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Message
re: Stranger Things Season 4 official discussion thread. (Spoilers)
Posted on 7/13/22 at 8:17 pm to DiamondDog
Posted on 7/13/22 at 8:17 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
Will is queer as a 3 dollar bill. This shouldn't be surprising. His favorite food is obviously hot dogs.
It’s so obvious what they are doing and IMO it’s propaganda bullshite that serves no place in the story, with that said it’s not ruining the show for me an any way at this point in time.
1
Posted on 7/13/22 at 8:32 pm to SportsGuyNOLA
quote:
Eddie sucked I was hoping he would die and was so glad that they killed him off Best part of this entire season
quote:
SportsGuyNOLA
I hope Nola is next.
Posted on 7/13/22 at 9:08 pm to Lsut81
quote:
I thought the Duffner brothers had to be convinced to do season 4/5? That they hated it and wanted to get out of the game?
Where do some of y’all come up with these things
They’ve always said they were doing 4 or 5 seasons
Posted on 7/13/22 at 10:53 pm to Jack Ruby
Posted on 7/13/22 at 11:24 pm to CP3LSU25
Finished S4 tonight. Overall, I enjoyed the season as a whole, but man there are some bad bad things about it. I plan on catching up with the thread over the next week or so, but wanted to get my thoughts down before I forgot them.
Them killing Max and then having El wave her magic wand and undo it was absolutely the worst thing to happen in the entire series. Killing off a main character like Max would have hit so hard and shown that there were actual, real consequences on the show. Max isn’t Barb or even Bob; she is a main character. So to bring her literally back from the dead just takes so much away from the show. It’s one of the reasons HBO shows are so damn good, because any character at any level can go at any time. It just made her death (and Lucas’s pain) feel so cheap because it wasn’t real in the end. And they could’ve even had real stakes with Vecna just fricking her up and her being saved in the end. But they actually took the step to kill her, only to have El literally be like “Nah, not on my watch” and erase it.
Eddie dying was whatever for me. He was a secondary (or even tertiary) and they foreshadowed it basically the entire season. It also didn’t make sense to me why him playing the guitar “distracted” the bats…are they attracted to loud noises or some shite? Just felt like a cheap way to get a “killer guitar solo, dude” Metallica reference in there.
This season was so, so much darker than previous ones. Even S3, which was really dark. But this one was even darker, and not in a bad way really. I dug the tone.
Once again, the main characters were all split for basically the entire season. What made S1 do great was the kids being together (minus Will obviously but he sucks anyway). Also Hopper being around and involved. This season the whole Hopper in Russia storyline was borderline useless until the absolute very end (and it still didn’t even really seem to matter much anyway). And the kids being separated into multiple groups took a lot away from it too IMO. I mean at one point Jonathan and Mike were sidelined watching El’s body lying in a water tank guessing what was happening.
It’s always funny seeing characters go into God mode when necessary though. El is the best example obviously. But in the Russian prison, four armed guards are shooting countless assault rifle bullets at the demigorgan only for it to brush it off and kill them all. Yet Hopper kills one with a single shot from a small handgun. Or kills the main one with a sword.
Steve made major progress again this season. He’s a great character now (and has been for a while). Robin should’ve gotten killed off; she’s horrible, and any likability she carried over from S3 was gone quickly. Erica was shelved more this season, thank God. She was much more tolerable. Will being more involved just felt weird. And I was all on the “he’s gay” bandwagon, but also he may have a thing for El and what we think he’s feeling for Mike he really feels for El. Jonathan was a waste. So was Argyle, but he was solely for humor purposes obviously. Lucas was great. Max was great too. I liked the Vecna character and how he connected with everything, but man I could’ve done without the 15-20 minute soliloquies in multiple episodes. That was tiresome.
But my two main gripe about it are the overly predictable tropes and the zero resolution.
Everything about this season was so overly cliché that it felt cheap and like the writers were mailing it in. I watched with my stepdaughter and kept predicting lines and dialogue every few minutes because it was so clichéd and trope-y. From the dialogue to the “sports/jock pep talk speeches the basketball dude gave multiple times to groups of people. It was still enjoyable, but that stuff was more than noticeable.
As far as no resolution, that annoyed me the most. How many times did we see Hopper almost get away only to not. Thankfully, he finally got away and back to Hawkins in the last 20 minutes I guess. But nothing was resolved. How much of the season revolves around figuring out Vecna and developing this sweet plan to kill him, only for it to not work at all and him still not only be alive, but basically be pissed per Will at the end. Steve and Nancy were foreshadowed for half a season to still have feelings and get back together, only to have that not happen in the end. Etc. Hell, Hawkins is now upside down central and in far worse shape than it was in the beginning. So there was just no real resolution to anything really outside of Hopper being rescued and reunited with Joyce and El.
Them killing Max and then having El wave her magic wand and undo it was absolutely the worst thing to happen in the entire series. Killing off a main character like Max would have hit so hard and shown that there were actual, real consequences on the show. Max isn’t Barb or even Bob; she is a main character. So to bring her literally back from the dead just takes so much away from the show. It’s one of the reasons HBO shows are so damn good, because any character at any level can go at any time. It just made her death (and Lucas’s pain) feel so cheap because it wasn’t real in the end. And they could’ve even had real stakes with Vecna just fricking her up and her being saved in the end. But they actually took the step to kill her, only to have El literally be like “Nah, not on my watch” and erase it.
Eddie dying was whatever for me. He was a secondary (or even tertiary) and they foreshadowed it basically the entire season. It also didn’t make sense to me why him playing the guitar “distracted” the bats…are they attracted to loud noises or some shite? Just felt like a cheap way to get a “killer guitar solo, dude” Metallica reference in there.
This season was so, so much darker than previous ones. Even S3, which was really dark. But this one was even darker, and not in a bad way really. I dug the tone.
Once again, the main characters were all split for basically the entire season. What made S1 do great was the kids being together (minus Will obviously but he sucks anyway). Also Hopper being around and involved. This season the whole Hopper in Russia storyline was borderline useless until the absolute very end (and it still didn’t even really seem to matter much anyway). And the kids being separated into multiple groups took a lot away from it too IMO. I mean at one point Jonathan and Mike were sidelined watching El’s body lying in a water tank guessing what was happening.
It’s always funny seeing characters go into God mode when necessary though. El is the best example obviously. But in the Russian prison, four armed guards are shooting countless assault rifle bullets at the demigorgan only for it to brush it off and kill them all. Yet Hopper kills one with a single shot from a small handgun. Or kills the main one with a sword.
Steve made major progress again this season. He’s a great character now (and has been for a while). Robin should’ve gotten killed off; she’s horrible, and any likability she carried over from S3 was gone quickly. Erica was shelved more this season, thank God. She was much more tolerable. Will being more involved just felt weird. And I was all on the “he’s gay” bandwagon, but also he may have a thing for El and what we think he’s feeling for Mike he really feels for El. Jonathan was a waste. So was Argyle, but he was solely for humor purposes obviously. Lucas was great. Max was great too. I liked the Vecna character and how he connected with everything, but man I could’ve done without the 15-20 minute soliloquies in multiple episodes. That was tiresome.
But my two main gripe about it are the overly predictable tropes and the zero resolution.
Everything about this season was so overly cliché that it felt cheap and like the writers were mailing it in. I watched with my stepdaughter and kept predicting lines and dialogue every few minutes because it was so clichéd and trope-y. From the dialogue to the “sports/jock pep talk speeches the basketball dude gave multiple times to groups of people. It was still enjoyable, but that stuff was more than noticeable.
As far as no resolution, that annoyed me the most. How many times did we see Hopper almost get away only to not. Thankfully, he finally got away and back to Hawkins in the last 20 minutes I guess. But nothing was resolved. How much of the season revolves around figuring out Vecna and developing this sweet plan to kill him, only for it to not work at all and him still not only be alive, but basically be pissed per Will at the end. Steve and Nancy were foreshadowed for half a season to still have feelings and get back together, only to have that not happen in the end. Etc. Hell, Hawkins is now upside down central and in far worse shape than it was in the beginning. So there was just no real resolution to anything really outside of Hopper being rescued and reunited with Joyce and El.
Posted on 7/13/22 at 11:55 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
Them killing Max and then having El wave her magic wand and undo it was absolutely the worst thing to happen in the entire series. Killing off a main character like Max would have hit so hard and shown that there were actual, real consequences on the show. Max isn’t Barb or even Bob; she is a main character. So to bring her literally back from the dead just takes so much away from the show. It’s one of the reasons HBO shows are so damn good, because any character at any level can go at any time. It just made her death (and Lucas’s pain) feel so cheap because it wasn’t real in the end. And they could’ve even had real stakes with Vecna just fricking her up and her being saved in the end. But they actually took the step to kill her, only to have El literally be like “Nah, not on my watch” and erase it.
To be fair we all think max is dead. At least she is her body is just a comma and will probably be used for Vecna.
quote:
Eddie dying was whatever for me. He was a secondary (or even tertiary) and they foreshadowed it basically the entire season. It also didn’t make sense to me why him playing the guitar “distracted” the bats…are they attracted to loud noises or some shite? Just felt like a cheap way to get a “killer guitar solo, dude” Metallica reference in there.
Eddie was by far one of the best characters in stranger things. They did a fantastic job on making us feel like he has been here since season 1 in only 9 episodes. Eddie will go down as one of the best characters of the show. That part was amazing IMO. Stuck with the whole 80’s theme and almost got me out of my chair fired up
This post was edited on 7/14/22 at 7:43 am
Posted on 7/13/22 at 11:59 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
So there was just no real resolution to anything
Lol what
We learned pretty much everything that we had questions about from season 1 to 3
Posted on 7/14/22 at 12:45 am to DiamondDog
quote:
Will is queer as a 3 dollar bill
there is no $3 bill
Posted on 7/14/22 at 1:16 am to CP3LSU25
quote:
We learned pretty much everything that we had questions about from season 1 to 3
I mean, we know who is controlling the upside down (sort of). That’s about it. We did get some answers as to exactly what El did to create the rips, which was nice. But it’s mainly just background information (which don’t get me wrong, is nice to have answers on that). But in terms of advancing the plot, there was no real resolution (as I said). This whole season felt like one giant setup for next season. Not that there’s anything wrong with that I guess, I’m just not a huge fan of that (even though I really liked this season). I like my seasons to wrap up semi-nicely and have some semblance of their own story and fitting that small chapter into the larger story. Whereas this one felt like it left too many open ended threads.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 8:41 am to CocomoLSU
Cocomo, I disagree with almost everything you said.
Impressive, really.
Impressive, really.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 8:47 am to CocomoLSU
is Dustin the real hero in all of this?
wasn't he the one who figured out the whole upside down thing in the beginning?
Also, i think Dustin is the one who came up with the Vecna thing too. And I think he figured out the "rips/gates" thing.
wasn't he the one who figured out the whole upside down thing in the beginning?
Also, i think Dustin is the one who came up with the Vecna thing too. And I think he figured out the "rips/gates" thing.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 8:50 am to CocomoLSU
You try so hard
Posted on 7/14/22 at 8:57 am to Salamander_Wilson
quote:
Cocomo, I disagree with almost everything you said. Impressive, really.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 9:16 am to CocomoLSU
I agree with you a lot of times but I disagree on nearly everything you said as well
This was easily better than Seasons 2&3. Their pacing of each episode and the overall story of the season was their best work by far. They got back to their roots and started focusing more on characters (El, Brenner, Hopper, Enzo, Eddie, Henry, Max, Steve and Robin) than just focusing mainly on plot. I feel like they had a good balance of both, though it was a shame to see some other characters take a backseat.
Some of the writing was cringe at times but let’s get serious…does it really take away from THIS show? It’s heavily inspired by cheesy 80s movies that have awful dialogue and writing but we still love those movies. And not all of the writing was like that. Max’s letter to Billy, Will talking to Mike in Argyle’s van, Brenner’s interactions with El, most of Eddie’s lines to Dustin and Steve, Dustin’s scene with Eddie’s dad all highlighted some of the really good writing in the show and even better directing and acting
This was easily better than Seasons 2&3. Their pacing of each episode and the overall story of the season was their best work by far. They got back to their roots and started focusing more on characters (El, Brenner, Hopper, Enzo, Eddie, Henry, Max, Steve and Robin) than just focusing mainly on plot. I feel like they had a good balance of both, though it was a shame to see some other characters take a backseat.
Some of the writing was cringe at times but let’s get serious…does it really take away from THIS show? It’s heavily inspired by cheesy 80s movies that have awful dialogue and writing but we still love those movies. And not all of the writing was like that. Max’s letter to Billy, Will talking to Mike in Argyle’s van, Brenner’s interactions with El, most of Eddie’s lines to Dustin and Steve, Dustin’s scene with Eddie’s dad all highlighted some of the really good writing in the show and even better directing and acting
Posted on 7/14/22 at 9:28 am to CocomoLSU
quote:
I like my seasons to wrap up semi-nicely and have some semblance of their own story and fitting that small chapter into the larger story. Whereas this one felt like it left too many open ended threads.
I think you made some good points, but I'll disagree here. The group has won every season. In order to make the final season grander, the bad guys needed to win one. If the season ended with them defeating Vecna, and the gates never opened, then season 5 could almost be unneeded. So, by having them get out alive, but really lose in the end, the viewers know the stakes for the final season.
You also mentioned having chapters. I think this actually fits with what you are saying. By having 4 an 5 basically be one huge storyline, it connects them like a book.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 9:31 am to CocomoLSU
quote:
But in terms of advancing the plot, there was no real resolution (as I said). This whole season felt like one giant setup for next season.
This makes absolutely no sense. We got Hopper and Co. out of Russia. Eleven gets her powers back in a big way. We have the revelation of who Vecna is (kind of a big plot advancement) and how he got there. We got answers on how portals were created. The kids are all back in Hawkins too.
What kind of plot movement were you looking for at this point?
And why is it unreasonable for a show to “set up” their final season?
Posted on 7/14/22 at 9:36 am to BluegrassBelle
I think just learning everything we did about Vecna was enough plot movement. I'll argue a couple of your points, though.
If they had just made him pass out in the lab after the explosion last season without the Russians taking him, we wouldn't have even needed that storyline.
If they never made them move or take a trip out there, this would be unnecessary, too. However, I did like them getting 11 out of there for most of the season. It allowed the likeable members of the crew the opportunity to take the lead. It also got the unlikeable guys out of there.
quote:
We got Hopper and Co. out of Russia.
If they had just made him pass out in the lab after the explosion last season without the Russians taking him, we wouldn't have even needed that storyline.
quote:
The kids are all back in Hawkins too.
If they never made them move or take a trip out there, this would be unnecessary, too. However, I did like them getting 11 out of there for most of the season. It allowed the likeable members of the crew the opportunity to take the lead. It also got the unlikeable guys out of there.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 9:44 am to MorbidTheClown
Long story short: these kids need to quit playing D&D because they keep activating all the demons irl
Posted on 7/14/22 at 10:08 am to DestrehanTiger
quote:
If they had just made him pass out in the lab after the explosion last season without the Russians taking him, we wouldn't have even needed that storyline.
Well, sure. But they went the Russia route, so it's still plot advancement from where we began the season.
quote:
If they never made them move or take a trip out there, this would be unnecessary, too. However, I did like them getting 11 out of there for most of the season. It allowed the likeable members of the crew the opportunity to take the lead. It also got the unlikeable guys out of there.
I also don't think it was unreasonable stretch that Joyce would want to get Will and Eleven TF out of Hawkins after everything that went down. It also developed more the Nancy/Jonathan/Steve triangle (Jonathan was just the likable "loser" and not terribly flawed for Nancy when he left Hawkins).
I just honestly would like to know what kind of plot advancement Coco wanted to see at this point with the storyline as it was when we came into this season.
Posted on 7/14/22 at 6:38 pm to WicKed WayZ
quote:
You try so hard
To do what? Sorry if my opinions of the show don’t match the majority, I guess. quote:
This was easily better than Seasons 2&3. Their pacing of each episode and the overall story of the season was their best work by far. They got back to their roots and started focusing more on characters (El, Brenner, Hopper, Enzo, Eddie, Henry, Max, Steve and Robin) than just focusing mainly on plot. I feel like they had a good balance of both, though it was a shame to see some other characters take a backseat.
I agree with almost all of that. This season was definitely better than 2 and 3. And everything I said was just my gripes about the season, but I really enjoyed S4 a lot. And I agree that some of the better characters took a back seat or were paired up randomly and that hurts the quality a little. This show was best when the main kids were together getting shite done. Having them all spread out isn’t as fun IMO.
quote:
Some of the writing was cringe at times but let’s get serious…does it really take away from THIS show?
It did for me a little bit, mainly because this show hadn’t ever been over the top cheese like this season’s dialogue. Was all of the dialogue like that? No, of course not. But a ton of it was though, and so noticeably so that it stood out many times to me. It didn’t make me hate it or anything…like I said, I liked the season a lot. But it was just noticeable this go round when it hasn’t ever been before.
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