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Message
1
Posted on 6/12/21 at 3:20 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
think those things that Naji is better at are more important than the things that Hart is good at. And Naji was a rookie and can be expected to improve.
Now, I like Hart and his toughness, and I also don't see any reason that he and Naji can't be on the floor together, so I'm not against bringing Hart back, but I also don't see it as important.
And maybe the front office doesn't either.
The thing is I'm not paying hart more than 9 or 10 mil
Posted on 6/12/21 at 3:28 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
But I’ve been saying for awhile... can WE afford to pay Hart and Lonzo? We had both on rookie deals and we sucked. How would paying them a huge amount of money make us better?
I’ve said the same thing and people disagreed. I think one of them is gone for sure, maybe both. I’m hoping a sign and trade materializes for Lonzo.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 4:47 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:For this team, I would too. However, I bet Trent gets paid more than Hart.
I'll take gary trent jr for hart
Posted on 6/12/21 at 5:55 pm to htran90
quote:
He doesn't do any of those things you list consistently outside of rebounding and hustling.
62% at the rim. The only issue is that he didn't do it more because the spacing wasn't there for him.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 6:13 pm to whatiknowsofar
Lonzo and Bledsoe were around 58% as well. That just means the team gets a lot of opportunities because of the attention Zion and Ingram gets. Hart made a living off of forcing 1 man transition. He doesn't have the handles to get to the basket at a high rate especially in the halfcourt.
Posted on 6/12/21 at 7:27 pm to whatiknowsofar
Yeah ole baw is a bucket at the rim. Hart actually has a bag in terms of layups. One of the best layup guards we’ve ever had on the Pels. I’m actually surprised it’s only 62%. Hart makes a bunch of layups I don’t necessarily expect him to make and I don’t really remember him mossing any egregious attempts.
All that being said, Hart is a tough guy to figure out a value for bc he’s another guy with zero shooting gravity. Sometimes he’s on fire and sometimes he’s 0-9. I will say though, I’ve never really sat through a game and thought damn, Hart is really the reason why we lost tonight. I can’t say the same thing about the majority of our other players.
All that being said, Hart is a tough guy to figure out a value for bc he’s another guy with zero shooting gravity. Sometimes he’s on fire and sometimes he’s 0-9. I will say though, I’ve never really sat through a game and thought damn, Hart is really the reason why we lost tonight. I can’t say the same thing about the majority of our other players.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 1:35 pm to shel311
quote:
I don't know what to say, if you think Hart is worth a max of $3.5mil a year
You dont have to say anything, other than what you think he is worth and why? Im just not sure how much an NBA team is going to hang their hat on rebounding rate
It will go one of two ways imo
He will get a decent payday from a bag team and he will continue to operate under the guise of being some major contributor
Or he will take a lot less from a really good team and actually be a difference maker off the bench for them
quote:
hart is a case where his willingness to try hard endears to fans.
hey, you made a good post
Posted on 6/13/21 at 1:50 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:You don't have to be a "major contributor" to be worth more than $3.5 million. You can be an average contributor and your value fair market value is more than double that.
He will get a decent payday from a bag team and he will continue to operate under the guise of being some major contributor
quote:
You dont have to say anything, other than what you think he is worth and why? Im just not sure how much an NBA team is going to hang their hat on rebounding rate
He's, at worse, darn near an average player. $3.5 mil is more of a replacement level player. You seem to think the only thing he does at at least an average rate is rebound, which isn't the case. He's not a below average defender. He's right around average efficient shooting, which most people probably don't realize. If you do a few things at an average rate, a couple at an above average rate, and one thing at an elite rate, and you aren't at peak age yet you're quite obviously going to be more valuable than $3.5 million, or less than half of the league average salary.
quote:I didn't even say that, but nice try and whiff on the put down.
hey, you made a good post
This post was edited on 6/13/21 at 1:53 pm
Posted on 6/13/21 at 2:03 pm to Soggymoss
4/48 is even too much honestly and I’m the biggest Hart fan. I think the team should make it a priority to bring him back because he energizes the team with his play and he can guard 1-4 maybe not at an elite level but he’s not bad either. Yes Naji could be the cheap replacement for Hart but I also think having 2 of those high energy balls to the wall wings wouldn’t be a bad thing. They both need to improve their 3 point shots though. We need 37% and up type shooters.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 2:40 pm to LSUJD_04
I like a josh Hart a lot. Good locker room guy and a guy that every team would love on the roster.
That said, if I’m Griff I draw a line in the sand with an offer. If someone else wants to give him anything more than you’re willing, let him walk. Be glad that you got 80% of him for less than 10% of the contract in Naji.
That said, if I’m Griff I draw a line in the sand with an offer. If someone else wants to give him anything more than you’re willing, let him walk. Be glad that you got 80% of him for less than 10% of the contract in Naji.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 2:47 pm to LSUJD_04
I think 4 for 48 is too much.
I don't even like giving him 9 a year.
I don't even like giving him 9 a year.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 2:53 pm to Chalkywhite84
I like mike james of the nets
Wonder what his contract looks like
Wonder what his contract looks like
Posted on 6/13/21 at 5:43 pm to shel311
quote:
He's, at worse, darn near an average player. $3.5 mil is more of a replacement level player.
Buddy played 112 G here at 27.7 mpg, to the tune of a 12 PER. That isn’t swell, and he would not get that opportunity to be that meh many more places on that many minutes. You’re definition of average doesn’t mesh with mine. Johnny Hollinger has a league average player at 15, and the dandy little PER chart would tell ya a guy in the 11-13 PER range is a “non rotation player”. We are just talking about a quantifiable metric here, no real gray area.
And look, you’ve have better players scuffling for jobs, taking $2,3,4 mil per. You see a guy like Frank Kaminsky contributing to a contender for pennies, or a Bobby Portis in the reg season for the Bucks. Do you think Hart is a more valuable player than those types of guys?
quote:
I didn't even say that, but nice try and whiff on the put down.
You think I was making up some quote to attribute to you
Celtic guy made that post a few entries ago 
Posted on 6/13/21 at 5:52 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
And look, you’ve have better players scuffling for jobs, taking $2,3,4 mil per. You see a guy like Frank Kaminsky contributing to a contender for pennies, or a Bobby Portis in the reg season for the Bucks. Do you think Hart is a more valuable player than those types of guys?
The Pels haven't won enough to attract those kinds of players though. We do this all the time here, a few outliers show you in theory could have gotten a better deal, but that's just in theory. Demps spent years trying to catch vet minimum lightning in a bottle for both SFs and Cs and it never worked. Players that would come to the Pels cheap are just a different caliber so it's not a realistic comparison.
The Pels do have leverage on Hart with him being an RFA, but Hart has a move to play too. He could just sign the QO and wait a year to become a UF. If you offered Hart anything less than probably $8 per year I could see him signing the QO. If you're fine losing Hart let him walk or do a S&T, but keeping him at the same price a contender could sign him for just doesn't seem like a realistic standard to use.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 6:27 pm to TigerinATL
Crazy that seth curry and pj tucker only make 7.8 mil a year.
No way am i paying josh hart even 9 mil.
The fact that some on here want to give him 4/48 is nuts.
Kinda crazy when some on here talk about josh hart his best attribute is he is an elite rebounder for a guard.
No way am i paying josh hart even 9 mil.
The fact that some on here want to give him 4/48 is nuts.
Kinda crazy when some on here talk about josh hart his best attribute is he is an elite rebounder for a guard.
This post was edited on 6/13/21 at 6:32 pm
Posted on 6/13/21 at 6:39 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:If you think Hart us worth $3.5 million max, if argue your definition of average doesn't Med with probably 99% of folks out there. Not an insult, just an obvious observation.
You’re definition of average doesn’t mesh with mine.
quote:And you think PER is always spot on?
Johnny Hollinger has a league average player at 15, and the dandy little PER chart would tell ya a guy in the 11-13 PER range is a “non rotation player”. We are just talking about a quantifiable metric here, no real gray area.
quote:Kaminsky, yes u do think Hart has mroe value than him. Portis will probably get a decent contract this offseason, so not sure about that comparison.
You see a guy like Frank Kaminsky contributing to a contender for pennies, or a Bobby Portis in the reg season for the Bucks. Do you think Hart is a more valuable player than those types of guys?
quote:How long you been on these boards... And simple quoting of the right person is still something you're working on figuring out?
You think I was making up some quote to attribute to you Celtic guy made that post a few entries ago
Posted on 6/13/21 at 6:43 pm to TigerinATL
quote:I thought the QO was only something he and Zo could have done last offseason, after year 3?
but Hart has a move to play too. He could just sign the QO and wait a year to become a UF. If you offered Hart anything less than probably $8 per year I could see him signing the QO.
All the talk about Zion maybe being the first to turn down a max for the QO, wouldn't that come next offseason?
Posted on 6/13/21 at 6:51 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:Not sure if I'm misreading but are you stating that you think PJ Tucker has a good bit more value than Josh Hart?
Crazy that seth curry and pj tucker only make 7.8 mil a year.
No way am i paying josh hart even 9 mil.
Posted on 6/13/21 at 6:59 pm to shel311
quote:
And you think PER is always spot on?
PER really doesn't capture defense much at all.
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