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re: What was better Trilogy? Nolan Batman or Cap America?
Posted on 8/18/20 at 10:45 am to RollTide1987
Posted on 8/18/20 at 10:45 am to RollTide1987
quote:
couldn't care less what snooty film fans think on this matter, especially when it comes to Captain America vs. Batman. That's an argument most film fans wouldn't be bothered to engage in.
Yeah, I'm not attacking your opinion (an opinion I agree with), only the use of the imdb top250 as evidence of something qualitative. That list changes all the time, changes its rules to accommodate things that are popular (like Hamilton, even though a filmed play would normally be considered a documentary which is a genre not eligible for the list), and has a voter base that I highly suspect you wouldn't identify with. Look at that list. How many of the super populist Bollywood flicks on there have you seen?
I'm a film fan talking about these movies. So are you. You're deciding one word represents elitist language, when it absolutely does not.
quote:
My argument is that all three Nolan Batman films were critically acclaimed and almost universally loved by general audiences.
I think other websites and metrics would make this point better than imdb (letterboxd, metacritic, RT, tmdb, boxofficemojo, icheckmovies). I'm not convinced a voting base with such specific loves for superheroes, 90s Oscar dramas, and Bollywood populism rosebud a mainstream audience.
And at the end of the day, bb and TDK were universally loved at a greater level than the near-universal love for winter soldier and civil war. I ignore people's current appreciation for the first cap movie, since it was not considered great when it came out, and people's probably gradually eroding opinion of tdkr.
But again, I agree that batman is better.
1
Posted on 8/18/20 at 10:46 am to stateofplay
Dark Knight over any single Cap film, but Cap Trilogy over Nolan triad.
Hell, Civil War is essentially Avengers 2.5.
Hell, Civil War is essentially Avengers 2.5.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 11:08 am to Jay Are
quote:
I think other websites and metrics would make this point better than imdb (letterboxd, metacritic, RT, tmdb, boxofficemojo, icheckmovies). I'm not convinced a voting base with such specific loves for superheroes, 90s Oscar dramas, and Bollywood populism rosebud a mainstream audience.
And each one of those metrics proves my point: The Dark Knight Rises was universally liked by mainstream audiences. Is it the 71st greatest movie of all-time? No. But that's not what I'm trying to say. I'm simply saying that a lot of people liked the movie and those that didn't like it are in a small minority.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 12:19 pm to stateofplay
FWIW I remember liking the Captain America movies but I dont remember much about them. That goes for a lot of the Marvel movies. Fun but forgettable. The story, the performances...nothing really...I remember everything about the Nolan Batman movies. I guess I just was more engaged by them.
This post was edited on 8/18/20 at 1:39 pm
Posted on 8/18/20 at 1:07 pm to ThuperThumpin
quote:
FWIW I remember liking the Captain America movies but I dont remember much about them. That goes for a lot of the Marvel movies. Fun but forgettable. The story, the performances...nothing really...I remember ever everything about the Nolan Batman movies. I guess I just was more engaged by them.
Nails. The marvel shite is just color by numbers for the most part. The only marvel movie I actually rate is Logan. The MCU can go suck a frick.
This post was edited on 8/18/20 at 1:10 pm
Posted on 8/18/20 at 1:29 pm to PhilipMarlowe
quote:
The only marvel movie I actually rate is Logan
Logan was great. I really liked and remember a few more.
X2 X Men United
Thor Ragnorok
Iron Man 1
DeadPool 1 and 2
Posted on 8/18/20 at 1:45 pm to stateofplay
Batman by a mile. The First Avenger is a pretty lame movie compared to the Nolan bat films.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 2:32 pm to Freauxzen
quote:lolwut? you think Batman Begins in the best movie out of those 6?
The films are probably ranked like this:
BB
TWS = TDK
FA
CW
TDKR
Posted on 8/18/20 at 2:34 pm to Athos
quote:yea i wish they would have more stuff like the Arkham series has with him solving stuff with his tech. Burtons Batman, touched on this with is futuristic computer and him researching stuff.
2. More detective skills of Batman. Honestly, every live action has done a shitty job of capturing the worlds greatest detective but No,an could have done better.
This post was edited on 8/18/20 at 2:36 pm
Posted on 8/18/20 at 2:40 pm to RollTide1987
quote:
And each one of those metrics proves my point: The Dark Knight Rises was universally liked by mainstream audiences. Is it the 71st greatest movie of all-time? No. But that's not what I'm trying to say. I'm simply saying that a lot of people liked the movie and those that didn't like it are in a small minority.
If that's your point, that's basically the same for the Cap films. TFA being the one that probably falls out of that now, but most people go back and finally see the point of that film for the Cap character.
That might be why there's a little revisionist history about it - because Evans made that character great and it took some time for the more naive/Silver Age version of Cap to take hold.
But geeze, TWS and CW are a few points behind in ALL metrics. And that's saying a lot when you consider the state of Cap and Batman prior to the MCU in cultural consciousness.
Both trilogies are well received by fans and critics and had similar box office takes. Nolan gets a "Nolan bump" with critics and fans for the same reason as things like "Tenet is already my second favorite Nolan film, I already know it." There isan air about Nolan that other directors don't really get. As seen above on the IMDB list. That's about your only difference when looking strictly at metrics.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 2:47 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
If that's your point, that's basically the same for the Cap films.
I never said it wasn't the same. I just think that, as a trilogy, the Dark Knight trilogy is better because it's actually - you know - a trilogy. You kinda have to watch the other films in the MCU to know what's going on in the Captain America films. This is especially true of Captain America: Civil War. If I'm a casual movie goer who decides to only watch the three Captain America movies without bothering with the rest of the MCU, I can probably understand what's going on in First Avengers. The same is true, for the most part, of Winter Soldier but there are some things in there that would definitely make me ask questions due to events in other MCU films that the filmmakers will have expected you to be aware of. But as soon as I get to Civil War I would become totally lost.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 2:56 pm to SoFla Tideroller
quote:
I love the revisionist history on this board. When the Winter Soldier came out the reaction on here was "decent Marvel movie. Villian fairly weak". Over the years it has morphed into the superhero version of The Godfather or Citizen Kane
This board is weird like that sometimes. I didn’t see Winter Soldier when it first came out. I had been meh on Cap1 and both of the Thor movies. Iron Man 2 had been a let down, and I had heard how bad Iron Man 3 was. The Avengers was pretty good, but I kinda had superhero movie fatigue so I skipped it. At that point, out of 6 movies, only 2 felt good enough to be worth writing home about.
I didn’t actually go back and watch it until late 2017/early 2018 and was blown away. This was because someone took me to see Guardians 2 and it really impressed me and made me want to see if maybe I had missed some good Marvel films. Then, I watched a bunch of marvel movies in late 2017-early 2018 to get caught up in time to catch Infinity War in theaters.
In that span, I watched Guardians 1, Avengers 2, Doctor Strange, Thor: Ragnarok, and Civil War. Thor 3 was instantly a favorite comic book movie and the hype for Black Panther made me anticipate seeing it. Black Panther was overrated, but still very good, and both Ant-Man movies were shockingly fun. Spiderman was a homerun. Infinity War and Endgame were both excellent.
I think it is important to recognize that Winter Soldier was released when Marvel’s movie franchise was a little weak, but it kicked off a tremendously successful hit streak.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 3:23 pm to stateofplay
quote:
Cap America
Posted on 8/18/20 at 3:35 pm to kingbob
quote:
This board is weird like that sometimes.
It definitely became a "thing" over time on this board to say BB and Winter Soldier are actually better than The Dark Knight
Posted on 8/18/20 at 3:53 pm to Freauxzen
quote:[i
Probably a push. Outside of Caine and Oldman, the Nolan movies have weak supporting.
[
This post was edited on 8/18/20 at 3:56 pm
Posted on 8/18/20 at 4:01 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
Both trilogies are well received by fans and critics and had similar box office takes. Nolan gets a "Nolan bump" with critics and fans for the same reason as things like "Tenet is already my second favorite Nolan film, I already know it."
MCU movies have a massive circle jerk around them.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 4:05 pm to PhilipMarlowe
quote:
The only marvel movie I actually rate is Logan. The MCU can go suck a frick.
you're gonna' get downvoted for this take but I sort of agree.
adult men being all obsessed with superhero movies and vidya games and funko pops and shite... idk, kinda sus imho. just my .02
we got a whole generation of bobby hill's out here
Posted on 8/18/20 at 4:27 pm to Green Chili Tiger
quote:I was one of the guys eagerly awaiting it, and I will state- it's a BAD movie. It's on the lines of "nope, not going to rewatch it" bad.
The Dark Knight Rises is easily Nolan's worst film and it's not close. It's just a mess from start to finish.
A lot of it is poor visuals, compounded by a good bit being just stupid. And then, some of the editing- whoever said Bane sounds like Sean Connery with Tupperware over his mouth is dead-on. The whole movie was a lot of build-up, and little delivery. A lot like that small bit early with the cops- "oh, you're new. Wait'll you see THIS guy!"
See what, exactly?
Posted on 8/18/20 at 4:31 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
MCU movies have a massive circle jerk around them.
Yet:
quote:
If we accept the IMDB Top250 as something meaningful, we accept that Green Book is the 131st greatest movie of all time and Three Billboards is 152nd, while Chinatown is the 155th. These are the ratings of literal children.
If you live your life thinking TDK is the 4th greatest film ever made, Inception is the 13th, Interstellar is the 31st, and TDKR is really 71, that's fine. But these are not "common" opinions among many film fans.
Holy shite, The Prestige at 47 and Memento at 55. 6 in the top 75. There's something wrong with the imdb crowd.
TDKR > Chinatown
To be fair, Avengers is also ahead of Chinatown, but the "circle jerk" nature of fandom isn't limited to the MCU, so let's not act like that.
Posted on 8/18/20 at 4:33 pm to HT713
quote:
you're gonna' get downvoted for this take but I sort of agree.
adult men being all obsessed with superhero movies and vidya games and funko pops and shite... idk, kinda sus imho. just my .02
we got a whole generation of bobby hill's out here
Eh, it's no different than supporting a sports team and being "nerdy" about it.
What's the difference is knowing the entire roster of the X-Men or the entire roster of the 2001 Patriots and all season awards? Neither set of information is useful by any stretch of the imagination. It's all made up.
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