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re: Bill Nye Debates Ken Ham
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:16 pm to SundayFunday
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:16 pm to SundayFunday
quote:
I've had this thought a lot. Why would God, being an entity with the power over creation itself, be bound by the limits of time as we see it? Why, if you accept the possibility of God, would it be hard to imagine that an instant of creation for God may have actually been 14 billion years to this universe in the way we(humans) perceive time?
I certainly have no problem with this but it isn't explainable by science and thus will not be accepted in a scientific debate which is why these debates hardly ever lead to anything
This post was edited on 2/4/14 at 8:17 pm
1
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:18 pm to Roger Klarvin
The human concept of time would be of no significance to God, therefore your statements are incorrect. I do agree however that evolution and creationism may not be contradictory. In fact, one that does not believe in some form of creationism, must by default believe something more ridiculous
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:20 pm to mattloc
quote:
In fact, one that does not believe in some form of creationism, must by default believe something more ridiculous
I believe in God, but this is a horrible argument.
If you say "the universe couldn't come from nothing" and thus God had to do it, you're still left with the even more unanswerable question "where did God come from".
Both parties have an unexplained variable. It is dishonest to act like God just automatically makes it so obvious.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:21 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
The problem is that many christians believe evolution destroys the whole original sin/fall of man concept (it kinda does) and thus they cant believe in it. This means that literally nothing can ever convince them otherwise.
Evolution and God are not mutually exclusive, but evolution and a literal belief in the creation account are.
Once again, the term "evolution" is used improperly. There's micro evolution, something which has been observed, but there's absolutely no evidence for Darwinian macro evolution. Infinitely complex and varied creation by Darwinian evolution in other words.
My rejection of Darwinian evolution isn't because of the whole original sin/fall of man concept but is because of the complete lack of support for the theory (guesses and suppositions). To accept Darwinian evolution one must embrace a faith based concept...something which Christians are ridiculed for.
For me, the tremendous variety and complexity of life requires a intelligent source for the variety and complexity. Darwinism on the other hand preaches that trillions and trillions of random events produced, from a very very simple common ancestor, the elephant and the pine tree. (Yes, there it is again.
) This post was edited on 2/4/14 at 8:23 pm
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:21 pm to Wishnitwas1998
quote:
I certainly have no problem with this but it isn't explainable by science and thus will not be accepted in a scientific debate which is why these debates hardly ever lead to anything
I like to think part of it is. Im referring to the different perspective of time. Time dilation is an actual scientific example of time being experienced differently by two beings simply based on their location, orientation, and velocity. This gets way deeper into spacetime theory than I would like to talk about tonight but it is a curious point.
If we can experience time differently from each other, couldnt a more 'advanced' being do the same?
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:23 pm to Turkey_Creek_Tiger
I pose to you this question...were your ancestors, the planet upon which you reside, and the 100 billion observable galaxies created by a higher being/intelligence, or did they magically appear from nothing?
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:24 pm to beejon
There's no evidence of macro evolution? Really?
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:24 pm to SundayFunday
Nye needs to stop making jokes. So awkward.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:24 pm to mattloc
quote:
were your ancestors, the planet upon which you reside, and the 100 billion observable galaxies created by a higher being/intelligence, or did they magically appear from nothing?
ah, the God of Gaps
I don't understand it, so it must be God
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:26 pm to Patron Saint
Gerald Schroeder gives an excellent talk on time and creation. His theory fits the ~15 billion year age of the universe very very well.
A Bill Nye - Gerald Schroeder debate would be one I'd be willing to pay to attend.
A Bill Nye - Gerald Schroeder debate would be one I'd be willing to pay to attend.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:27 pm to Salmon
anywhere else that I can watch this? the youtube link won't work for me
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:28 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
There's no evidence of macro evolution? Really?
Nope, there's no evidence of Darwinian macro evolution. None. Zero. Nada.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:28 pm to mattloc
(no message)
This post was edited on 2/5/14 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:29 pm to Turkey_Creek_Tiger
quote:
I love this argument. You find it impossible for there not to be a God because you believe there has to be a creator for everything right? Well if God did create the universe, then who created him? If he can exist forever or create himself, then surely the universe can too.
The question then becomes, did nothing create everything or did something create everything.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:29 pm to beejon
quote:
Once again, the term "evolution" is used improperly. There's micro evolution, something which has been observed, but there's absolutely no evidence for Darwinian macro evolution. Infinitely complex and varied creation by Darwinian evolution in other words.
My rejection of Darwinian evolution isn't because of the whole original sin/fall of man concept but is because of the complete lack of support for the theory (guesses and suppositions). To accept Darwinian evolution one must embrace a faith based concept...something which Christians are ridiculed for.
For me, the tremendous variety and complexity of life requires a intelligent source for the variety and complexity. Darwinism on the other hand preaches that trillions and trillions of random events produced, from a very very simple common ancestor, the elephant and the pine tree. (Yes, there it is again
There is no difference between "micro" and "macro" evolution. Macroevolution is just micro on a large time scale.
Believing in micro but not macro evolution is like believing in inches but not feet.
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:30 pm to Roger Klarvin
I disagree, I think that the very nature and essence of God requires that he always existed, just as some scientest believe that the Universe has always existed. I realize this is difficult to comprehend, but not when veiwed through the prism that all respected scientists today believe that the universe is infinite, a concept just as mysterious as an infinite God
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:31 pm to beejon
(no message)
This post was edited on 2/5/14 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:31 pm to Salmon
quote:
anywhere else that I can watch this? the youtube link won't work for me
They just said it will be posted on debatelive.org
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:31 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
There is no difference between "micro" and "macro" evolution. Macroevolution is just micro on a large time scale.
Believing in micro but not macro evolution is like believing in inches but not feet.
this
Posted on 2/4/14 at 8:31 pm to mattloc
quote:
I pose to you this question...were your ancestors, the planet upon which you reside, and the 100 billion observable galaxies created by a higher being/intelligence, or did they magically appear from nothing?
Where did God come from?
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