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Posted on 1/10/16 at 2:04 pm to Antpile Tea Bagger
quote:
Is this the falcon leaving young Rey behind as she cries during the flash back scene?
No
Posted on 1/10/16 at 4:17 pm to lsufan9193969700
What's this from?
Posted on 1/10/16 at 6:16 pm to The_Joker
What ship is it?
Posted on 1/10/16 at 10:45 pm to Prominentwon
quote:
Finn vs. Kylo fight. Finn held his own. Isn't Kylo supposed to be a master fighter/jedi? How is Finn putting up a decent fight against him with a weapon (light saber) I'm assuming never was trained. Especially considering Kylo was trained all his life?
Then add that Finn was just sanitation.....
So Kylo had a bit of difficulty disposing of a Starkiller janitor. ....
Just rubbed me the wrong way.
Even with Kylo being injured, it's silly that Finn could do so well against him (i.e., he wasn't killed in the first 30 seconds of the fight).
However, if you look at how the force seems to 'awaken' in people (rey) in this movie, then it's plausible that Finn could last so long against an injured Kylo...
I mean, Rey wasn't trained at all so far as we know, and she was able to almost defeat Kylo (injured as he was) by just closing her eyes and thinking hard about 'the force'...and she went on to subsequently display moves well beyond what we've seen from a novice in prior Star Wars movies. Rey's skill at the end of the movie was foreshadowed by her skill at the beginning (as a pilot who was SHOCKED that she flew the falcon as well as she did).
If you take Rey's awakening at face value, you can apply similar traits to Finn. He was shocked early on in the movie at how well he was able to shoot... Throughout the movie, he picked up fighting/shooting skills quickly (so quickly that he was often surprised). If you juxtapose that with Rey's experience flying the Falcon...and juxtapose his fight with Ren against Rey's fight with him...it might appear that Finn has the force, but he isn't as strong in it as Rey nor is he as fully aware his force abilities as Rey is.
Personally, I don't think either Rey or Finn should have lasted more than a minute against Ren (even if he was injured) no matter how gifted they are in the force if they were untrained. I also think TFA was a far superior movie to any of the prequels, and because of that, I'm willing to overlook that huge altering of canon regarding new force users. I mean, i'd rather have new force users close their eyes and channel the force ala Neo in the Matrix all day long than have a dull Jedi take blood samples and drone on and on about Midichlorians...it's all relative, imo.
Posted on 1/10/16 at 11:07 pm to rosiebean
quote:I highly doubt that Finn is Force sensitive. Ren was toying with him and when Finn landed a single blow, Ren disposed of him quickly. Heck the stormtrooper had him beat if not for Han saving him.
Even with Kylo being injured, it's silly that Finn could do so well against him (i.e., he wasn't killed in the first 30 seconds of the fight).
quote:First, you are downplaying his injury. He was hurt very badly and they made a point in the film to show how lethal Chewy's bowcaster is.
I mean, Rey wasn't trained at all so far as we know, and she was able to almost defeat Kylo (injured as he was) by just closing her eyes and thinking hard about 'the force'...and she went on to subsequently display moves well beyond what we've seen from a novice in prior Star Wars movies.
Second, Rey clearly demonstrated she could fight with her staff. It's not a stretch to think that a saber is similar.
Third, at first during the duel with Ren she was pissed off and emotional. Much like Ren is 24/7. Ren likely could have defeated her prior to her closing her eyes but he wanted her to join him so he just wore her down until he had her pinned.
Finally, when she closes her eyes its not that she just "thinks of 'the force'." She first controls her emotions which is key to channeling the Force. That was why she was able to ultimately defeat Ren in the end.
This post was edited on 1/10/16 at 11:08 pm
Posted on 1/10/16 at 11:52 pm to meeple
quote:
I highly doubt that Finn is Force sensitive. Ren was toying with him and when Finn landed a single blow, Ren disposed of him quickly. Heck the stormtrooper had him beat if not for Han saving him.
More than one person I have talked to about the movie thought it was ridiculous that Finn could land a single blow on Ren no matter how much Ren was 'toying' with him (and FWIW, Ren wasn't toying with him the entire fight...he was surprised at first at Finn's strength). Those critical of this aspect of the movie don't think Ren's injury was reason enough for Finn to last as long as he did. This criticism is not wholly unreasonable.
Luke, in the original movie, was beaten down by a Tuskan Raider and was almost beat down by a nobody in the Cantina...and no one can deny that Luke didn't have the force. Being a strong force user doesn't equal not being bested in a fight.
I'm not saying that Finn is strong with the force..I'm just saying that Finn's hit against Ren was seen by a fair number of movie goers as not keeping with canon as shown in the original trilogy. Especially if he's not at all force 'sensitive' (hate that stupid term. Everyone has the force in some ways accordion to the first movies...some were just stronger than others).
quote:
First, you are downplaying his injury. He was hurt very badly and they made a point in the film to show how lethal Chewy's bowcaster is.
Second, Rey clearly demonstrated she could fight with her staff. It's not a stretch to think that a saber is similar.
Third, at first during the duel with Ren she was pissed off and emotional. Much like Ren is 24/7. Ren likely could have defeated her prior to her closing her eyes but he wanted her to join him so he just wore her down until he had her pinned.
Finally, when she closes her eyes its not that she just "thinks of 'the force'." She first controls her emotions which is key to channeling the Force. That was why she was able to ultimately defeat Ren in the end.
Everything you just described goes against how new/burgeoning force users were shown to use/recognize their powers in the first movies.
Rey displayed strong force awareness after hearing Han say "yeah! It's real!". Luke displayed minor force awareness after training with Ben. Rey mastered force skills after hearing Han say "yeah, it's real!", skills that Luke was still struggling with in Jedi after training with Ben/Obi Wan and Yoda.
You can argue that Rey's show of power was rational in the Star Wars universe created during TFA...and I'd agree with given the universe JJ created, her power was 'organic'.
But her show of power (both the way it came on and the strength/mastery of it given her total lack of training or contact with a jedi master) was very different than it was presented in the original trilogy. And I'm not the only person who thinks as much.
This post was edited on 1/10/16 at 11:54 pm
Posted on 1/11/16 at 12:10 am to rosiebean
quote:
Luke, in the original movie, was beaten down by a Tuskan Raider and was almost beat down by a nobody in the Cantina...and no one can deny that Luke didn't have the force. Being a strong force user doesn't equal not being bested in a fight.
Farm Boy =/= Trained Stormtrooper
quote:
But her show of power (both the way it came on and the strength/mastery of it given her total lack of training or contact with a jedi master) was very different than it was presented in the original trilogy. And I'm not the only person who thinks as much.
They didn't explain this extremely well, but it is heavily implied her powers increased so quickly because:
A) Unlike Luke, She believed in the force immediately.
B) She was using fear, anger, and hate. Which as we all know is the "easy way" to having power in the force.
C) She was, uh....force fed, what the Force felt like when Kylo tried to mind rape her. So she just copied him to a certain degree.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 12:55 am to rosiebean
JJ knew better than to let Fin go down instantly like a little bitch.
Sharpton would have led a witch hunt to burn the franchise down for racism.
Sharpton would have led a witch hunt to burn the franchise down for racism.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:21 am to Antpile Tea Bagger
Don't know if this has been discussed already but if Kylo Ren is the pupil who went bad and killed the other Padawans Luke was training...well...how??? I mean, I can understand Luke not killing Kylo because he was family, but Luke is a master at this point how could he not have stopped Kylo from wiping out all of the other pupils?
Posted on 1/11/16 at 8:31 am to Tom288
quote:
Don't know if this has been discussed already but if Kylo Ren is the pupil who went bad and killed the other Padawans Luke was training...well...how??? I mean, I can understand Luke not killing Kylo because he was family, but Luke is a master at this point how could he not have stopped Kylo from wiping out all of the other pupils?
It's possible that Luke was off planet when it happened? I'm sure we'll find out just how many pupils Luke had and their ages in the start of the new jedi order, but I can see Luke leaving his nephew (probably also oldest of the trainees) in charge babysitting for a weekend or two if he had to go do something for the Republic.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 8:48 am to meeple
quote:Kylo should have just immobilized him like he did Rey then cut off his head. Terrible.
I highly doubt that Finn is Force sensitive. Ren was toying with him and when Finn landed a single blow, Ren disposed of him quickly. Heck the stormtrooper had him beat if not for Han saving him.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 8:48 am to The_Joker
quote:By far my favorite moment, and it was better the second time, which I did not expect.
The moment when the lightsaber flies into Rey's hand and the Force Theme wells up will probably always give me chills even though I know it's coming. So good.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 10:05 am to AlxTgr
I'm still getting over 30 years passing and everyone acting as if what happened in Iv-VI was forgotten.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 10:10 am to prplhze2000
quote:Tell me more.
everyone acting as if what happened in Iv-VI was forgotten.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 10:40 am to putt23
quote:
I do think VIII will be darker like Empire
agree
quote:
and have Leia die
do not agree
quote:
maybe Chewie too
I can absolutely see Chewie going out in a blaze of glory. Then again, I was really disappointed in how quickly he went back to every day stuff like flying Rey to find Luke after Han died. I was really expecting the film to end with Chewie either going out in a blaze of glory on Starkiller base, or just being complete dysfunctional emotionally to the point that he is nothing more than dead weight. I wish they would have made Han's death more impactful on him than just him yelling and shooting a single blast at Kylo Ren.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 11:27 am to TigerFanatic99
quote:
Then again, I was really disappointed in how quickly he went back to every day stuff like flying Rey to find Luke after Han died. I was really expecting the film to end with Chewie either going out in a blaze of glory on Starkiller base, or just being complete dysfunctional emotionally to the point that he is nothing more than dead weight. I wish they would have made Han's death more impactful on him than just him yelling and shooting a single blast at Kylo Ren.
It should have been Chewie that hugged Leia, not Rey.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 12:28 pm to Sgt_Lincoln_Osiris
quote:
should have been Chewie that hugged Leia, not Rey.
Nah, they got it right. I'll explain why I think so in a bit, trying to rock my son while typing with one hand is A tad difficult.
This post was edited on 1/11/16 at 12:30 pm
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:32 pm to Sgt_Lincoln_Osiris
quote:
It should have been Chewie that hugged Leia, not Rey
Yep, and this will bug me forever
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:43 pm to AlxTgr
As if what Luke and Han did was a legend or ancient history.
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