who were forcibly removed.
There are nearly a million in Westbank/Judea-Samaria.
They won’t be forced out and no Israeli government will try.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:55 pm to fightin tigers
(no message)
Posted on 10/15/25 at 12:58 pm to fightin tigers
Didn't really try it.
Israel didn't keep the 1967 borders. They made multiple settlements then limited west bank travel. They still have the yellow vs black license plate system. With palestinian plates restricted. I think a major issue is people are not versed on what goes on over there.
Israel didn't keep the 1967 borders. They made multiple settlements then limited west bank travel. They still have the yellow vs black license plate system. With palestinian plates restricted. I think a major issue is people are not versed on what goes on over there.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:21 pm to Napoleon
quote:
Israel didn't keep the 1967 borders.
Who had it before 67?
This post was edited on 10/15/25 at 1:21 pm
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:22 pm to Napoleon
quote:
at least equal rights.
They should have been asking Hamas for it. Israel has had zero control (other than the border) over the governance or running of Gaza since 2005. And since I know you don't know this, 20% of the population of Israel is Arab, and they already have equal rights.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:29 pm to fightin tigers
Look I get that we rewrote history to say there is No Palestine. But the fact is that area was called Palestine from ancient Greek times to the Islamic takeover in 637. By 1945 the move was to give Israel state hood. But they were a minority. Through our and Englands help they built up a large military and kicked arse. No denying that. But they did not hold the border then claim foul when Palestinians are doing to them what they did with the English authority years before.
.
The area was Ottoman. But England took control after ww1. Then the Balfour decleration set up the zionist movement. Then after ww2 they needed a home land even more as the us didn't want to take in the jews. So the push was to create Israel.
But it's assinie to not take into consideration the people who we're there through the life of the Ottaman empire.
The point is we are told Israel good, Palestine bad. But the truth is it isn't black and white.
.
The area was Ottoman. But England took control after ww1. Then the Balfour decleration set up the zionist movement. Then after ww2 they needed a home land even more as the us didn't want to take in the jews. So the push was to create Israel.
But it's assinie to not take into consideration the people who we're there through the life of the Ottaman empire.
The point is we are told Israel good, Palestine bad. But the truth is it isn't black and white.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:39 pm to Napoleon
I didnt say there wasnt a Palestine. I said that they were able to control themselves in the West Bank and that wasn't enough. 6 day war proved that.
Then when they lost they cried it wasn't fair to lose the land that they had took over after a previous war.
Israel can, and has, maintained their sovereignty. It's only when Israel is winning that everyone gets all in their feels.
Then when they lost they cried it wasn't fair to lose the land that they had took over after a previous war.
Israel can, and has, maintained their sovereignty. It's only when Israel is winning that everyone gets all in their feels.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:41 pm to dallastigers
quote:
Palestinians were even given citizenship or residency in Jordan. The PLO and others then kept bitting the hand that fed them including attempting to assassinate Jordan leadership and a successful assassination and also starting stuff with Israel. In 1967 Israel took the West Bank from Jordan’s and gaza and the Sinai from Egypt after Egypt again blocked access to the Red Sea and built up troops along borders with Israel with Jordan and Syria also involved in provocation, and eventually the PLO moved to Lebanon did same shite in Lebanon.
Most people don't seem to know the history of Jordan and the Palestinians. Jordan's leadership have astutely framed this like an Israeli versus Palestinian issue but the governance of their state was put at risk by the influence and chaos introduced by the Palestinians in Jordan. They had a real military situation which required force similar to what the Israeli government has had to use over the past 25 or 45 years
The Jordanian and Egyptian governments won't allow open borders or refugees because the Palestinians will frick up or destroy their relative peace and stability.
There's a double standard at work when we don't know that's what is going on RE: Jordan and Egypt but constantly hear about the same issues with the Israeli government.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:47 pm to Napoleon
quote:
Look I get that we rewrote history to say there is No Palestine. But the fact is that area was called Palestine from ancient Greek times to the Islamic takeover in 637.
You are doing exactly what you are accusing others of. What was the name of the area prior to be named Palestine? Who named it Palestine and why?
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:48 pm to molsusports
quote:
Most people don't seem to know the history of Jordan and the Palestinians. Jordan's leadership have astutely framed this like an Israeli versus Palestinian issue but the governance of their state was put at risk by the influence and chaos introduced by the Palestinians in Jordan. They had a real military situation which required force similar to what the Israeli government has had to use over the past 25 or 45 years
The Jordanian and Egyptian governments won't allow open borders or refugees because the Palestinians will frick up or destroy their relative peace and stability.
There's a double standard at work when we don't know that's what is going on RE: Jordan and Egypt but constantly hear about the same issues with the Israeli government.
Winner winner chicken dinner!
Posted on 10/15/25 at 1:55 pm to ABearsFanNMS
How far back your going?
Israel if you go back before the jews were removed.
But it was Palestine from before Islam until 1946.
That's a really long time.
Does historical ties to land grant people that land?
If so we are screwed here when the Indians make their claims.
Israel if you go back before the jews were removed.
But it was Palestine from before Islam until 1946.
That's a really long time.
Does historical ties to land grant people that land?
If so we are screwed here when the Indians make their claims.
Posted on 10/15/25 at 2:05 pm to Napoleon
quote:
If so we are screwed here when the Indians make their claims
Make the claims. You were conquered.
I can claim land just because my grandpappy lived there 50 years ago, doesn't mean I control it still.
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