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Message
re: Star Trek First Impressions (SPOILERS IN THREAD)
Posted on 5/10/09 at 8:48 pm to SLC
Posted on 5/10/09 at 8:48 pm to SLC
I really enjoyed the movie for what it was, eye candy. HOWEVER, there were serious plot holes.
1. Supposedly it was a "star" that was going supernova. If it was the star at the center of the Romulan system, then destroying the star would simply result in destroying Romulus itself. No sun, no life. If the star was in another system, the Spock had YEARS to think of a way to block the supernova. Alpha Centari, for example, is over 4.3 light years away from Earth. If Spock was 4.3 years late, then I can understand the Romulans being pissed.
2. What crew, no matter how deep their hatred, would sit around for 25 years waiting on revenge when their planet had been destroyed?
3. How stupid is it to claim that only 10k Vulcans remained from a planet that held billions? Currently, according to the Association of Americans Resident Oversees, there are 6.6 million Americans living and working overseas. The Vulcans have warp ships (both military and commercial) and delegations in all the Federation planets. I would expect there are millions of Vulcans among the stars and the Federation planets. This is assuming that no additional Vulcans evacuated the planet as a huge hole was bored into their planet.
1. Supposedly it was a "star" that was going supernova. If it was the star at the center of the Romulan system, then destroying the star would simply result in destroying Romulus itself. No sun, no life. If the star was in another system, the Spock had YEARS to think of a way to block the supernova. Alpha Centari, for example, is over 4.3 light years away from Earth. If Spock was 4.3 years late, then I can understand the Romulans being pissed.
2. What crew, no matter how deep their hatred, would sit around for 25 years waiting on revenge when their planet had been destroyed?
3. How stupid is it to claim that only 10k Vulcans remained from a planet that held billions? Currently, according to the Association of Americans Resident Oversees, there are 6.6 million Americans living and working overseas. The Vulcans have warp ships (both military and commercial) and delegations in all the Federation planets. I would expect there are millions of Vulcans among the stars and the Federation planets. This is assuming that no additional Vulcans evacuated the planet as a huge hole was bored into their planet.
3
Posted on 5/10/09 at 8:58 pm to TigerDeacon
As I have said the motive was pretty weak. As you said, if it was the Sun in the Romulan system, then they were screwed no matter what. If it was further away then they had more time.
Also, it would have been far easier to simply go to Romulus and tell them about the catastrophe to happen 100 years later. So they could work on the problem. They could also add the Future ship to their arsenal and take over the entire galaxy.
Once again, the hatred of Spock and the Federation were not realistic in the movie. He simply should have gone to Romulus and started working on a way to stop the future destruction of Romulus.
I agree 1000% that the Vulcans have space vessels and just plain simple commerce would have more than 10,000 Vulcans off world. They also would most probably have off world settlements.
One of the most important reasons for space exploration is to start colonies on other planets in case a catastrophe happens. Simple Vulcan logic would have them colonize other worlds.
Also, it would have been far easier to simply go to Romulus and tell them about the catastrophe to happen 100 years later. So they could work on the problem. They could also add the Future ship to their arsenal and take over the entire galaxy.
Once again, the hatred of Spock and the Federation were not realistic in the movie. He simply should have gone to Romulus and started working on a way to stop the future destruction of Romulus.
I agree 1000% that the Vulcans have space vessels and just plain simple commerce would have more than 10,000 Vulcans off world. They also would most probably have off world settlements.
One of the most important reasons for space exploration is to start colonies on other planets in case a catastrophe happens. Simple Vulcan logic would have them colonize other worlds.
Posted on 5/10/09 at 9:03 pm to TigerMyth36
Also, at first Bana's character (Nero) didn't speak and the other Romulan spoke for him. Then there was a really great scene with the camera slowly zooming in on Bana as he started to slowly smirk at the thought of his plan comming together.
Then in the next scene, Nero was a chatty kathy. Why all the trouble to set him up as the silent type?
Then in the next scene, Nero was a chatty kathy. Why all the trouble to set him up as the silent type?
Posted on 5/10/09 at 9:31 pm to Volvagia
quote:
My one main complaint is that the third trailer gives a little too much away once you get in the story.
that's your first mistake. when i see a commercial for a movie I want to see, i don't watch any trailers or anymore commercials
Posted on 5/10/09 at 9:49 pm to mobiletide
Er...then it didn't happen. If it wasn't filmed then it isn't part of the story.
The Kelvin crew was not taken prisoner or Kirk would not have been on Earth. And Pike would not have told Kirk about the 800 survivors because he would not have known about them.
If the Klingons took them as prisoners then how did they escape and get the ship back? They would not have taken the Romulans prisoner and kept them near their ship for 25 years.
The Klingons would have taken the ship apart to reverse engineer the technology.
That simply makes no sense.
I am sure he probably tried to come up with an explanation for what they heck they were doing for 25 years, but that wouldn't work any better than them just sitting around repairing the ship for 25 years.
The Kelvin crew was not taken prisoner or Kirk would not have been on Earth. And Pike would not have told Kirk about the 800 survivors because he would not have known about them.
If the Klingons took them as prisoners then how did they escape and get the ship back? They would not have taken the Romulans prisoner and kept them near their ship for 25 years.
The Klingons would have taken the ship apart to reverse engineer the technology.
That simply makes no sense.
I am sure he probably tried to come up with an explanation for what they heck they were doing for 25 years, but that wouldn't work any better than them just sitting around repairing the ship for 25 years.
This post was edited on 5/10/09 at 9:55 pm
Posted on 5/10/09 at 9:56 pm to TigerMyth36
What about the fact that there wasn't an experienced crew on the Enterprise training on its operation prior to its first launch?
I mean, can you imagine the US sending its brand new flagship aircraft carrier out on its first mission manned by a bunch of ROTC kids?
I mean, can you imagine the US sending its brand new flagship aircraft carrier out on its first mission manned by a bunch of ROTC kids?
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:00 pm to Raz
The ship had not been officially commissioned for entry into the fleet. Remember pike made some comment about that.
They were rushed because of the threat to Vulcan so they stuffed anyone on any ship.
Would have been nice to get a line tossed out to explain why they main fleet was not near earth or able to get to Vulcan.
They were rushed because of the threat to Vulcan so they stuffed anyone on any ship.
Would have been nice to get a line tossed out to explain why they main fleet was not near earth or able to get to Vulcan.
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:18 pm to TigerMyth36
Yea I know, but they still would have people training on how to run the damn thing. It's the enterprise, not a hair dryer.
You really think you could just "stuff any ROTC kids" onto an aircraft carrier and they'd be able to run it?
You really think you could just "stuff any ROTC kids" onto an aircraft carrier and they'd be able to run it?
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:22 pm to Raz
Well, age realism has always been terrible in Hollywood. Used to be terrible for woman, but ok for men. Now it is not much better for men.
Plus,of course they were trying to attract a new younger crowd so they went with youngsters.
I didn't mind with the green chick or Uhura.
Plus,of course they were trying to attract a new younger crowd so they went with youngsters.
I didn't mind with the green chick or Uhura.
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:30 pm to TigerMyth36
quote:
the green chick
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:31 pm to TigerMyth36
I didn't think the green chick was hot... maybe if she had green lips too ?
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:34 pm to Raz
quote:
What about the fact that there wasn't an experienced crew on the Enterprise training on its operation prior to its first launch?
FWIW, they did this in Space Camp, and the results were pretty successful.
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:35 pm to shutterspeed
You did NOT just bring space camp into this!
Posted on 5/10/09 at 10:49 pm to Raz
quote:
You did NOT just bring space camp into this!
Since I don't know crap about Star Trek physics, I figured I had to contribute in some way.
Posted on 5/11/09 at 11:40 am to TigerDeacon
The scientific plotholes are pretty glaring, so lets just ignore them. 
FWIW, I think it was a brilliant idea to change the timeline. That way, any future Star Treks will not interfere with the older ones. The can just do whatever they want.
FWIW, I think it was a brilliant idea to change the timeline. That way, any future Star Treks will not interfere with the older ones. The can just do whatever they want.
Posted on 5/11/09 at 11:56 am to alajones
quote:
Then in the next scene, Nero was a chatty kathy. Why all the trouble to set him up as the silent type?
This is an excellent question.
I noticed this myself, and did some thinking about it, and here's my thinking:
The first time we see Nero, he's brooding, silent and angry. The destruction of Romulus was RECENT to him, and he was acting accordingly.
25 years later, we see him again...
A quarter century has passed in his "new" timeline. He has technology that no one in the current timeline can challenge. He's bored and arrogant. He KNOWS there's nothing Captain Pike can do to him.
"Hi, Chris," he says to Captain Pike, informally, as though Pike doesn't really matter to him. Because... he doesn't. No more than an insect would matter to you.
This is actually a very subtle piece of scripting. It conveys how Nero has changed as time has passed, through dialogue only. Not through plot progression.
Posted on 5/11/09 at 8:47 pm to SpqrTiger
quote:
"Hi, Chris," he says to Captain Pike
Yea
I forgot about that. "Hi Chris"... that was stupid, just like 50% of the dialogue in this movie.Posted on 5/11/09 at 9:00 pm to Raz
I still think if anyone wanted to find a beef with the movie, it ought to be more along the lines of why didn't Nero just contact Romulus to let them know about the impending destruction. They would have at least 100 years since Bones was about 130 in the first episode of Next Generation.
I know why he did not leave the spot. He wanted to capture Spock's ship, but once he had the ship all he needed to do was head to the Nova Sun and use the red matter on it, thus sparing Romulus.
There. The whole plot of the movie was beyond ridiculous. Still liked the movie though.
I know why he did not leave the spot. He wanted to capture Spock's ship, but once he had the ship all he needed to do was head to the Nova Sun and use the red matter on it, thus sparing Romulus.
There. The whole plot of the movie was beyond ridiculous. Still liked the movie though.
Posted on 5/11/09 at 9:03 pm to TigerMyth36
Well, there's plenty of stupid shite in the movie to go around, as demonstrated by this thread.
How about Scottie being able to step on board the Enterprise and be chief engineer without ever even seeing the ship before?
How about Scottie being able to step on board the Enterprise and be chief engineer without ever even seeing the ship before?
Posted on 5/11/09 at 9:13 pm to Raz
Yeah at least Bones became head of medical when his superior was killed.
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