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re: GoT "Middle Ground" Thread - Sn 4 - Offseason Discussion ***Spoilers Possible***
Posted on 5/17/14 at 10:26 am to OMLandshark
Posted on 5/17/14 at 10:26 am to OMLandshark
quote:
Yep, honestly Cat is one of LF's biggest victims. I think after being rejected by her, he no longer loved her, but was obsessed with her. While never acknowledging it even to himself, I think he wanted to personally sabotage Cat as much as Ned.
I honestly think up until made when Cat finds out he betrayed Ned, he thought he could move into Ned's spot once he died. Then he was all out of fricks to give after that.
1
Posted on 5/17/14 at 10:55 am to The Dude Abides
quote:
The Dude Abides
Thank you my ninja. I will watch them
eta: Should I wait and watch them after I read the books in the offseason though?
This post was edited on 5/17/14 at 11:00 am
Posted on 5/17/14 at 11:13 am to UMRealist
quote:
Should I wait and watch them after I read the books in the offseason though?
no. they are more filler info. It's stuff not in the books or the show. Just background info on the major houses.
Posted on 5/17/14 at 12:37 pm to Napoleon
quote:
no. they are more filler info. It's stuff not in the books or the show. Just background info on the major houses
+1
Posted on 5/17/14 at 12:52 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
I honestly think up until made when Cat finds out he betrayed Ned, he thought he could move into Ned's spot once he died. Then he was all out of fricks to give after that.
I think he planned it initially, but the moment he first saw Sansa, I think he gave up on Cat and set his sight solely on Sansa.
Posted on 5/17/14 at 1:39 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Argue!? It's completely LF's fault that the war started.
I don't know if you can use the word "fault" when it comes to Little Finger. He acted with purpose.
Cat just kept fricking up.
- She arrested an innocent Tyrion.
- She pretty much abandoned her children at Winterfell to personally deliver a message to Ned at King's Landing. (couldn't find a good courier I guess).
- She convinced Robb to move Roose up to a command position over GreatJohn (good idea in the short run, not so much now).
- She released Jamie, one of the most valuable hostages Robb could hope for on an off chance of getting Sansa and Arya released.
- I personally think the whole wanting to join up with Renly was a mistake. His claim on the throne was definitely behind Stannis' and his strength such as it was was based on personal popularity which is a fleeting thing.
Posted on 5/17/14 at 1:46 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Argue!? It's completely LF's fault that the war started.
Well I know that but there will be people arguing it isn't
Posted on 5/17/14 at 1:53 pm to Methuselah
quote:
He acted with purpose.
quote:
Cat just kept fricking up.
quote:
- She arrested an innocent Tyrion.
Because the killer had a knife that belonged to Tyrion but was planted by Littlefinger. Shitty assumption, but not surprised she made it.
quote:
- She pretty much abandoned her children at Winterfell to personally deliver a message to Ned at King's Landing. (couldn't find a good courier I guess).
Let's be fair. Would you really trust a courier to deliver that kind of message into Lannister territory?
And there must always be a Stark in Winterfell.
quote:
- She convinced Robb to move Roose up to a command position over GreatJohn (good idea in the short run, not so much now).
Like you just said, hindsight is 20/20.
quote:
- She released Jamie, one of the most valuable hostages Robb could hope for on an off chance of getting Sansa and Arya released.
Not the brightest move by any means. But I can't fault a Mother for going apeshit about her children.
quote:
- I personally think the whole wanting to join up with Renly was a mistake. His claim on the throne was definitely behind Stannis' and his strength such as it was was based on personal popularity which is a fleeting thing.
I honestly believe it was as simple as they saw the force that Renly had and that Stannis (without our now knowledge of Melisandre's influence) was essentially fricked. Robb didn't have the forces and it made sense.
Just playing Devil's Advocate here. I think Catelyn had purpose, but it was obviously misguided by her personal feelings regarding her family.
Posted on 5/17/14 at 4:49 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Because the killer had a knife that belonged to Tyrion but was planted by Littlefinger. Shitty assumption, but not surprised she made it.
That's true. And they did bend thing to make him look bad at the beginning. At little deception by GRRM I guess.
quote:
Let's be fair. Would you really trust a courier to deliver that kind of message into Lannister territory?
And there must always be a Stark in Winterfell.
If one of the greatest houses in Westeros can't find one person they trust to deliver the message than they're doing something wrong. Heck the guy that accompanied her (Ser Rodrick I think?) could have done it.
quote:
Not the brightest move by any means. But I can't fault a Mother for going apeshit about her children.
But she was really screwing her whole family, house and cause by giving away such a valuable asset.
quote:
I honestly believe it was as simple as they saw the force that Renly had and that Stannis (without our now knowledge of Melisandre's influence) was essentially fricked. Robb didn't have the forces and it made sense.
To be honest, the whole Renly/Stannis divide seemed a bit contrived to me. It's not like Renly was eager to create heirs to carry on his line. You'd think he would have worked out a deal to be Hand or something like that. (And for that matter, Stannis has no male heirs and his only daughter has greyscale. I'm not sure that Westeros succession laws allow daughters to claim the throne in the absence of sons and I think the greyscale thing would really complicate matters).
quote:
Just playing Devil's Advocate here
Yeah. Me too. I know my views on Catelyn are over the top but she just seems to have been used as a mechanism for a lot of the bad stuff that happened.)
Posted on 5/17/14 at 5:35 pm to Methuselah
Would any of the Tulley's be considered wise decision makers?
Posted on 5/17/14 at 6:45 pm to TigerintheNO
quote:
Would any of the Tulley's be considered wise decision makers?
Well, it was a pretty wise decision by Blackfish to go piss before the Red Wedding commenced.
Posted on 5/17/14 at 7:00 pm to TigerintheNO
quote:
Would any of the Tulley's be considered wise decision makers?
Blackfish is the only Tulley that might be worth a damn. He can shoot an accurate fire arrow at a floating coffin at least.
Posted on 5/18/14 at 9:57 am to Methuselah
For those who haven't read this far, what do you think will happen tonight?
I'm hoping Oberyn offers to fight for Tyrion and sansa pushes aunt lysa out the moondoor. Also maybe dany and dario will hook up.
I'm hoping Oberyn offers to fight for Tyrion and sansa pushes aunt lysa out the moondoor. Also maybe dany and dario will hook up.
This post was edited on 5/18/14 at 9:58 am
Posted on 5/18/14 at 10:02 am to iluvdatiger
where are you currently at in the books?
Posted on 5/18/14 at 3:03 pm to TigerintheNO
She stopped reading around the RW.
Posted on 5/18/14 at 3:11 pm to TigerintheNO
Based on the marriage arrangements Hoster had in place for his children, I'd say he was a great decision maker in regards to that (cementing ties to other Great Houses). Cat to Brandon Stark (then Ned once Brandon died), Lysa to Jaime (but went down the toilet once Cersei convinced him to join the Kingsguard to be close to her) but then changed to Jon Arryn (as soon as it was revealed that Lysa wasn't a virgin because of Littlefinger and Hoster wanted the Vale alliance during the Rebellion). As for Edmure, I can guarantee you that Hoster would've never OKed the Frey marriage--Edmure only did it because of Robb's screw-up. Hoster hated Walder Frey.
Posted on 5/18/14 at 4:19 pm to ladytiger118
Posted on 5/18/14 at 6:22 pm to TigerintheNO
I stopped at the red wedding before the season started but as of last week, I am up to the purple wedding. Going to try not to read any further until after the season ends.
Posted on 5/18/14 at 6:36 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
the moment he first saw Sansa, I think he gave up on Cat and set his sight solely on Sansa.
"psst. Hey girl."
Posted on 5/18/14 at 7:42 pm to UMRealist
That gif is so creepy.
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