re: OFFICIAL - The Dark Knight Rises Discussion Thread - *SPOILERS*

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I'm really upset with Ledger now. It would have been awesome to see te Joker as the judge.

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Captain Jones is played by Daniel Sunjata
He was a Federal Agent sent into Gotham and was killed after like 3 minutes of screen time

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how in the world

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bombastic evil guy

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As a person who grew up through the years reading Batman here and there I guess I got use to his unmatched intelligence and his dependence on it. Its his greatest equalizer. Even when fighting the superhuman, no brawn (even Superman) was ever a match for his brain. The Joker was the only foe that consistently hung with him or at least kept him guessing long enough to really f*ck up his life or those around him (ie killing Robin). The Joker always presented him with some insane choice that looked hopeless on the surface, even though Batman usually found a way to get through it. Even at his best, Batman always had an advantage or the Joker, he was crazy and Batman was smarter. In there lies, my problem with Nolan's Batman I guess. He's smart but purposely not that smart. Its like Nolan decided that no one could be that smart in the real world so Morgan Freeman's character was introduced to take most of the intellectual burden off Batman. Other than a couple of flashes of intelligence he really doesn't display his most famous trait in any of these films. The first film concentrates on Wayne becoming Batman physically and psychologically. He's too young and fresh at the vigilante game to even have developed the smarts that he relies on later in life. The second film deals with the burden of what he's become and the responsibility that comes with the job (remember he's already looking for a replacement). The third act deals with ahhhhh.....closure I guess. For some reason it puts his character back at square one where he's running into the frey without even thinking things through or considering the consequences of his actions. Its like he's learned nothing over the years but how NOT to deal with pain and regret. Without his intelligence he really is reduced to an angry man in a funny suit, nothing more. I'm sorry, that's not good enough for me. At least in the second film he's somewhat tested just trying to figure out what makes the Joker tick, but he still never has to outsmart him. This is not the Batman I know and love. I understand grounding the character physically but grounding him mentally is bullsh*t.

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I understand that the Joker would have narratively thrown off the third movie, at least the way Nolan structured it, but I also know that he and Two Face were originally supposed to be a major part of the plot. The end of TDK set up the story in that direction. Batman is forced to take responsibility for his actions, or at least thats how the film ends. But after 8 years we find out he really hasn't accepted any responsibility for the world he created. The streets magically clean up after the Joker's rampage because of a new law that's ultimately based on a lie, so Batman never has to face more super villains born from his own brash sense of justice and vigilantism (like the Joker). In the long run we see him sulking like a child over a loss of p*ssy rather than dealing with that fact that her life wasn't as important as the oath he took to protect the city. That's not Batman!!! That's the guy in the funny suit again. More importantly that's Nolan showing a big lack of consistency in his story. Some say the return to the Ras plotline brings the story back full circle, but I say there's actually no place for it by this time in the series. Why does anyone want to blow up Gotham anymore after its already been cleaned of it corruption? Who care if its all based on a lie (no one but Gordon and Wayne know that anyway), its clean! Blowing up the city is not a fulfillment of Ras' dream if the city is already corruption free. Batman fulfilled his dream already just in a different way, in fact he tells Liam Neesom that several times in Begins. If anything the whole plot to blow up the city is just revenge against Batman. Talia is so blinded by revenge (for some reason even though she hated her father) that she doesn't even realize the fusion reactor she helped create could act as a signing beacon of peace for the rest of the world to follow eliminating corruption her father sot to destroy in its wake. In the long run this cheapens the first film by corrupting the intent of it main antagonist. So I ask, why even go there? It turns this installment of the series basically into James Bond The World Is Not Enough, and I'm sure we all feel the same way about that movie.

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