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Message
re: Jrue Holiday trade
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:20 pm to ShamelessPel
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:20 pm to ShamelessPel
quote:
Well for one. We gave up 2 1st rd picks, including a top 5 pick, to invest 4years/42million in one player vs having 2 young guys on rookie contracts. You can also look at what we could have gotten with the extra 8 million in cap space.
Noel wasn't a top 5 pick and we aren't giving our pick next year if it is top 5 so...
1
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:22 pm to ShamelessPel
You have to factor in the $$ perspective to truly debate the trade at this point.
This post was edited on 11/21/13 at 12:23 pm
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:22 pm to JimmyLoincloth
quote:
Not as much better as many people think. He gets more steals, but he just hasn't been the harassing PG that many people give him credit for. He has a tendency to get lazy and our rotations are really not that much better than last year.
Vasquez is nowhere close to the defender that Holiday is. Those are just a couple of numbers that might make it look like that is true. Holiday is better offensively and defensively. A main reason Holiday's numbers are down from last year is because he is playing about 6 less minutes per game than he did last season (and about 3 less than Vasquez did last season) which is a great number since I think we are just seeing the start of how good the Pelicans' 2nd team can be.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:26 pm to danman6336
quote:
This far into the season, it looks like the Sixers played us like a fricking fiddle on that trade
absolutely, but it's very early and Jrue has looked much better the last couple of games.
...if Jrue returns to last year form, Noel turns into Bismack Biyombo (don't know much about Noel, but you get the point), and the Sixers get the 15th pick, then we played them like a fiddle.
That trade SCREAMS win-now/playoffs now though of course. If we fail to compete for a playoff spot, then the team failed in many ways, and it's time for some changes.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:27 pm to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
Noel wasn't a top 5 pick
c'mon man
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:29 pm to drake20
quote:
c'mon man
I mean...he wasn't...
5 teams passed on him.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:29 pm to tigerfan88
quote:
Bc so far MCW has been practically as good as Jrue.
...pump the brakes on Jrue's sub par 11 games and MCW's up and down 11 games.
Jrue was an all star last season...don't jump to conclusions on Jrue or MCW yet
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:30 pm to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
I mean...he wasn't...
5 teams passed on him.
you don't say...
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:31 pm to drake20
quote:
you don't say...
I do...Apparently others don't. Really confusing to me.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:32 pm to Noplacelikehome
I didn't like the trade at first, but it kind of grew on me over time. I still think Davis and Holiday are a nice foundation to build on. They just need to develop a little more chemistry and Holiday needs to be more careful with the ball (something that comes with age fortunately). I wish we would have paid a little less, but it's too late for all that now.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:33 pm to drake20
Oh I agree with that and I don't think we necessarily got trade raped. I'm just think if that is someone's opinion MCW excellent start to the season probably has something to do with that
Posted on 11/21/13 at 12:42 pm to tigerfan88
quote:
Bc so far MCW has been practically as good as Jrue.
Of all qualified players in the NBA Carter-Williams is 125th out of 132 in FG% and is bottom 5 among PGs. That that will catch up to him eventually and is not "practically as good as Jrue."
quote:
The most disappointing part for me with Holiday is his defensive effort. I expected him to give the effort we've seen from Tyreke on defense, not the other way around.
Haha. The team defensively gets better with Holiday on the floor and worse with Tyreke on the floor and the numbers prove that.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:04 pm to Noplacelikehome
quote:
Of all qualified players in the NBA Carter-Williams is 125th out of 132 in FG%
He's doing things in many categories, and he's a rookie...honestly, he's doing better than a lot of people were expecting in FG% after how terrible he was in pre-season stuff...and again, it's just 11 games.
Also, Jrue's FG% has been terrible, too...not arguing MCW over Jrue at all, but a lot of this just doesn't mean too much at this point.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:16 pm to Billy Mays
quote:
You have to factor in the $$ perspective to truly debate the trade at this point.
How else are you going to get a 23 year old PG who has already made an All-Star team and has been chosen to attend the USA showcase where he may have shown to be the best all around PG at the camp with his defense and 12 points, seven rebounds, and five assists in the Blue and White game.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:30 pm to drake20
quote:
Also, Jrue's FG% has been terrible, too
Among guards, being in top half of the league isn't terrible.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:35 pm to Large Farva
quote:
is anyone kind of thinking back on this trade
Yes.
And I think that any GM who went out his way to put Jrue Holiday, Eric Gordon and Tyreke Evans on the same team should've been fired on the spot.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:38 pm to voinovich
quote:
And I think that any GM who went out his way to put Jrue Holiday, Eric Gordon and Tyreke Evans on the same team should've been fired on the spot.
Reasonable thinker we have here lol
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:38 pm to Noplacelikehome
quote:
Vasquez is nowhere close to the defender that Holiday is capable of being
The problem is that Holiday has not played up to his potential or reputation on the defensive end.
quote:
Holiday is better offensively
Absolutely not true and the numbers bear it out. Even without the only defensive stats that PER recognizes, Vasquez has a higher PER than Holiday.
quote:
A main reason Holiday's numbers are down from last year is because he is playing about 6 less minutes per game than he did last season (and about 3 less than Vasquez did last season) which is a great number since I think we are just seeing the start of how good the Pelicans' 2nd team can be.
Vasquez is playing less, too. Feel free to compare them objectively.
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:38 pm to Noplacelikehome
quote:
How else are you going to get a 23 year old PG who has already made an All-Star team and has been chosen to attend the USA showcase where he may have shown to be the best all around PG at the camp with his defense and 12 points, seven rebounds, and five assists in the Blue and White game.
What he's saying is it isn't 2 picks vs. Holiday, it's 2 picks and about $6 million in cap space vs. Holiday
Posted on 11/21/13 at 1:41 pm to brmark70816
quote:
Holiday needs to be more careful with the ball (something that comes with age fortunately)
This season and last season have been his highest turnover rates of his career. I think at this point, he's just turnover prone. It's just something we're going to have to deal with.
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