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re: Why are modern filmakers so addicted to overly complex plots?
Posted on 12/26/17 at 5:53 pm to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 12/26/17 at 5:53 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
oh i have another amazing example: Ex Machina
very simple story. i mean stuff happens leading to a climax but there aren't all these subplots running around adding confusion
one of the best movies of the past 15 years
I’ve been saying that this movie should have been structurally similar to this. Each day both Rey and Kylo Ren receive lessons from their masters, after each lesson they have a psychic connection/debriefing of their day, and then both eventually agree to betray their masters. Once Kylo has eliminated his master Snoke through manipulating Rey, Kylo then gives Rey an ultimatum to join him and his vision of a new galaxy or die. It would have been amazing and should have been 80% of the movie.
0
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:13 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
if you want another example of a movie that was very simple and got a lot of love, John Wick is a great one
John Wick is a great example of "knowing everything you need to know about the characters, plot, and setting in the first 20 minutes"
It isn't the only way to do actions movies but it is probably the best.
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:20 pm to Dire Wolf
John Wick is one of my favorite movies of all time.
There is something to be said about directors understanding the feel and soul of a movie and staying true to that....to simply hit what they are aiming for and nothing more.
That’s why people like me give Christopher Nolan so much shite at times. I love his movies, I really do and I appreciate what he tries to do, but sometimes I think his aim is a little off and he bites off more than the movie can chew and he can’t edit his way out of it.
Another example - people cut marvel movies more slack because they know, intrinsically, the feel of the movies and what they aim to do. And for the most part they hit their target. GotG and TWS are the pinnacles of this art imo.
The DCU, on the other hand, seems like its inital aim was to catch the wave while providing no feel or soul, to just go over the top with grittiness and “realism” only to realize that puts the movies in an entirely more difficult bracket for movie goers and lowers the tolerance for mistakes substantially.
There is something to be said about directors understanding the feel and soul of a movie and staying true to that....to simply hit what they are aiming for and nothing more.
That’s why people like me give Christopher Nolan so much shite at times. I love his movies, I really do and I appreciate what he tries to do, but sometimes I think his aim is a little off and he bites off more than the movie can chew and he can’t edit his way out of it.
Another example - people cut marvel movies more slack because they know, intrinsically, the feel of the movies and what they aim to do. And for the most part they hit their target. GotG and TWS are the pinnacles of this art imo.
The DCU, on the other hand, seems like its inital aim was to catch the wave while providing no feel or soul, to just go over the top with grittiness and “realism” only to realize that puts the movies in an entirely more difficult bracket for movie goers and lowers the tolerance for mistakes substantially.
This post was edited on 12/26/17 at 7:23 pm
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:21 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
oh i have another amazing example: Ex Machina
very simple story. i mean stuff happens leading to a climax but there aren't all these subplots running around adding confusion
one of the best movies of the past 15 years
I was tempted to add this to my dystopia ramble earlier but i was on the crapper and didn't have a ton of time.
Ex Machina very much fits the "corporate world taking over" theme of Black Mirror and Blade Runner.
this also gives me a chance to pimp one of my favorite b-movies They Live
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:21 pm to SlowFlowPro
I'd say two other good examples are captain America:civil war and Batman v superman. One of those films did a good job with an overly complex plot, and the other didn't.
Hint: it wasn't Batman v. Superman.
Another hint: it was captain America
Hint: it wasn't Batman v. Superman.
Another hint: it was captain America
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:24 pm to red_giraffe
See my post above.
They have different tones. And tones communicate part of the goal of the movie. Civil War’s tone was clear and entertaining.
BvS was just a bunch of shite on a wall. No real identity.
They have different tones. And tones communicate part of the goal of the movie. Civil War’s tone was clear and entertaining.
BvS was just a bunch of shite on a wall. No real identity.
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:29 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
That’s why people like me give Christopher Nolan so much shite at times. I love his movies, I really do and I appreciate what he tries to do, but sometimes I think his aim is a little off and he bites off more than the movie can chew and he can’t edit his way out of it.
I feel like you could have called this thread the Nolan Effect
Skyfall was a ripping off of The dark knight was my first thought when i read OP.
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:32 pm to Dire Wolf
I’ve said it for years - Nolan is the best and worst thing to happen to the DCU and maybe to a degree the film industry.
It seems directors try to replicate his story telling not understanding that stories are more than just “tricking” the audience or building up mystique.
Sometimes, we just want to see people get their arse kicked.
It seems directors try to replicate his story telling not understanding that stories are more than just “tricking” the audience or building up mystique.
Sometimes, we just want to see people get their arse kicked.
Posted on 12/26/17 at 7:55 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
I feel like you could have called this thread the Nolan Effect
eh it was really ramping up well before he was a superstar
Bad Boys 2 is from 2003. Insomnia was released in 2002 (and Batman Begins wasn't released until 2005)
back in 2003, however, BB2 was criticized for its overly complex plot. it was around pre-Nolan Effect
Posted on 12/26/17 at 8:03 pm to SlowFlowPro
No doubt it predates Nolan, but Nolan caused it to explode imo
Just like space sagas predated Star Wars
Just like space sagas predated Star Wars
Posted on 12/26/17 at 8:04 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
BB2 was criticized for its overly complex plot
It's not really that complicated of a plot. They just use any chance to have a massive fight scene that gets increasingly ridiculous as the movie goes.
It is still a pretty basic Cop storyline at its base.
Posted on 12/27/17 at 5:55 am to Dire Wolf
Yeah I really don’t get how BB2 is considered an overly complex plot
Policeman has sister
Sister is undercover agent
Sister is exposed and kidnapped
Brother and friends go to Cuba to get girl back
Through in some bad arse gun fights, 2 mice having sex and some hummers’.
Policeman has sister
Sister is undercover agent
Sister is exposed and kidnapped
Brother and friends go to Cuba to get girl back
Through in some bad arse gun fights, 2 mice having sex and some hummers’.
Posted on 12/27/17 at 9:52 am to engvol
quote:
Through in some bad arse gun fights, 2 mice having sex and some hummers’.
Ohhhhhhh ohhhh ohhhhhh
Ah ah shake your tail feather
Posted on 12/27/17 at 12:13 pm to SlowFlowPro
Young Jcorye1 would always say shite Just Got Real.
Posted on 12/27/17 at 12:34 pm to Jcorye1
i still use it
and BB2 was way too complex. hell they even had that random shootout with the Hatians or Jamaicans or whatever
Bay is really, really bad about overly complicated plots and too many characters/story lines interacting and parting ways and crashing back into each other. he made multiple Transformers movies convoluted messes
and BB2 was way too complex. hell they even had that random shootout with the Hatians or Jamaicans or whatever
Bay is really, really bad about overly complicated plots and too many characters/story lines interacting and parting ways and crashing back into each other. he made multiple Transformers movies convoluted messes
Posted on 12/27/17 at 12:46 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
Dredd is the only action movie in recent memory that was able to capture the feel of 80s action. Simple plot, not cgi driven (sans the drug scenes) and a bad guy was simple motives.
Posted on 12/27/17 at 1:45 pm to The_Joker
John wick is commando to dredd’s die hard.
I don’t mean that in quality because wick is way better than commando but just in the plot
I don’t mean that in quality because wick is way better than commando but just in the plot
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