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re: The Last Dance Episode 7 and 8 8PM Central

Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:38 pm to
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:38 pm to
quote:

When did you see an illegal defense foul recently?



What do you think defensive three seconds is?

quote:

This is blown so far out of proportion tbh


It's really not, sorry.

quote:

The 97-98 season saw two more fouls per game than the 19-20 season despite having 10 less possession per 48 minutes.



I know you think that this backs up your argument, but it really doesn't.

A foul in the 90's, because of the handcheck, was different than one in the 2010's.
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:39 pm to
quote:

it has absolutely changed how its played.


And that's my point.
Posted by WestCoastAg
Member since Oct 2012
149500 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:41 pm to
and my point is that doesnt matter cause teams are just as good at stopping offenses today as they were then
Posted by theducks
Where The Blazers Play
Member since Aug 2013
14218 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:42 pm to
quote:

What do you think defensive three seconds is?


Cmon this rule has little impact and there’s a big work around to it.

quote:

I know you think that this backs up your argument, but it really doesn't.

A foul in the 90's, because of the handcheck, was different than one in the 2010's.



There’s really no point in debating this anymore if you’re just reciting off of emotion and personal bias.
Posted by CP3LSU25
Louisiana
Member since Feb 2009
52570 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:42 pm to
Shawn Kemp Gary payton Reggie Miller Michael Jordan and the 90’s in one episode. I can die a happy man now
Posted by Byrdybyrd05
Member since Nov 2014
26439 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:44 pm to
I am so ready for next week’s episode with the Pacers and Reggie Miller.
Posted by GeauxAggie972
Poterbin Residence
Member since Aug 2009
29534 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:44 pm to
quote:

Players couldn’t hedge and if they left their guy defensively, they had to hard double. The game today is so much better defensively. The 3 ball has ruined the league’s perception defensively imo. All casual fans see nowadays is box scores.


It's just two different types of defenses between the eras. The 3 ball has ruined that perception because of the hedging. No point in the mid range anymore when someone can get over to you quicker and easier. It's more team/rotation defense now, which is more pleasantly appealing to the purists. Offenses just styled their games differently as well.
This post was edited on 5/10/20 at 11:49 pm
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:44 pm to
quote:

Cmon this rule has little impact and there’s a big work around to it.



It does.

quote:

There’s really no point in debating this anymore if you’re just reciting off of emotion and personal bias.



You mean, like you just did above?

I'm taking no side in this. Just pointing out how dumb it is to directly compare eras.

Again, I said I think 2000-01 Lakers win if there was some mythical cross-era tournament.
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:46 pm to
quote:

and my point is that doesnt matter cause teams are just as good at stopping offenses today as they were then



And my argument to that would be that turning defense into offense was more of a focus in the 90's whereas turning offense into more offense is the key now (i.e. get quick shots up)

Not saying either is more aesthetically pleasing than the other.

ETA: Also the points per possession is a little inflated now because of more threes being taken.

It still amazes me that it took this long for some genius to realize, "hey lets focus on making the shot that is worth 50% more than a dunk."
This post was edited on 5/10/20 at 11:49 pm
Posted by GeauxAggie972
Poterbin Residence
Member since Aug 2009
29534 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:50 pm to
That's the only reason why I was never really a dunker

Posted by Jwho77
cyperspace
Member since Sep 2003
83740 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:51 pm to
Posted by GeauxAggie972
Poterbin Residence
Member since Aug 2009
29534 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:52 pm to
At least Crying Jordan won't be the only meme he'll have now
Posted by WestCoastAg
Member since Oct 2012
149500 posts
Posted on 5/10/20 at 11:58 pm to
quote:

And my argument to that would be that turning defense into offense was more of a focus in the 90's whereas turning offense into more offense is the key now (i.e. get quick shots up)

and i fully understand the difference in styles. i am in no way making any comment on that. just that defenses now are equally as effective as they were then. im not making a comment on how they are, just that they are and thats all that really matters
quote:

It still amazes me that it took this long for some genius to realize, "hey lets focus on making the shot that is worth 50% more than a dunk."

fwiw, the most efficent shot in basketball is the uncontested layup. which a dunk pretty much is. teams just worked that idea to a fault
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:01 am to
quote:

fwiw, the most efficent shot in basketball is the uncontested layup.


Well yeah because it's a near 100% success rate, but there are only so many uncontested layups/dunks per game.

My point was really that it took players/coaches this long to realize the viability of shooting 3's as opposed to working the ball inside for 2 or drawing up a PnR to set up a Karl Malone type mid-range J.

All of that work when the math has always supported that shooting 30% from 3 > shooting 40% from 2.
Posted by CP3LSU25
Louisiana
Member since Feb 2009
52570 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:07 am to
quote:

I am so ready for next week’s episode with the Pacers and Reggie Miller.




Majority of people coming into this didn’t have this on their radar. It will be the best episode
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:09 am to
quote:

Majority of people coming into this didn’t have this on their radar. It will be the best episode



Maybe, but Reggie has largely bent the knee towards MJ since retirement.
Posted by ShamelessPel
Metairie
Member since Apr 2013
13052 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:18 am to
quote:

Only to simps

Jordan already said there is no MJ if there’s no Scotty. They just showed Pippen win 55 games without Mike. All people could talk about a couple weeks ago were how criminally underpaid he was his entire career. Most smart people will look at that, not a couple of split second bad decisions.

And fwiw he was hammered for it back then. If anything they glossed over it.


I don’t even get the hate for the benching of himself. I don’t get the hate for the migraine game. I don’t get the hate for waiting until the season to have surgery.

In 94, that was Pippen’s shot. I get Phil is trying to win and all, but that shot goes to Pippen. That dude was ok with being in the biggest shadow of all time. There are so many great players that never would have been ok with that role. And he somehow managed to stand out anyways. His team. His shot. Phil never does that to MJ. So if I’m Pippen, I’m beyond past “frick you”, and it’s almost like saying he doesn’t think Scottie can rise to that moment too. Scottie said it best on Ep 7. He let them down and regrets that, but going back, he wouldn’t change it. Nor should he. After years of watching legendary shots, this was his chance to have his own.

The migraine game is just dumb. They obviously didn’t understand migraines at the time like we do now. And it almost became a false narrative that is kept alive to protect MJs legacy and losing in that game 7. Pippen toughed it out and got shite on for it.

After watching Reinsdorf literally say “Jordan has been underpaid his whole career, so this is kind of catching that up” or something along those lines in Ep 7, that’s literally the exact thing he wouldn’t do for Scottie. Ever. Over and over. He let his teammates down, but Reinsdorf and Krause let them down even more by being blatant hypocrites in 97-98. He’s also probably thinking he’s going to protect his body some for the next contract.

None of those things are all that crazy.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
66696 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:18 am to
and i fully understand the difference in styles. i am in no way making any comment on that. just that defenses now are equally as effective as they were then. im not making a comment on how they are, just that they are and thats all that really matters



^^^
All false
Posted by Byrdybyrd05
Member since Nov 2014
26439 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:18 am to
So, we are going to get beating the Jazz back to back and the Pacers 98 series for the final 2 episodes? I hope they interview Karl Malone too and I hope he is pissed lol.
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79198 posts
Posted on 5/11/20 at 12:21 am to
quote:

I hope they interview Karl Malone


Won't be a real interview if he isn't wearing a shirt with the sleeves cutoff.
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