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Started By
Message
Game of Thrones 2:2, SPOILERS HERE - FOR ALL BOOK READERS
Posted on 4/9/12 at 6:30 am
Posted on 4/9/12 at 6:30 am
A thread for those who've read the books.......
It's been a while for me and I dont have the time to re-read so help me out...questions regarding deviation from the books
1. Rakharo coming back as a head in a bag? Dont the bloodriders still all have pretty big parts to play in Mereen etc? I am surprised they killed one off.
2. Stannis banging Mellisandre on the table? I'm pretty sure there is no overt sexual contact between them in the books (at least none that GRRM tells us about), and certainly no talk of "giving him a son". Providing him an heir is a whole new motivation for that character. Again, a surprisingly big change. The supernatural aspect of her character (like giving birth to murdering shadow-monsters) would seem to contradict this.
3. Last week, Joffrey tells Cersei he has heard nasty rumors about her and Jaime. I think if I found out I might be the product of incest and my uncle was my dad, I would be a little more disturbed than he was. In the books, Joffrey never suspects these things to really be true correct? And he certainly never confronts her about it, eh?
I still love the show, but this season is really showing a willingness to deviate from the books more than last, and I am wondering about the future implications of these things.
It's been a while for me and I dont have the time to re-read so help me out...questions regarding deviation from the books
1. Rakharo coming back as a head in a bag? Dont the bloodriders still all have pretty big parts to play in Mereen etc? I am surprised they killed one off.
2. Stannis banging Mellisandre on the table? I'm pretty sure there is no overt sexual contact between them in the books (at least none that GRRM tells us about), and certainly no talk of "giving him a son". Providing him an heir is a whole new motivation for that character. Again, a surprisingly big change. The supernatural aspect of her character (like giving birth to murdering shadow-monsters) would seem to contradict this.
3. Last week, Joffrey tells Cersei he has heard nasty rumors about her and Jaime. I think if I found out I might be the product of incest and my uncle was my dad, I would be a little more disturbed than he was. In the books, Joffrey never suspects these things to really be true correct? And he certainly never confronts her about it, eh?
I still love the show, but this season is really showing a willingness to deviate from the books more than last, and I am wondering about the future implications of these things.
This post was edited on 4/9/12 at 7:09 am
7
Posted on 4/9/12 at 6:49 am to TigerRad
I don't remember 1 and 2 either. And I don't think Stannis' character would do what they have him doing. Seems to go against what GRRM had in mind with his character.
3 I can't recall. I want to say that there was a brief exchange bt Joffrey and his mother about the rumours.
3 I can't recall. I want to say that there was a brief exchange bt Joffrey and his mother about the rumours.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 6:55 am to TigerRad
This thread is sorely needed. Looks like the other one was threatening to devolve into the same endless argument that the Walking Dead threads suffered from.
One thing I might consider if I was you would be to change the name to something like - For those who have read the books. Spoilers could mean things people have found out about the future course of the t.v. series and I think that would be a whole other thread.
For your questions:
1 - Yeah, I don't think they killed any of the bloodriders, at least this early in the books. Can't remember if any died later on though.
2 - I'm thinking that the "son" she talked about will likely be the shadow creature. Which is of course also a change in the book but I'm thinking that may be where that's heading.
3- I know in the books it was Joffrey that sends the assasin to kill Bran but Cat interferes, they think it's Tyrian, etc. I don't remember his motivation but it could be that he knew about the rumors of the queen and Jamie.
- The one thing that caught my attention was that I don't think it was ever definitively established that Craster was giving his son's to the white walkers (if that's who those people/creatures were that picked up the baby in this episode). Both characters in the books and us fans all widely assumed that but I don't remember it being shown.
So far the changes don't bother me that much. I don't think slavish devotion to the books would necessarily translate well to the series. But I just hope they keep the basic story and the spirit of the books.
One thing I might consider if I was you would be to change the name to something like - For those who have read the books. Spoilers could mean things people have found out about the future course of the t.v. series and I think that would be a whole other thread.
For your questions:
1 - Yeah, I don't think they killed any of the bloodriders, at least this early in the books. Can't remember if any died later on though.
2 - I'm thinking that the "son" she talked about will likely be the shadow creature. Which is of course also a change in the book but I'm thinking that may be where that's heading.
3- I know in the books it was Joffrey that sends the assasin to kill Bran but Cat interferes, they think it's Tyrian, etc. I don't remember his motivation but it could be that he knew about the rumors of the queen and Jamie.
- The one thing that caught my attention was that I don't think it was ever definitively established that Craster was giving his son's to the white walkers (if that's who those people/creatures were that picked up the baby in this episode). Both characters in the books and us fans all widely assumed that but I don't remember it being shown.
So far the changes don't bother me that much. I don't think slavish devotion to the books would necessarily translate well to the series. But I just hope they keep the basic story and the spirit of the books.
This post was edited on 4/9/12 at 6:58 am
Posted on 4/9/12 at 7:32 am to Methuselah
Agree with meth on 1 and 2.
A couple of things - some changes are for budget (some characters play a few roles) and some are because we don't have chapter upon chapter with internal point of view.
I hated last weeks littlefinger overt threat to the queen, but it established littlefinger as not necessarily on the lannister side.
Craster sons was inferred, buy it was probably added for suspense sake to an episode with little action or suspense.
I am bothered by melisandres mention of sons - I do think it's the shadows - but I pictured stannis' seduction to be less sexual since it is out of his moral chacter.
Someone mentioned ros as jeyne Poole takeover in other thread. Completely see this - especially with littlefinger mentioning her red hair last night - she will be "double" for a character I think.
A couple of things - some changes are for budget (some characters play a few roles) and some are because we don't have chapter upon chapter with internal point of view.
I hated last weeks littlefinger overt threat to the queen, but it established littlefinger as not necessarily on the lannister side.
Craster sons was inferred, buy it was probably added for suspense sake to an episode with little action or suspense.
I am bothered by melisandres mention of sons - I do think it's the shadows - but I pictured stannis' seduction to be less sexual since it is out of his moral chacter.
Someone mentioned ros as jeyne Poole takeover in other thread. Completely see this - especially with littlefinger mentioning her red hair last night - she will be "double" for a character I think.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 7:37 am to Tigerstark
quote:
Someone mentioned ros as jeyne Poole takeover in other thread. Completely see this - especially with littlefinger mentioning her red hair last night - she will be "double" for a character I think.
I will officially LOL and call it stoo-pid if they try to pass that whore off as Arya.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:04 am to TigerRad
Spoilers through all books
She's passed off as sansa, not arya. And jeyne pool was in a whorehouse after the Ned stark death as well, not so big a stretch - plus they have established that she and theon knew eachother quite well, which comes into play.
She's passed off as sansa, not arya. And jeyne pool was in a whorehouse after the Ned stark death as well, not so big a stretch - plus they have established that she and theon knew eachother quite well, which comes into play.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:13 am to Tigerstark
quote:
She's passed off as sansa, not arya.
false
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:23 am to Tigerstark
quote:
She's passed off as sansa, not arya.
quote:
Tigerstark
ummm.....yeah, that's a no
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:24 am to TigerRad
quote:
I'm pretty sure there is no overt sexual contact between them in the books
I thought it was always talked about by other characters but no one ever knew for sure. The "son" given to him is obviously going to be the shadow that kills Renly.
Kind of like the Renly being gay thing. GRRM mentions that Renly has more clothes/outfits than most women but never comes out with a gay scene like in the 1st season with Ser Loras.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:34 am to joeyb147
quote:
The "son" given to him is obviously going to be the shadow that kills Renly.
this is what I'm thinking as well
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:10 am to TigerRad
Shoot - sorry yeah I messed that up. Was thinking too much of connecting these things and that jeyne was supposed to be decently pretty and became a whore and the march to sansa (since arya is not described as pretty) locked in my head.
Still think that's where the show goes - northern girl in brothel that knows theon and is under littlefingers care.
Still think that's where the show goes - northern girl in brothel that knows theon and is under littlefingers care.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:29 am to Tigerstark
quote:
Still think that's where the show goes - northern girl in brothel that knows theon and is under littlefingers care.
yea the more I think of this the more they are going to try and force this to happen. would actually be pretty impressive on the shows part to develop that character so early on
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:34 am to CE Tiger
only other book use I can see for her is to take the place of Alayaya
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:37 am to TigerRad
quote:
. Stannis banging Mellisandre on the table? I'm pretty sure there is no overt sexual contact between them in the books (at least none that GRRM tells us about), and certainly no talk of "giving him a son". Providing him an heir is a whole new motivation for that character. Again, a surprisingly big change. The supernatural aspect of her character (like giving birth to murdering shadow-monsters) would seem to contradict this.
there is one part in the book where the onion night is trying to figure out how mellisandre has such a hypnotic effect on Stanis. IIRC, he talks about how they are secluded with only each other at a growing and alarming rate. I think he even debates speaking to his son about it but decides better against it because he didn't want his son to be in that position. I don't know if he out and out says (or thinks) sex is a part of it. But, I agree this isn't like Stanis and not sure it was needed.
This post was edited on 4/9/12 at 9:41 am
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:02 am to Linkovich
I always assumed they were banging in the book. I think when you are trying to drive a point home in a show you have to have more drastic and obvious scenes like that sex scene. As a reader you get tons of info and backstory about the situation so its easier to understand. If they don't show a sex scene between her and Stannis then then casual viewer might not "get" it.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:09 am to Tigerstark
Im pretty sure jeyne poole was already in the first season. I could be wrong though.
Like it has been stated I think she is more of alalaya than anyone
Like it has been stated I think she is more of alalaya than anyone
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:36 am to CottonWasKing
I did get up at 3am for work this morning and am hesitent to make another memory blunder - isn't the whole point of alalaya is that shae was staying with her And her moms brothel and it allowed the imp to see Shae without tipping his enemies/father? She then gets pulled in as his whore girlfriend instead of shae and tortured? Thus far on show shae is staying in tower it appears so they have cut that part. Is there any other point to alalaya?
Of course cersei could easily still pull in roz due to some future circumstance.
Of course cersei could easily still pull in roz due to some future circumstance.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:41 am to Tigerstark
quote:
isn't the whole point of alalaya is that shae was staying with her And her moms brothel and it allowed the imp to see Shae without tipping his enemies/father?
If I recall, he moves Shae to the brothel later on
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:49 am to TigerRad
1. I don't remember Rakharo or any of the bloodriders dying in the 2nd book and I haven't finished book 3 so can't say about it. Probably added for more drama where the book might have been lagging in action as they were crossing the wasteland.
2. This actually makes sense to me considering Stannis' character and Melisandre's subsequent pregancy. Sort of reminds me of Morgana seducing Arthur in Excalibur.
3. This didn't bother me either. Joffrey is young and naive and wants to believe his mother at that point plus he's king so he doesn't want to believe. But as the rumors spread, Joffrey is definitely demented enough as believable in having Robert's bastards killed off.
I really don't see any long term implications from these deviations and I will continue to enjoy the show as long as they stick to the main story arcs in the book. I'm thinking it will continue to be a fun ride.
2. This actually makes sense to me considering Stannis' character and Melisandre's subsequent pregancy. Sort of reminds me of Morgana seducing Arthur in Excalibur.
3. This didn't bother me either. Joffrey is young and naive and wants to believe his mother at that point plus he's king so he doesn't want to believe. But as the rumors spread, Joffrey is definitely demented enough as believable in having Robert's bastards killed off.
I really don't see any long term implications from these deviations and I will continue to enjoy the show as long as they stick to the main story arcs in the book. I'm thinking it will continue to be a fun ride.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 10:51 am to TigerRad
quote:
2. Stannis banging Mellisandre on the table? I'm pretty sure there is no overt sexual contact between them in the books (at least none that GRRM tells us about), and certainly no talk of "giving him a son". Providing him an heir is a whole new motivation for that character. Again, a surprisingly big change. The supernatural aspect of her character (like giving birth to murdering shadow-monsters) would seem to contradict this.
As said in the thread, because the shadows looked like Stannis, I always assumed he was banging her.
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