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re: Let's unpack the NIL problem shall we?

Posted on 1/11/24 at 2:50 pm to
Posted by LSUStar
Medellin
Member since Sep 2009
10455 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 2:50 pm to
These are not bad thoughts. The problem is that the NCAA is an effective monopoly that impairs the obligation of contracts.

quote:

Article I, Section 10, Clause 1:

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.


Much of this part of the document has been written out by the august SCOTUS completely contravening their oath, but that is another matter. The obligation of contracts cannot be impaired. Stated another way, any free person may enter into any relationship with any other person they deem suitable and the law has nothing to say about it. If all the schools collude to form an NCAA that is an ipso facto "law" impairing the obligation of contracts.
Posted by InkStainedWretch
Member since Dec 2018
1859 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 2:52 pm to
But all the noise coming out of Congress, except for Tuberville who is not exactly objective, is solidly on the players’ side. And the Supreme Court decision if you remember was 9-0.

Fans can jabber on message boards all they want to but … and this is why everyone is so pissed off, I get it and am none too happy about it myself … but nobody cares what you think and nobody is going to care what you think, especially if you’re outside the magic 18 to 49 age demographic which pretty much encompasses the old-school fans here. The genie is irrevocably out of the bottle. The players are driving the car. Just like in the pros.
Posted by LSUStar
Medellin
Member since Sep 2009
10455 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 2:57 pm to
Players asking for money from Saban

Pull quote:


quote:

Saban reportedly told attendees that the player in the transfer portal who requested $500,000 also asked that his girlfriend be enrolled at law school at Alabama and that her tuition be covered.


If every coach handled NIL like this, it would take care of itself.
Posted by Nomadic Bengal
Member since Jul 2022
1565 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 2:59 pm to
So everyone else has to stick to the commitments they make, but not the guy demanding it of everyone else. Got it.
Posted by ApexTiger
cary nc
Member since Oct 2003
53821 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:09 pm to
Great quote on Saban rejecting player request..

But Tell me how it came to be okay to ask coaches for money?

Isn't that completely off limits?

NIL and HC are supposed to be independent , right?

Are coaches managing the collective funds?
Posted by 91TIGER
Lafayette
Member since Aug 2006
17815 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:33 pm to
AD's should hire sports agents to bring in the players w/ money, it's the new way to go.
Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
28745 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:49 pm to
quote:

You would think at some point, a private organization has to be able to implement their own rules and regulations. The Universities Play under the NCAA. These are the transfer rules if you agree to if you sign said scholarship. (Maybe Scholarships need to be from the NCAA and not each school) No one is forcing these kids to sign the scholarship and play under these rules. They can look for other avenues.


Perhaps. But that was the crux of the lawsuit(s) filed by the AGs of several states. Their position is that the NCAA should not be allowed to implement and enforce a "residency rule" (aka "sit-one-year rule) because it is anti-competitive, unnecessarily restrictive, and is an antitrust violation. The federal judge in West Virginia issued a temporary injunction in enforcement of the rule. The NCAA, in turn said they aren't going to enforce it for at least the remainder of this year.

More likely, they see the writing on the wall that the courts will strike down the "sit one" rule so it is not worth fighting for. The AGs, 2x transfer players, and fans who wanted their 2x transfers available NOW didn't see the forest for the trees. So, essentially, you aren't going to see anymore "sit one" rules...which means every player is basically a free agent every year.

It's a complete mess because you have to deal with federal laws. The major conferences would probably like to agree to having the football and basketball players held as "employees" so the schools/conferences can then negotiate terms with a player's union where the schools can directly pay the players. However, its impractical because Title IX would not allow the schools to pay just the football and men's basketball players, or the football/men's basketball players more than the women's soccer players. In a pure free market situation LSU would pay Jayden Daniels significantly more than the backup left fielder on the softball team because Daniels generates infinitely more revenue/profit than the softball player. But doing so would be a violation of Title IX.

If you are a football player you DON'T want to be paid by the school because they can't pay you anywhere close to your actual market value. A private booster can pay you $2M. Thus, there wouldn't be a lot of incentive for the football players to collectively bargain with the conferences because as long as they are tied to the school they can't just bargain/negotiate independently of the other student-athletes. The majority of which aren't profitable.

The solution to that, which won't happen, is if the schools drop every other sport besides football and men's basketball. That would alleviate the need to pay non-profit producing athletes. Then, the football/basketball players could form a union and negotiate a reasonable pay for play terms. But again, that won't happen.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:50 pm to
quote:

What simple change will correct course?


1. Get rid of Title IX, make the student athletes employees, and sign them to binding contracts that last 3 years.

2. Make the transfer portal available, but the school you’re transferring to has to buy out the remaining contract.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:52 pm to
quote:

Schools shouldn’t have any ties whatsoever to NIL.


Yeah, having collectives is pretty bullshite in my opinion, especially when you have schools advertising fans to donate to their affiliated and official collectives.
Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
28745 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:55 pm to
quote:

If every coach handled NIL like this, it would take care of itself.


Believe me. They want to!

But because there is such a demand for success there is always going to be a market and someone willing to meet the demand. Saban may tell the player to "frick off". But there's going to be a wealthy Auburn, Georgia, A&M, etc booster who tells their HC "sign him. We'll meet his demand." Either the HC does it. Or that booster is pushing for the HC to be fired a year or two later.
Posted by chalmetteowl
Chalmette
Member since Jan 2008
48155 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 3:59 pm to
quote:

The FR at LSU or Bama would get the same as the FR at Vandy or Ark.


The freshmen at LSU and Bama deserve more though
Posted by chalmetteowl
Chalmette
Member since Jan 2008
48155 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 4:15 pm to
quote:

Saban reportedly told attendees that the player in the transfer portal who requested $500,000 also asked that his girlfriend be enrolled at law school at Alabama and that her tuition be covered. If every coach handled NIL like this, it would take care of itself.


Saban was one of the only coaches with the leverage and ability to turn down 5 stars though… most coaches can’t
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
72403 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 4:25 pm to
quote:

Fans can jabber on message boards all they want to but … and this is why everyone is so pissed off, I get it and am none too happy about it myself … but nobody cares what you think and nobody is going to care what you think, especially if you’re outside the magic 18 to 49 age demographic which pretty much encompasses the old-school fans here. The genie is irrevocably out of the bottle. The players are driving the car. Just like in the pros.
Yep, and the best part is, every one of the fans who are bitching will tune in to watch multiple games.

The viewership numbers prove that.

Not only do the people running the show not care, but the people bitching about it actually don’t care either.

This post was edited on 1/11/24 at 4:28 pm
Posted by WicKed WayZ
Louisiana Forever
Member since Sep 2011
31705 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 4:54 pm to
The transfer portal is a much, much bigger issue than the money. They HAVE to limit how many times you can transfer or you have to be a junior and then transfer all you want or whatever dumb rule they have to implement. THAT is the problem, not the money.
Posted by WicKed WayZ
Louisiana Forever
Member since Sep 2011
31705 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 4:58 pm to
quote:

Get rid of Title IX, make the student athletes employees, and sign them to binding contracts that last 3 years.



I would probably say 2 year contracts but this is probably the last resort but something that probably eventually happens if they keep the current infrastructure in place. It’s not sustainable. College is almost semi pro anyway. This would just push it over the edge.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 5:33 pm to
quote:

Do you think the NCAA is afraid to step in and upset the money train because 80% of the players are black?


No. Race of the athletes has nothing to do with it.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 5:37 pm to
quote:

by Alt26


You have an insightful post but I’m not going to quote it all in the reply. One thing we could do is tie NIL deals to attend certain schools. Accept pay for play as exactly what it is, and just work with it.

If you tied NIL to attend a certain school, you could make it contingent on number of years at a school.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 5:48 pm to
quote:

Set an universal amount that schools pay each athlete for its usage of the athletes name, image and likeness.


Unfortunately that’s illegal as it would be collective bargaining.
Posted by Oilfieldbiology
Member since Nov 2016
37723 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 5:50 pm to
quote:

So salary caps are anti trust violations?


Yes, unless collectively bargained like in the NFL
Posted by LSUFreek
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
14813 posts
Posted on 1/11/24 at 5:56 pm to
quote:

no more alumni collectives

So what happens when player makes his own endorsement deal with a company, but that company is owned by an alum, or the deal was brokered by a subordinate who went to the school?

Why prohibit fans of a school (alumni/non-alumni) from contributing to a collective but let corporations with alumni only make the deals? The school only facilitates deals/connections. They don't pay the players. Let fans have a say-so, if Nike, Reebok & Under Armour, etc. get to.
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