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RUFshreve
LSU Fan
Shree'pote
Member since Jul 2016
1378 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Jesus, how many shite for brains are on this forum?

That trade is laughably stupid for the Pelicans and a god send for GSW. frick that shite all day.

Why don't we just trade Zion now and get it over with? We could get assets that could make us better in the future!


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182
theducks
Alabama Fan
Where The Blazers Play
Member since Aug 2013
12042 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Hot take: Are we sure that Wiseman will be better than Hayes at this point? Maybe I’m a bit high on Hayes ceiling. Hayes also compliments Zion defensively MUCH better than Wiseman does. Wiseman was terrible last year. Completely lost defensively and he was in a situation where all he had to do was not be a liability. Imagine him without Draymond cleaning up his messes.

Ingram is a stud. In no universe is Wiggins going to replace him. Literally every con to Ingram was a con of Wiggins but he was less talented as a scorer. “Empty stats” “terrible defender though he looks good at times”. Kuminga is the only real positive to this trade. Is that worth Ingram and Hayes? No.


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142
GOP_Tiger
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
8938 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

Instantly would make the Warriors the top team in the west and the Pelicans the worst


No, we wouldn't instantly be the worst, because we'd still have Zion this year. We'd only be the worst the following year after Zion leaves.


TeddyPadillac
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Dec 2010
19695 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Would get on a plane, fly to San Fran, find Bob Myers, laugh in his face, come back home and respond to the email he sent about this trade with a simple, no.


CelticDog
LSU Fan
Member since Apr 2015
35463 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

With this trade two years max and we are in the WCF. We would have multiple defenders , guys that can score from anywhere and ball handlers also JV and wiseman would be able to play together whenever we need to go big


looks like there's two of us with you.
I don't like ingram as much as most.
if you think ingram hasn't reached his ceiling it's a bad deal.
also one thread poster says hayes > Wiseman. if so the trade is bad.
I figure Wiseman >> hayes.

onward. thanks all for playing.


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23
NOSHAU
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Feb 2012
8886 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Really stupid thread title. How about put "speculation" or something of that nature in the title.


Macintosh504
Hawaii Fan
Loving Spirits University
Member since Sep 2011
46150 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
I wouldn’t even call this speculation


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CelticDog
LSU Fan
Member since Apr 2015
35463 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

How about put "speculation" or something of that nature in the title.


it's the first sentence in the thread


CelticDog
LSU Fan
Member since Apr 2015
35463 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

We probably go from 11th-12th seed to about 10th and so much better set for the future. I really like it..


fwiw there are no seeds 11 or 12.
seed is a playoff feature.

I agree it improves pels.
looks like 2 to 1 against.


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01
SCP
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2016
1152 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Bleacher report authors dream up stupid stuff so they get clicks. Avoid wasting time on this crap.


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CelticDog
LSU Fan
Member since Apr 2015
35463 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

Avoid wasting time on this crap.


I like the trade for pels.
so do 1/3rd of replies.


Dantheman504
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
N/A
Member since Jun 2013
1929 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
So are you just stating that 2/3rds of the people in here have a higher IQ?


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aswemajor
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since May 2011
1310 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
Okay how I’m organizing this:

Hayes and Sat for Wiseman. That looks close enough to even.

So really it comes down to

Ingram for Wiggins and Kuminga.

Definitely would set us back. I’m not the biggest Kuminga fan, he’s the biggest project of the top 9 picks, but with unquestionable upside. Kid can jump out the gym, and I see a bit of young Iggy in him.

We know what Wiggins is. Ingram is already a star and he’s the best player in the deal. If we’re tryna keep Zion here, we definitely hold our guys. Certainly would not do the trade but it’s an interesting thought exercise and a potentially good deal if Zion were to force his way out.



Bronc
Member since Sep 2018
5650 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
You know it's the dead period when a thread like this is the top topic lol...and somehow made it to page 2.

Absolutely bottom of the Warriors message board barrel trade idea.


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NawlinsTiger9
New Orleans Saints Fan
Where the mongooses roam
Member since Jan 2009
31516 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
frickkkkkkk that


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brmark70816
LSU Fan
Atlanta, GA
Member since Feb 2011
7119 posts
 Online 

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
How is Ingram a star? Has he ever been the best player on a team? Has he ever been on a winning team? Does half of casual fans know who he is? Has he ever been a marque player on a televised game?

Guys keep saying this. He shouldn't be a max player. He is a 3rd/4th option on a contending team. We are hamstrung having him on a max and are scrambling to shoehorn in another high level player that can complement Zion.

I doubt this is the best value for Ingram. But it is a nice haul and I like having the conversation about tweaking the cast around Zion. What we are doing isn't working...


htran90
New Orleans Saints Fan
BC
Member since Dec 2012
27233 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

How is Ingram a star? Has he ever been the best player on a team? Has he ever been on a winning team? Does half of casual fans know who he is? Has he ever been a marque player on a televised game?



You could definitely argue his first season as a pelican he was the best player, considering Zion didn't play in much of it at all.

overall best stats, PER, WS/48, BPM, VORP

No he has not been on a winning team, you gonna blame that all on him? Because the teams he has been on has been ATROCIOUS as well. Drafted by a 17 win lakers and traded to a rebuilding pelicans team isn't the 'ideal situation' no?

quote:

Guys keep saying this. He shouldn't be a max player.


Eh, he's the 10th highest paid SF. I'd say he's rightfully paid. Max is a relative thing.

quote:

We are hamstrung having him on a max and are scrambling to shoehorn in another high level player that can complement Zion.


Yeah, we are 100% not hamstrung with him being a max player. Being hamstrung is what teams like Portland (with CJ McCollum), Philly (with Simmons/Harris), Wolves (with Wiggins before they traded; even now with DLo), etc

We still have the ability/capability to make moves to improve this team.

quote:

I doubt this is the best value for Ingram. But it is a nice haul and I like having the conversation about tweaking the cast around Zion. What we are doing isn't working...



If this isn't the best value for Ingram, than you're saying he's actually pretty valuable all things considered. He may not be a superstar, but he's a solid #2 option. The issue is how zion and ingram complement each other because both lack the same thing (poor defense, not a primary facilitator).

Ingram for example was a top 20 scorer last year. He was also one of 12 players to put up 23.8/4.9/4.9. And of those 12, 9 shot at least 45/35/80

That's pretty valuable from an offensive standpoint considering he had to adjust his game into becoming a more outside player


CelticDog
LSU Fan
Member since Apr 2015
35463 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

ingram had to adjust his game into becoming a more outside player


a lot of TD lineups have Ingram at the 2 for coming season.
i would love someone to explain why.

my ideal 2 can play serious on ball defense.
secondary playmaker.
and scores.
he scores.

This post was edited on 9/12 at 8:36 am


aswemajor
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since May 2011
1310 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

How is Ingram a star?


He’s a star because it’s clear watching him that he can be a top 3 player on a championship team. I agree he needs to learn how to play off the ball but the guy is a bucket. Guys with offensive skills like his at his size are very hard to come by.

This team is desperate for a guard who can facilitate the offense and get our bigs in plus situations. Same problem we had with AD. Our best players, Zion and BI, aren’t point guards so there is an extra step to getting them the ball.

Added rondo to the team and we saw what happened. We’d be a lock for the playoffs if we had a guy like that. It’s not really asking for that much honestly. Conley or Lowry woulda done wonders for this squad. Man screw being in a small market, pisses me off.





Bronc
Member since Sep 2018
5650 posts

re: ingram for wiggins Wiseman and kuminga. * speculation of bleacher report.
quote:

a lot of TD lineups have Ingram at the 2 for coming season.
i would love someone to explain why.


I’d argue(and have) that the ideal lineup for Zion/Ingram would be something akin to

Haliburton/Brogdon (or a Lillard type of you are so lucky).
Ingram
Hunter/Brown type
Zion
(prime)Horford/KAT(not ideal defensively but unstoppable offensively)/Jaren Jackson/(prime) Ibaka

For me you don’t just put Ingram at the two to put him there, and more accurately, it’s really just for depth chart purposes. Really what you want around Zion/Ingram are versatile defenders(KAT and Lillard notwithstanding) that can switch, knock down shots, move the ball, and some guys that can give you some playmaking, rebounding, and run the offense.

Ingram at the 2 requires a Boston Celtics type situation where you also have another dynamic forward that can switch/guard 1-4’s. Like a Hunter can do. Since Ingram isn’t going to be covering a lot of dynamic guards well you’d ideally want a guy like Haliburton that can catch the more difficult guard match up defensively, and Hunter grabs the more dynamic forward. Ingram grabs your third best perimeter player and Zion does his best on whoever while your center keeps the rim protected but can hedge and recover and switch a little, while not being a clog on the offense.

Which is why it is imperative to develop Hayes into a shooter, it’s simply not enough for him to just be a more athletic/dynamic Nerlens Noel if he is gonna be in our long term plans.




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