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re: True Detective S1E08 "Form And Void"
Posted on 3/10/14 at 11:30 pm to Captain Rumbeard
Posted on 3/10/14 at 11:30 pm to Captain Rumbeard
Totally understandable. Sorry I wasn't trying to be insensitive. shite's messed up.
0
Posted on 3/10/14 at 11:30 pm to Bayou Sam
quote:
eah I don't think the hallucination at the end was supposed to be a heavenly revelation but just the opposite--a hallucinatory experience of Carcosa, eternal return, etc.
His later explanation is not of the hallucination but the peace of slipping into the darkness of death.
I agree. The dome was symbolic of it and helped trigger the hallucination. He wasn't expecting it right then so it startled him. The death stuff was fairly standard.
Posted on 3/10/14 at 11:30 pm to Captain Rumbeard
Cole: That taste.
Marty: What?
Cole: Alluminum, ash. I've tasted it before.
gets me every time.
Marty: What?
Cole: Alluminum, ash. I've tasted it before.
gets me every time.
Posted on 3/10/14 at 11:35 pm to Captain Rumbeard
quote:
Won't really elaborate more. He wasn't the worst I saw. Crack whores did really bad things to their kids. Compared to them he was fairly tame. Biggest problem with him was he'd pleasure pretty much anybody that would choke him.
Yeah.
I couldn't do that work.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 12:10 am to northshorebamaman
Yeah I couldn't either after five years of it.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 12:14 am to theunknownknight
Another interview supporting the non-religious "conversion" of Rust:
Also remember "my definitions" failing. He is not talking about personal immortality.
quote:
You said there was no conversion in the story. But was Cohle suggesting he now believes in some kind of afterlife when he told Hart about his near death experience?
It’s not a belief – he’s talking about an experience. And he’s not talking about a reconciliation with loved ones after death: If you listen to what he says, he says, ‘I was gone. There was no me. Just love… and then I woke up.’ That line is significant to the whole series: “And then I woke up.” The only thing like a conversion that he has is when he says, “You’re looking at it wrong. To me, the light is winning.” And that doesn’t describe a conversion to me as much as it describes a broadening of perspective. The man who once said there is no light at the end of the tunnel is now saying there might be order to this. I don’t think it says anything more than: Pick your stories carefully.
Also remember "my definitions" failing. He is not talking about personal immortality.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 12:17 am to SlowFlowPro
Also I'm happy to say that NP adds support to my interpretation of the relation of Errol to the cult, and my interpretation of the religious motives of the cult:
LINK
quote:
Errol spoke of a rather mysterious, occult agenda: He spoke of aspiring to an “ascension.” What was Errol really up to? What did he want?
That’s a really good question, and I don’t know if it benefits me to answer it. We definitely had an idea – I laid out for Glenn Fleshler, who played Errol, and for our art department, in terms of who this killer was, what he was doing, and how he lived. In the beginning, when he says, “My ascension removes me the disc in the loop,” he’s describing the cosmology of eternal recurrence of various characters, including Cohle and Reggie Ledoux hit upon, and he’s hitting upon his personal mythology. When he says, “It’s been weeks since I left my mark, would they have eyes to see,” we can tell from that that he’s angling for a reckoning, for a showdown. He’s waiting for it. He believes the murders ritually enacted over a period of time, upon his death, permit him an ascension that removes him from the Karmic wheel of rebirth. This whole idea of time as a circle, yeah, that’s Nietzsche and quantum cosmology, but that’s also the Karmic wheel. If you mentioned something like Karma to someone like Cohle, he’d probably throw up.
So it’s fair to interpret from the finale that Errol wanted death and was inviting it?
Yes, he was inviting it.
Would it be fair to interpret from the series as a whole that Errol was trying to expose the monsters who made him, his family, by leaving clues that implicated them?
Yes. You can tell there are certain times he wants people to notice him. Childress was signaling to the authorities both his presence and the presence of the men who made him. And Cohle and Hart don’t get absolute justice at the end. Cohle says, we didn’t get them all. But they got a branch from a big rotten tree, and Hart says, we got ours, and basically, the rest of the tree is up to other people.
LINK
Posted on 3/11/14 at 7:59 am to Bayou Sam
My wife has been ill since Sunday afternoon with a stomach bug. I caught the finale on a re-air 10PM Sunday, didn't even bother with hbotogo. By the time I watched the finale and came here the pages jumped from 15 to 45. As I tried to catch up on the thread so I could post this thread jumped to 65 during the day. I was taking care of 4 kids who were home for Spring Break. I tried to catch last night but the thread added 10 more pages. So after I finally caught up it 79 pages. Amazingly there are not many knew things to consider since the finale finished.
SFP gonna SFP, et al SFP cronies.
This series did surprise us in the last 5 minutes like I said it would but in a totally different way. Rust found God. Didn't see that coming.
This series was very much in the ilk of 6th Sense. Instead of a dead dude who finds out that he is dead at the end and then we go back through all the clues, we have two dudes who actually love each other in the end, and we go back and find out how that happened.
Most meaningful relationships are born out of resolved conflict. Rust and Marty end up having a story to tell about how they have an unbreakable bond. The problem with this thread is that everyone is starting at the beginning and trying to piece the story together through the end. Do the reverse. Start and the ending and work backwards. You will end with a bond formed through the crucible of the investigation. It started with major conflict in the car ride back to the HQ after what they witnessed at the Dora crime scene.
Consistently every detail about the case shows a development in Rust and Marty's relationship.
A sub-level you see the same with Marty's family. In the hospital he finally is honest with his family after it is too late. He tries to carry on a lie but breaks down and cries.
On a sub-level with Rust you see him form a relation with the bar owner dude. Rust starts with Maggie being human and finally let's people in. He ultimately finds a type of relationship with God.
This series is about relationships.
SFP gonna SFP, et al SFP cronies.
This series did surprise us in the last 5 minutes like I said it would but in a totally different way. Rust found God. Didn't see that coming.
This series was very much in the ilk of 6th Sense. Instead of a dead dude who finds out that he is dead at the end and then we go back through all the clues, we have two dudes who actually love each other in the end, and we go back and find out how that happened.
Most meaningful relationships are born out of resolved conflict. Rust and Marty end up having a story to tell about how they have an unbreakable bond. The problem with this thread is that everyone is starting at the beginning and trying to piece the story together through the end. Do the reverse. Start and the ending and work backwards. You will end with a bond formed through the crucible of the investigation. It started with major conflict in the car ride back to the HQ after what they witnessed at the Dora crime scene.
Consistently every detail about the case shows a development in Rust and Marty's relationship.
A sub-level you see the same with Marty's family. In the hospital he finally is honest with his family after it is too late. He tries to carry on a lie but breaks down and cries.
On a sub-level with Rust you see him form a relation with the bar owner dude. Rust starts with Maggie being human and finally let's people in. He ultimately finds a type of relationship with God.
This series is about relationships.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 7:59 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
that's why people often get lost in the hype of movies, or love them walking out of the theater but then realize they suck later (or the opposite..big lebowski and cabin in the woods threw many people on first viewing)
Do you not see the irony in this statement coming from you? You got so wrapped up in wanting it to focus on the cult that you made it impossible to enjoy the show for what it was.
And this was not a "character study" like so many people keep repeating. This season was simply a great noir novel delivered via a different medium. This is different from an adaptation or being based on a novel. I enjoy these types of books and really really liked this series. Was Rust a believable character? No. Neither was Marty because guys without money don't have that type of pussy throwing themselves at you. However, their triumph in spite of their differences is what made this a great story. Plus, people need to understand that themes are important for any story, and the most provocative ones are those that let the audience come to their own conclusions (which obviously doesn't work for the casual, lazy, and inexperienced viewer*).
And for those that feel they don't know enough about the cult, re watch the middle of the finale and listen closely to errols lines. He gives the audienc enough to figure out a large part of the cult. Hint: acolytes.
*not calling anyone out, but so many people missed so many things as evidenced by the retarded theories in these threads)
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:03 am to guedeaux
quote:
"character study"
quote:
noir novel delivered via a different medium.
Actually, you could say it's a bit of both.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:23 am to Bayou Sam
quote:
Also remember "my definitions" failing. He is not talking about personal immortality.
His quotes actually sound somewhat like Buddhist beliefs.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:25 am to rebeloke
quote:
Rust found God. Didn't see that coming.
I don't think Rust "found God".
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:28 am to Tactical1
I see an annoying trend developing where people will fight whether Rust found God or not, and they'll both be wrong.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:30 am to Tactical1
quote:Neither do I. He felt something on the other end. He felt love and possibly found out that life isn't just a circle.
I don't think Rust "found God".
But saying that he found god is just flat wrong.
This post was edited on 3/11/14 at 8:32 am
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:44 am to rebeloke
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:52 am to JBeam
"Flat" wrong. Nothing ironic about that statement. Watch the Life of Pi. Finding God can be a broad statement. For a guy who went from thinking that humanity was an evolutionary mistake and that we should walk hand in hand into extinction, to finding out there is an afterlife, yeah that qualifies as finding God.
Some of you in here are argumentative to a fault.
Some of you in here are argumentative to a fault.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 8:54 am to Prominentwon
quote:
Posted by Prominentwon btw, you ruined these True Detective threads for me. it's hard to read with your insistence in every thread.
Yep, that and my wife probably won't have sex with me again because I asked her if she wanted me to make flowers on her.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 9:34 am to guedeaux
Just finished reading this thread. SFP, I really am impressed by your ability to argue so many points so well simultaneously. You will be the Rust of small town Louisiana courts in no time. However, I would argue that you completely missed the changes in both Rust and Marty.
Their roles as Investigators change 180 degrees from 1995 and 2012. For example, Marty becomes the one doing all the research and interviews in ep 7. Also, look at how they are living in 2012. Marty isn't chasing pussy, he isn't the alpha every man anymore. The shite he went through broke him. Same with rust. He ran away after quitting. He gave up. Furthermore, to understand Rust, the viewer has to distinguish between what he said to the dicks and what he said/did in the flashbacks and in the present. The former are circular prose meant to distract and confuse while the latter were his actual views and actions. For God's sake he actually asked Marty a personal question and actually spoke about his feelings and took responsibility when talking to Marty about Maggie. That is important. In this short of a medium, the meanings of single sentences and even words are extremely important.
I am not going to argue with you about it, but I think you watched this show with tunnel vision. However it definitely is not the GOAT, but it is potentially transformative. I enjoyed it more than almost any single season of any show I have watched in a while.
Their roles as Investigators change 180 degrees from 1995 and 2012. For example, Marty becomes the one doing all the research and interviews in ep 7. Also, look at how they are living in 2012. Marty isn't chasing pussy, he isn't the alpha every man anymore. The shite he went through broke him. Same with rust. He ran away after quitting. He gave up. Furthermore, to understand Rust, the viewer has to distinguish between what he said to the dicks and what he said/did in the flashbacks and in the present. The former are circular prose meant to distract and confuse while the latter were his actual views and actions. For God's sake he actually asked Marty a personal question and actually spoke about his feelings and took responsibility when talking to Marty about Maggie. That is important. In this short of a medium, the meanings of single sentences and even words are extremely important.
I am not going to argue with you about it, but I think you watched this show with tunnel vision. However it definitely is not the GOAT, but it is potentially transformative. I enjoyed it more than almost any single season of any show I have watched in a while.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 9:42 am to Patrick O Rly
quote:
His quotes actually sound somewhat like Buddhist beliefs.
I agree. But the brand of pessimism Rust was already espousing was Buddhist in origin. I think he converts to a more hopeful vision of the same basic reality.
Posted on 3/11/14 at 9:43 am to Slippy
quote:who said that was in NOLAEast? from google that is way down the mouth of the river in Plaquemines parish
Yes. Filmed at Fort St, Philip, and it was the perfect setting
ETA: yall retards, it was shot at Fort Macomb off hwy90
This post was edited on 3/11/14 at 9:48 am
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