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re: Watch this video, and tell me NBA superstars didn't have it easier in the '90's
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:21 pm to PrimeTime Money
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:21 pm to PrimeTime Money
quote:
And unbelievably Jordan's beast numbers came in the 80's and early 90's when the game was so "brutal" and everybody was hand-checking and offensive players couldn't even get a shot off.
Well, that's why he's the GOAT. You can't use MJ's success as proof that defenses were overrated.
And in the latter part of his career, his mid-range game was the best in the L.
1
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:24 pm to AlaTiger
The last 2 guard we saw it in was Kobe--even late into his career, he could seemingly get to every point on the court due to his mid range game and footwork
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:25 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
Maybe your father if you are a kid. Most likely, your older brother who beats you at everything.
This is funny because
1- I was kidding you
2- I'm 53
3- From your posts, you sounded like you were close to my age.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:26 pm to PrimeTime Money
quote:
57
Thanks.
If this is true, I respect your opinion more knowing that you actually watched basketball in the 80s and 90s and aren't just an 18 year old basing your opinion off of Youtube video clips of highlights.
I am in the middle age group and could almost be your son, but I am old enough to have watched the game as a kid in the 80s into my mid 20s in the late 90s.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:26 pm to PrimeTime Money
quote:
57.
the + sign is missing.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:27 pm to mattz1122
quote:That's a cop out argument.
Well, that's why he's the GOAT.
Even the greatest players do not put up better numbers against "tougher" defense and their numbers go down when they play softer defenses.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:27 pm to fightingtiger2335
quote:
I find it funny when the people that act like the 90s were so forever ago, and that we have evolved and left that generation in the dust....then complain that college basketball is worst its ever been. You would think the way we have evolved into genetic freaks that college basketball would be best its ever been even with freshman.
The rules are what's inhibiting the college basketball product, not the caliber of athlete.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:27 pm to FightinTigersDammit
No. I am quite a bit younger than you.
Granddad.
Granddad.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:30 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
No. I am quite a bit younger than you. Granddad.
Gump punk!
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:30 pm to StrongSafety
quote:
The last 2 guard we saw it in was Kobe--even late into his career, he could seemingly get to every point on the court due to his mid range game and footwork
Yep. I was not a fan of Kobe as a person and felt that he was pretty selfish as a player, but you cannot deny his greatness. Its funny that more players dont try to develop that kind of game - or aren't more successful at it.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:32 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
Its funny that more players dont try to develop that kind of game - or aren't more successful at it.
ESPN doesn't show midrange jumpers. Company policy.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:32 pm to FightinTigersDammit
quote:
Gump punk!
I'm not a Gump. Those are fighting words. I'll come find you at the Piccadilly at 3pm when you're eating your dinner because of digestive problems and you get sleepy early now and we'll have to step outside and settle this like men.
Not taking that.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:32 pm to PrimeTime Money
MJ was the only one putting up those kinds of numbers on a regular basis back then, bud. He's still the career leader in PER. He still has 4 of the 10 highest single season PERs. But I guess defenses were just laying down for him.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:34 pm to TbirdSpur2010
It's a damn shame too. There's a lot of top tier talent just driving and waiting for the whistle.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:35 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
The rules are what's inhibiting the college basketball product, not the caliber of athlete
I strongly agree
but the development at the AAU level has stunted development.
Bigs are the best example and one can go back 15 years of lackluster American bigs. That's why Okafor has been so coveted (like Oden before him) because of his polish.
the MSB's favorite big, DeAndre, was classic example of guy coming out with nothing really but his athleticism.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:39 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
I'm not a Gump. Those are fighting words. I'll come find you at the Piccadilly at 3pm when you're eating your dinner because of digestive problems and you get sleepy early now and we'll have to step outside and settle this like men. Not taking that.
I'll take back the 'Gump' comment, but don't think for a minute you're gonna whip my arse and walk away undamaged, sonny.
And it's 11:38. PM. Sonny.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:40 pm to RonBurgundy
quote:
the MSB's favorite big, DeAndre, was classic example of guy coming out with nothing really but his athleticism.
You shut your whore mouth about my Aggie classmate, brocephus
quote:
the development at the AAU level has stunted development.
I can agree with this, however.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:43 pm to RonBurgundy
By the way, since you and Mattz brought up DeAndre Jordan, he's had 1,226 rebound this season... that's the most any player has had since Dennis Rodman in 1993-1994.
Before that, it wasn't done since Moses Malone in 1978.
Before that, it wasn't done since Moses Malone in 1978.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:47 pm to FightinTigersDammit
quote:
And it's 11:38 PM. Sonny.
You napped earlier and are up now with your prostate giving you fits so you keep having to pee. Plus, you forgot about how caffeine affects you now and you had that sweet tea at dinner and can't sleep. That and the nap earlier.
Admit it.
I'm just messing with you.
Posted on 4/16/15 at 11:51 pm to PrimeTime Money
I haven't read the OP yet or watched the video(I will in a sec) but I made a long post about this exact thing the other day.
I watched an old Bulls game against the Knicks. In the first quarter, the Bulls had a run where 6 or 7 out of 10 possessions or so, went to Jordan. Now, this IS NOT an attempt to diminish his game. And people can roll their eyes at this all they want, but it's exactly what happened....
Each time he touched the ball in this section of the game, Jordan ran up the right side of the court as the ball handler brought it up the floor. Each time Jordan sorta posted up near the block. The 3 other Bulls players parked it on the left side of the court, behind the 3 point line, and the ball was dumped to Jordan. I'm not exactly a rules expert over here, but it was obvious that man to man rules were nuts, because the Knicks players were all beyond the free throw line, save for the little dude guarding MJ.
With the ball in his hand, he's face up his defender, pump fake, jab step, turn his back, jab step, and pretty much just fell out the situation and create space. The man guarding him was the only player between him and the basket.
2 of the 6 or 7 possessions he put the ball on the floor but for some reason, illegal defense was called. I assume because a Knick defender came to double him too early...? The other times he shot little 12 footers over the man guarding him like there was nobody there....which he was a master at.
What really blew my mind was thinking about what the Spurs to do Lebron(which is amazing). There a plenty videos and pictures to show how difficult it is for guys to get to the basket when the Spurs don't want them to. If/when Lebron beats his man, 2 or 3 Spurs players immediately sink to the basket. It's a feat in and of itself just to get a path to the rim. It's just not realistic to dribble through that many guys for a clean look.
I don't know if it was always like this for Jordan, but in the game I watched, he didn't have to deal with ANYTHING like that. Hell, it was downright ridiculous how he could maneuver around the court.
What I took away from it was defenses now would be MUCH more difficult for guys back in the day to score on. Kobe's game would have been PERFECT against what I saw. He reminds me so much of Jordan now that I've seen full Bulls games. Lebron's size and speed would have demolished the man to man he would have seen. Not saying he would have averaged 40 or anything, but damn.
Sorry for this insanely long post, but I'm so interested in this discussion.
ETA: A more level headed and knowledgeable fan...looking at you, RTR and Spur, will correct this if need be....but I honestly believe that if Lebron played under the same system that Michael Jordan did, he'd be considered the better player by the majority of basketball fans.
I watched an old Bulls game against the Knicks. In the first quarter, the Bulls had a run where 6 or 7 out of 10 possessions or so, went to Jordan. Now, this IS NOT an attempt to diminish his game. And people can roll their eyes at this all they want, but it's exactly what happened....
Each time he touched the ball in this section of the game, Jordan ran up the right side of the court as the ball handler brought it up the floor. Each time Jordan sorta posted up near the block. The 3 other Bulls players parked it on the left side of the court, behind the 3 point line, and the ball was dumped to Jordan. I'm not exactly a rules expert over here, but it was obvious that man to man rules were nuts, because the Knicks players were all beyond the free throw line, save for the little dude guarding MJ.
With the ball in his hand, he's face up his defender, pump fake, jab step, turn his back, jab step, and pretty much just fell out the situation and create space. The man guarding him was the only player between him and the basket.
2 of the 6 or 7 possessions he put the ball on the floor but for some reason, illegal defense was called. I assume because a Knick defender came to double him too early...? The other times he shot little 12 footers over the man guarding him like there was nobody there....which he was a master at.
What really blew my mind was thinking about what the Spurs to do Lebron(which is amazing). There a plenty videos and pictures to show how difficult it is for guys to get to the basket when the Spurs don't want them to. If/when Lebron beats his man, 2 or 3 Spurs players immediately sink to the basket. It's a feat in and of itself just to get a path to the rim. It's just not realistic to dribble through that many guys for a clean look.
I don't know if it was always like this for Jordan, but in the game I watched, he didn't have to deal with ANYTHING like that. Hell, it was downright ridiculous how he could maneuver around the court.
What I took away from it was defenses now would be MUCH more difficult for guys back in the day to score on. Kobe's game would have been PERFECT against what I saw. He reminds me so much of Jordan now that I've seen full Bulls games. Lebron's size and speed would have demolished the man to man he would have seen. Not saying he would have averaged 40 or anything, but damn.
Sorry for this insanely long post, but I'm so interested in this discussion.
ETA: A more level headed and knowledgeable fan...looking at you, RTR and Spur, will correct this if need be....but I honestly believe that if Lebron played under the same system that Michael Jordan did, he'd be considered the better player by the majority of basketball fans.
This post was edited on 4/16/15 at 11:57 pm
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