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Started By
Message
the ugly truth behind music streaming services
Posted on 6/13/17 at 11:26 am
Posted on 6/13/17 at 11:26 am
it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out you're getting ripped off.
to whit:
PROBLEM same shite all the time. with supposedly 'millions' of songs in the pandora/google music/spotify databases you should never fricking hear the same song again for months..certainly not 2 or 3x in the same week
REASON music services are like netflix, they make deals with the industry and the shite/overplayed/CHEAPEST REVENUE ARRANGEMENT songs show up ALL THE frickING TIME because they are GARBAGE tracks. i bet every single person opening this thread has heard that "JUST BREATHE....JUST BELIEVE" shite song 100x if you have any type of ambient/zero7/chill/etc radio station defined. THAT frickING SONG SHOWS UP ON EVERY ONE OF THOSE STATIONS CONSTANTLY.
YOU WILL NEVER GET EXPOSED TO ANYTHING NEW. sorry, but its true. enjoy your small little music world that songs alot like FM radio.
PROBLEM the songs are weird. they are longer or don't sound the way you remember.
REASON artists are tied up in decades' long contracts with record companies and so they record a new shitty version of their song for spotify/whatever and release it there. so long original songs.
PROBLEM you will never get exotic music (razormaid remixes come to mind), foreign tracks, etc. they simply do not show up in the services selections
REASON see 2nd reason above. too much trouble, too expensive to go find that belgium club sound from the late 80s so its never gonna happen. its as if that music never existed.
PROBLEM no deep tracks. ever.
REASON while you can PAINSTAKENLY curate a playlist with selected albums from an artist and set it to play random, the fact is these services WILLFULLY HIDE those songs and they will never ever ever ever play in the normal course of streaming an 'artist station' or 'song station' or even 'genre station'.
in short, streaming music is killing good music. i have roughly 30,000 tracks of my own uploaded to google music and i can set up playlists based off a random genre (like jazz for instance) and the quality of the radio station is astounding because i'm not being redirected to the LEAST EXPENSIVE frickING shite by the streaming services algorithm. amazing that my jazz collection which is maybe a couple thousand songs seemingly NEVER EVER REPEATS A TRACK. so why do streaming services? Hmm? WHY?
as another example I recently went to my favorite 'curated' music site on the web *ahem* and downloaded a 10-album 1970s collection and set it up in a playlist. everyone was BLOWN AWAY that came over the night it was playing because there was so many good songs that you never hear played on any streaming service...why? because streaming services are all the same and none of them truly base their algorithms off good music..its all based off $$$$$$$.
i've said my peace. streaming sucks. i'm back to manually pulling music.
to whit:
PROBLEM same shite all the time. with supposedly 'millions' of songs in the pandora/google music/spotify databases you should never fricking hear the same song again for months..certainly not 2 or 3x in the same week
REASON music services are like netflix, they make deals with the industry and the shite/overplayed/CHEAPEST REVENUE ARRANGEMENT songs show up ALL THE frickING TIME because they are GARBAGE tracks. i bet every single person opening this thread has heard that "JUST BREATHE....JUST BELIEVE" shite song 100x if you have any type of ambient/zero7/chill/etc radio station defined. THAT frickING SONG SHOWS UP ON EVERY ONE OF THOSE STATIONS CONSTANTLY.
YOU WILL NEVER GET EXPOSED TO ANYTHING NEW. sorry, but its true. enjoy your small little music world that songs alot like FM radio.
PROBLEM the songs are weird. they are longer or don't sound the way you remember.
REASON artists are tied up in decades' long contracts with record companies and so they record a new shitty version of their song for spotify/whatever and release it there. so long original songs.
PROBLEM you will never get exotic music (razormaid remixes come to mind), foreign tracks, etc. they simply do not show up in the services selections
REASON see 2nd reason above. too much trouble, too expensive to go find that belgium club sound from the late 80s so its never gonna happen. its as if that music never existed.
PROBLEM no deep tracks. ever.
REASON while you can PAINSTAKENLY curate a playlist with selected albums from an artist and set it to play random, the fact is these services WILLFULLY HIDE those songs and they will never ever ever ever play in the normal course of streaming an 'artist station' or 'song station' or even 'genre station'.
in short, streaming music is killing good music. i have roughly 30,000 tracks of my own uploaded to google music and i can set up playlists based off a random genre (like jazz for instance) and the quality of the radio station is astounding because i'm not being redirected to the LEAST EXPENSIVE frickING shite by the streaming services algorithm. amazing that my jazz collection which is maybe a couple thousand songs seemingly NEVER EVER REPEATS A TRACK. so why do streaming services? Hmm? WHY?
as another example I recently went to my favorite 'curated' music site on the web *ahem* and downloaded a 10-album 1970s collection and set it up in a playlist. everyone was BLOWN AWAY that came over the night it was playing because there was so many good songs that you never hear played on any streaming service...why? because streaming services are all the same and none of them truly base their algorithms off good music..its all based off $$$$$$$.
i've said my peace. streaming sucks. i'm back to manually pulling music.
This post was edited on 6/13/17 at 11:31 am
16
Posted on 6/13/17 at 11:34 am to CAD703X
I don't like streaming. I like to physically own my music and choose the stuff I want to play.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 11:49 am to CAD703X
This post should be the followup to my post the other day about record labels and radio stations.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:01 pm to CAD703X
quote:
PROBLEM same shite all the time. with supposedly 'millions' of songs in the pandora/google music/spotify databases you should never fricking hear the same song again for months..certainly not 2 or 3x in the same week
You are talking about streaming radio services, which is not the same as streaming music services. Spotify's main draw is not its radio. Pandora is actually pretty good if you spend time customizing your station. If you just do a station based on a song or artist, then you won't get much out of it if you use it for a long time. If you spend time thumbs up / thumbs down songs and add other similar artists to your station, then you will get something great.
quote:
YOU WILL NEVER GET EXPOSED TO ANYTHING NEW. sorry, but its true. enjoy your small little music world that songs alot like FM radio.
This is laughable. I've discovered several artists through Pandora, specifically Hudson Bell. Your radio stations are only as good as you make them.
quote:
PROBLEM you will never get exotic music (razormaid remixes come to mind), foreign tracks, etc. they simply do not show up in the services selections
So what? I don't expect to for $10 / month. If I want something exotic, I'll go get it. I don't expect this either from Netflix, Amazon Prime Video, etc.
quote:
its as if that music never existed.
Maybe to people who aren't big fans of an artists...yeah. quote:
PROBLEM no deep tracks. ever.
Once again, this is only specific to streaming radio services, and even then, I disagree.
quote:
because streaming services are all the same and none of them truly base their algorithms off good music
How do you suppose a streaming radio service can base an algorithm off of "good music"? The algorithm is based on available music and user choices. Some do it well, others don't.
You need to change your subject, because your gripe seems to be about streaming radio, not streaming music services. Spotify is an amazing deal. I used to download everything, add to itunes, add to my phone or ipod, but there's only so much space on my phone or ipod and it's just a pain to have to do all that. I'll gladly pay $10 / month to have access to stream 95% of the music that I like at just about any point in time.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:04 pm to chasmania
quote:
I don't like streaming. I like to physically own my music and choose the stuff I want to play.
I do both...
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:15 pm to SUB
quote:
You are talking about streaming radio services, which is not the same as streaming music services. Spotify's main draw is not its radio. Pandora is actually pretty good if you spend time customizing your station. If you just do a station based on a song or artist, then you won't get much out of it if you use it for a long time. If you spend time thumbs up / thumbs down songs and add other similar artists to your station, then you will get something great.
no, no you won't. i've had a pandora account for probably 10+ years (starting on the PC) and thumbed-up/down for ages and my wife pulls up a station from an account she just created and there's virtually no difference.
quote:
This is laughable. I've discovered several artists through Pandora, specifically Hudson Bell. Your radio stations are only as good as you make them.
by 'thumbs up and downing' you're actually doing the opposite..further limiting what you hear so i don't get this. sure i discovered new artists on pandora...like 10 years ago..but nothing new in ages.
quote:
If I want something exotic, I'll go get it
where exactly?
quote:
Maybe to people who aren't big fans of an artists...yeah.
where are the services catering to fans of non-mainstream music? can you list the sites?
quote:
Once again, this is only specific to streaming radio services, and even then, I disagree.
would LOVE you to prove me wrong on this. link?
quote:
How do you suppose a streaming radio service can base an algorithm off of "good music"? The algorithm is based on available music and user choices. Some do it well, others don't.
no, they all do it based on the best revenue sharing model. fact.
quote:
You need to change your subject, because your gripe seems to be about streaming radio, not streaming music services. Spotify is an amazing deal. I used to download everything, add to itunes, add to my phone or ipod, but there's only so much space on my phone or ipod and it's just a pain to have to do all that. I'll gladly pay $10 / month to have access to stream 95% of the music that I like at just about any point in time.
same thing. yes you can 'pin' albums on spotify the UI is a trainwreck and you're back to manually curating anything you want to hear.
you mean to tell me you pinned those 3 tears for fears albums but you don't get tired of them or try to start an artist radio to get something more out of it?
its dumb to make a distinction between access to an album via streaming and 'streaming radio'. they're one in the same.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:16 pm to CAD703X
quote:
PROBLEM same shite all the time. with supposedly 'millions' of songs in the pandora/google music/spotify databases you should never fricking hear the same song again for months..certainly not 2 or 3x in the same week
Using Spotify for radio is a bad idea. Use it like iTunes and it will be worth the monthly payment. Also, I suggest making the monthly payment for premium.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:16 pm to SUB
quote:
You are talking about streaming radio services, which is not the same as streaming music services. Spotify's main draw is not its radio. Pandora is actually pretty good if you spend time customizing your station. If you just do a station based on a song or artist, then you won't get much out of it if you use it for a long time. If you spend time thumbs up / thumbs down songs and add other similar artists to your station, then you will get something great.
This. I have a pandora station (Crash Kings Radio) that I spent a lot of time upvoting and downvoting on. Now, it's really great.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:26 pm to CAD703X
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:48 pm to CAD703X
I have discovered quite a few unique bands (King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard, 3, Thank You Scientist) listening to Google Music's streaming service.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 12:55 pm to Jester
i think i noticed the problem sooner because i have some fairly eccentric musical tastes so its obvious there are large gaping holes when you're not content to listen to the latest chainsmokers, justin bieber or katy perry on repeat.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 1:11 pm to CAD703X
quote:
when you're not content to listen to the latest chainsmokers, justin bieber or katy perry on repeat
If you have eccentric music taste and are actually getting justin bieber and katy perry on your streaming stations, then I don't think you are using the service correctly. I'm sure you are just exaggerating...
Posted on 6/13/17 at 1:28 pm to CAD703X
I love iHeartRadio, don't pay anything for it, and find new stuff all the time. In fact, I may cancel Sirius, and actually pay for iHeart.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 1:53 pm to CAD703X
heady has been paying me $20/month for years to sign into his pandora account and downvote everything on the phish station that isn't phish, but WSP still sometimes shows up. it's just all about the money, man.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 1:55 pm to link
Posted on 6/13/17 at 2:31 pm to CAD703X
Amazon Music is pretty fricking amazing.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 2:47 pm to CAD703X
I've pondered something very lately. My band recently put a single track on Spotify, mostly for fun, and it seems to be nonexistent unless you search the actual band name in full. I put the damn thing on two of my playlists, which I listen to most all day, and oddly have never had my song come on as I was listening. But, I hear the same songs over and over on my own playlists, but have only heard mine a few times. I'm not sure if this is coincidence or not, just odd to me.
Also, we get around .000012 cents per spin. Can't wait to see the royalties roll in.
Also, we get around .000012 cents per spin. Can't wait to see the royalties roll in.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 2:53 pm to MontanaMax
quote:
I put the damn thing on two of my playlists, which I listen to most all day, and oddly have never had my song come on as I was listening. But, I hear the same songs over and over on my own playlists, but have only heard mine a few times. I'm not sure if this is coincidence or not, just odd to me.
Also, we get around .000012 cents per spin. Can't wait to see the royalties roll in.
This is by design. The algorithms take into account how many playlists you're on. The key to getting your music traction on spotify is to have contacts with influential playlisters (people who make playlists with tens of thousands of listeners). The more of those playlists you can get on, the more often your song will actually pop up in those playlists.
It's a rigged system, unless you pay extra to advertise.
It's the same way with trying to get posts from one's band to show up on the facebook feeds of people who liked the page. If you don't pay to boost your posts, only a very small number will actually see them. The number allowed to see them rises with the number of likes on the page, and which of those people for whom it shows up is determined by how many times they've interacted with the band's posts (liked, shared, commented, etc).
Streaming takes the same approach. You have to get the right people to share your stuff and pay for your stuff to show up without people having to actively dig for it.
It's a profitable model for the streaming services, so I don't see them changing it any time soon. Music is one of those activities where it takes a lot of money to make any money.
This post was edited on 6/13/17 at 2:55 pm
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:53 pm to MontanaMax
quote:
Also, we get around .000012 cents per spin. Can't wait to see the royalties roll in.
Posted on 6/13/17 at 4:00 pm to CAD703X
This is why we need more fluoride in the water.
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