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re: The Last of Us | S1, Ep 9 Season Finale | NO GAME SPOILERS Thread
Posted on 3/13/23 at 12:33 am to WestSideTiger
Posted on 3/13/23 at 12:33 am to WestSideTiger
quote:
His interactions with Ellie was just all of a sudden weird.
She freaking saved his life.
And not like in a "jump in front of a bullet" or "shove you out of the way of a train" way, but she saved his life in a way that took care, thought, and time.
And she freaking murdered her attempted rapist with her bare hands.
Of course he's going to be more openly attached to her (he was already secretly getting there) and of course he's going to be more gentle and kind with her - he knows she's traumatized.
I don't think there are any "good" people in this world. Maybe Ellie. She's definitely the closest we've got. But everyone else? They're all shades of grey - just like real life.
Joel was right to be angry that Marlene didn't give Ellie the chance to make her choice. I empathized with him tearing through that hospital. But his decision to murder Marlene after she said they should give Ellie the chance to choose, followed by his lies to Ellie, betray his truly selfish motives.
Show was wild. I loved every minute.
1
Posted on 3/13/23 at 1:24 am to Wanderin Reb
Very good episode. Ellie is obviously suffering a little from PTSD. Joel can empathize with that. The scene with Marlene for Joel was 100% necessary. She would have never quit looking for Ellie.
Season 2 will be interesting. I wonder if the plans would be to go back to Travis, provided that their compound hasn't been RAIDed.
On a side note, what is Joel's beef with the AR15 lol? He could have picked the best of all of them and had ammo for days... (also kinda debunks what some of the posters were saying that there may be no 5.56 or .223 ammo available.)
Finally, Joel says "we are going home." Uh, where is home?
Season 2 will be interesting. I wonder if the plans would be to go back to Travis, provided that their compound hasn't been RAIDed.
On a side note, what is Joel's beef with the AR15 lol? He could have picked the best of all of them and had ammo for days... (also kinda debunks what some of the posters were saying that there may be no 5.56 or .223 ammo available.)
Finally, Joel says "we are going home." Uh, where is home?
Posted on 3/13/23 at 5:20 am to NPComb
The only thing I can say in slight defense of Joel is I don’t know if Ellie knew all along that she’d have to sacrifice herself to save everyone.
I also don’t think that’s a question you can truly ask anyone. Would you like to save the world but die or pass and live? Either way, she’s gonna be fvcked. She either dies or she lives with overwhelming shame and guilt for the rest of her life that would be unimaginable.
I still think Joel is the villain overall, but I think eliminating the possibility of a choice (even if Ellie probably doesn’t believe him) is atleast an attempt to try and make her life bearable.
I also don’t think that’s a question you can truly ask anyone. Would you like to save the world but die or pass and live? Either way, she’s gonna be fvcked. She either dies or she lives with overwhelming shame and guilt for the rest of her life that would be unimaginable.
I still think Joel is the villain overall, but I think eliminating the possibility of a choice (even if Ellie probably doesn’t believe him) is atleast an attempt to try and make her life bearable.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 6:25 am to NolaLovingClemsonFan
That was a good episode, and I haven't really been able to type that confidently all season for the most part. This one was solid.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:16 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Ellie should’ve had the autonomy to make the choice herself. And he knew she wasn’t getting that.
How do you know this? No one knows if she went into surgery knowing she would die. By her question to Joel at the end, she knew damn well she was supposed to be dead for the cause and he prevented that.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:25 am to BluegrassBelle
So I just quickly browsed the thread and I didn't see it mentioned. Did anyone notice that the pregnant woman in the opening scene is Ashley Johnson who is the voice actress for Ellie in the game.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:26 am to Kracka
quote:i told my wife all i could hear was Ellie
So I just quickly browsed the thread and I didn't see it mentioned. Did anyone notice that the pregnant woman in the opening scene is Ashley Johnson who is the voice actress for Ellie in the game.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:28 am to landrywasbeast30
quote:
All Ellie cared about was saving the fricking world and her being the cure.
Was there ever a point in the season where Ellie knew she would have to die in order for there to be a cure?
She thought her blood was the medicine, as evidenced by her trying to save Sam earlier in the season.
I don't think she knows they were going to harvest her brain and never give her a chance to at least say goodbye. Maybe she still would have went for it, but Marlene never gave her that option.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:30 am to LSUPERMAN
quote:
How do you know this? No one knows if she went into surgery knowing she would die.
They literally told Joel that they were going to have to remove the brain/do brain surgery. And given that Marlene kept apologizing to Joel, it was obvious that meant she would die. Joel also asked them if Ellie knew and Marlene said they didn’t tell her, they just put her under.
So no, Ellie wasn’t allowed to make that choice (have her autonomy).
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:32 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
They literally told Joel that they were going to have to remove the brain/do brain surgery. And given that Marlene kept apologizing to Joel, it was obvious that meant she would die. Joel also asked them if Ellie knew and Marlene said they didn’t tell her, they just put her under.
And Marlene could have lied to Joel. Ellie could have told Marlene don't tell Joel. Nobody knows for sure if she agreed or not.
Ellie could have known there's a chance she would die for the cure. If she told Joel bye, she might have second thoughts. Looks to me that she knew her purpose was to save mankind by any means necessary. At the end, she was just a girl who lost her purpose.
This post was edited on 3/13/23 at 8:35 am
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:36 am to LSUPERMAN
quote:
And Marlene could have lied to Joel. Ellie could have told Marlene don't tell Joel. Nobody knows for sure if she agreed or not.
IMO Ellie wouldn’t have wanted to die without saying goodbye to Joel. And explaining her decision.
And Marlene lying to Joel at that point to say she’s going to die does nothing to serve her and makes no sense. If anything, if she was going to lie, she should’ve said she was going to be fine to keep Joel calm.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:36 am to Bluefin
quote:I’d say no. She seemed to fight so hard for her life most of the series, and was terrified of being left on her own. I don’t think she even thought about being sacrificed for the good of humanity.
Was there ever a point in the season where Ellie knew she would have to die in order for there to be a cure
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:41 am to NPComb
quote:
On a side note, what is Joel's beef with the AR15 lol? He could have picked the best of all of them and had ammo for days... (also kinda debunks what some of the posters were saying that there may be no 5.56 or .223 ammo available.)
Didn’t you say he wouldn’t ever use an AR because the show has an agenda against automatic weapon usage? Stop it.
quote:
Finally, Joel says "we are going home." Uh, where is home?
Did you not watch all the way to the end of the episode? They went back to Wyoming to the town where Tommy is.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:41 am to LSUPERMAN
quote:
Ellie could have told Marlene don't tell Joel. Nobody knows for sure if she agreed or not.
That makes no sense though. Ellie knows how protective Joel is of her now. No way she would be like “yeah don’t tell him I’m ok with this” when she knows he will do anything now to protect her.
And I agree with Belle she absolutely would have wanted to tell him goodbye. After Joel just told her minutes before they are ambushed that she is the reason his emotional wounds from the loss of his daughter have healed….no way Ellie will not want to say goodbye and explain her decision.
This post was edited on 3/13/23 at 8:44 am
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:43 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Did you not watch all the way to the end of the episode? They went back to Wyoming to the town where Tommy is.
He was still seething over all the “gay stuff” of this season to pay attention to something like that
Eta: looking forward to listening to the podcast of this episode on my way to work. The podcast is awesome , highly recommend
This post was edited on 3/13/23 at 8:46 am
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:48 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
IMO Ellie wouldn’t have wanted to die without saying goodbye to Joel. And explaining her decision.
See, this is what makes a good show. We can have varying opinions and interpretations. This is what a discussion board is for. I respect your opinion even if I think differently. These threads get derailed when certain posters get mad if you don't agree with them. end soapbox
I still think I am right though
Posted on 3/13/23 at 8:52 am to landrywasbeast30
quote:
He’s a villain. Did you miss the finale episode. How could anyone think that dude is a hero? The show told us throughout the season Joel was an evil person.
Guess we know what you’re doing in the event your kid is taken hostage by rogue “doctors” who are going to sacrifice your kid without their or your consent because they “maybe” can find a cure.
I think he did what any parental figure would do in that situation.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 9:05 am to landrywasbeast30
quote:
The show told us throughout the season Joel was an evil person.
Eh...he's not an evil person. But he's definitely not a good person either.
Posted on 3/13/23 at 9:08 am to NPComb
quote:
The scene with Marlene for Joel was 100% necessary. She would have never quit looking for Ellie.
The one thing I like about this show is that Joel will put you down without a thought. None of the "okay I'll spare this henchman and have him come back later the bite me in the arse."
It's all "thank you for the information...BLAM"
Posted on 3/13/23 at 9:10 am to lostinbr
quote:
Ehh there’s no way of knowing whether the doc could actually save humanity. And his last words were something like “I won’t let you take her.”
People have justified Joel's actions using this kind of reasoning for the past 10 years. It just doesn't work. The story clearly communicates that Ellie is humanities only chance for survival and that there's an extremely high probability for a cure. To diminish this potentiality is to diminish the moral dilemma on which the ending hangs.
This post was edited on 3/13/23 at 9:11 am
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