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Message
re: Non-Pels NBA January Thread
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:36 am to shel311
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:36 am to shel311
quote:
The window is closed entirely on Zion as a top 3-5 player in the league.
We gush over Zion having a good night that is quite literally a down night for a dude like Embiid.
You aren't wrong. Zion as even a top 15 player is over.
I hope he can consistently be top 25.
He's just not that guy. He could have been, I think, but he won't be.
0
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:40 am to Soggymoss
Zion never scored 50 much less 60. He has to use way too much energy to get 40ish. Getting 50+ will require him to get 20 free throws.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:41 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
has taken several more 5-8 foot shots this year
Define several
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:44 am to shel311
quote:
KAT had 44 points in the 1st half on 17 shot attempts.
No, Zion can't do that.
The "if he shot that much" is what holds Zion back. Zion only has 1 way he can score, that'll always prevent him from being able to get up 35 shots. He simply can't shoot that much.
Yep. He hangs his hat on scoring, yet he cant shoot 3s and even if he gets to the line he's only hitting 65% there. Seems like a pretty limited player to me
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:51 am to shel311
We will have to agree to disagree.
Y’all try to say this and that but Embiid last night scored 70 on 41 shots and only two of those were 3’s. He also had 23 free throws.
Zion shoots 41 shots with his average percentage he scores 50. Add in his 70ish percent free throw shooting on 23 attempts thats an additional 16 points.
So if Zion shoots the same amount as those guys he’s literally scoring the same.
The issue is our offense and coaching staff doesn’t feed him when he’s hot to let him get that amount of shots up, and usually as soon as he gets hot Willie pulls him out of the game instead of riding him.
Y’all try to say this and that but Embiid last night scored 70 on 41 shots and only two of those were 3’s. He also had 23 free throws.
Zion shoots 41 shots with his average percentage he scores 50. Add in his 70ish percent free throw shooting on 23 attempts thats an additional 16 points.
So if Zion shoots the same amount as those guys he’s literally scoring the same.
The issue is our offense and coaching staff doesn’t feed him when he’s hot to let him get that amount of shots up, and usually as soon as he gets hot Willie pulls him out of the game instead of riding him.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:56 am to Soggymoss
quote:
Y’all try to say this and that but Embiid last night scored 70 on 41 shots and only two of those were 3’s. He also had 23 free throws.
‘Embiid also has a vastly more robust offense.
I doubt all of his FG were within a 4 foot radius of the basket, which is pretty much the only area Zion can score.
quote:
The issue is our offense and coaching staff doesn’t feed him when he’s hot to let him get that amount of shots up
Nah, the issue is that Zion hasn’t bothered in expanding his offense.
This post was edited on 1/23/24 at 8:57 am
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:57 am to Soggymoss
quote:
We will have to agree to disagree.
Y’all try to say this and that but Embiid last night scored 70 on 41 shots and only two of those were 3’s. He also had 23 free throws.
Zion shoots 41 shots with his average percentage he scores 50. Add in his 70ish percent free throw shooting on 23 attempts thats an additional 16 points.
So if Zion shoots the same amount as those guys he’s literally scoring the same.
The issue is our offense and coaching staff doesn’t feed him when he’s hot to let him get that amount of shots up, and usually as soon as he gets hot Willie pulls him out of the game instead of riding him.
I dont think Zion's playstyle would allow him to shoot 41 times. It takes a lot of energy to get a head of steam and barrel your way to the basket. It takes a lot less energy to hit midranges and 3s which Embiid is able to mix into his shot attempts.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 8:59 am to Balsamic_duck
quote:
I dont think Zion's playstyle would allow him to shoot 41 times. It takes a lot of energy to get a head of steam and barrel your way to the basket. It takes a lot less energy to hit midranges and 3s which Embiid is able to mix into his shot attempts.
The thing is we have ways to get Zion easy shots such as the plays where we give him the ball while he’s already headed to the basket which burns literally nothing in energy for him, but we don’t run it nearly enough, just like we don’t run P&R action with him and CJ or BI enough either.
Zion has to take tough shots because they don’t run the correct plays for him all the time.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:02 am to Soggymoss
quote:
Zion has to take tough shots because they don’t run the correct plays for him all the time.
Laying it all at the feet of coaching when it comes to Zion is a wild take.
Fact of the matter is, Zion should be so much better than he is in year 5, some of it does fall on coaching and roster construction, but the brunt of it falls on Zion for being an immature child who doesn’t appear to really want to work towards being the most dominant player in the league.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:03 am to Broski
quote:The only dude I can think of recently that can get to 60 without that game is Giannis.
‘Embiid also has a vastly more robust offense.
But even that isn't a fair comparison to Zion. As relentless as we think Zion is, Giannis is 10x more relentless. Plus Giannis has the conditioning it takes to bang down low and get shot after shot after shot up with that physicality.
Zion would likely be gassed and not be able to continue attacking at that kind of rate. He just doesn't have the conditioning to keep that up. Think about it, even now where we say his conditioning is coming around, on a normal game load, Zion is still huffing and puffing after he plays 6 minutes straight. Now double the work load, how would that work?
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:08 am to shel311
I still think back to his debut and how that was the biggest okie doke in Pels history.
No I didn’t expect him to become a 3-pt sniper by now, but I did expect him to at least be able to hit an elbow jumper on a pick n pop.
No I didn’t expect him to become a 3-pt sniper by now, but I did expect him to at least be able to hit an elbow jumper on a pick n pop.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:10 am to Broski
quote:
JUST JN: Miami is nearing a trade to acquire Charlotte's Terry Rozier for a package sending Kyle Lowry and draft compensation that includes a first-round pick, league sources tell @TheAthletic @Stadium.
quote:
The Charlotte Hornets are trading Terry Rozier to the Miami Heat for a 2027 first-round pick and Kyle Lowry, sources tell ESPN.
This post was edited on 1/23/24 at 9:11 am
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:11 am to Soggymoss
Miami is going to be nasty with Rozier.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:13 am to supe12sta12z
Really good move by Miami. Lowry is washed and Rozier has been fantastic this year. He'll look even better playing off Jimmy and Bam
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:23 am to Balsamic_duck
That is a good move. Rozier can get buckets on his own, and that's really what Miami was missing next to Butler, as Herro is too inconsistent.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:25 am to Soggymoss
quote:
Zion has to take tough shots because they don’t run the correct plays for him all the time.
You dont think that has anything to do with the fact that he doesnt shoot outside 3 feet?
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:35 am to Balsamic_duck
I don’t know, Rozier has always scared me as a player. He’s 45.9% from the field and only 35.8% from three. But that field goal percent is the highest of his entire career. Last year he was 41.5%! From the field and 32.7% from three. To me, if his numbers dip at all from where he is at now, he becomes a negative player really quickly. And that’s still a decent sized contract, a good vet out the door and one of the few picks remaining for the Heat. It’s an interesting and risky deal.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:40 am to PELsu
Let’s put it this way, if we traded Larry Nance, and a first round pick and were then locked into $25 million a year for two years after this one for Terry Rozier, we would be burning Griff right now.
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:49 am to PELsu
The need for a guy like Rozier is obviously dependent on the team. Rozier has a 5 year sample size in Charlotte that tells you his 41% isn't the norm. That 22-23 Charlotte team was injury riddled and lacked talent especially with Bridges out the entire year.
In Miami, they don't need or want Rozier to be a 20+ppg scorer or a lead scorer. They want a reliable threat that can step up when the matchup calls for it and a guy who can play off of Butler. He check those boxes.
In Miami, they don't need or want Rozier to be a 20+ppg scorer or a lead scorer. They want a reliable threat that can step up when the matchup calls for it and a guy who can play off of Butler. He check those boxes.
This post was edited on 1/23/24 at 9:52 am
Posted on 1/23/24 at 9:49 am to PELsu
quote:Certainly but different teams have different needs.
Let’s put it this way, if we traded Larry Nance, and a first round pick and were then locked into $25 million a year for two years after this one for Terry Rozier, we would be burning Griff right now.
Swapping Lowry for Rozier right now is a pretty solid upgrade.
We'd be swapping solid player minutes, not a washed Lowry.
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