re: is there a more coordinated bigman in NBA history than AD23?

quote:

---

Peej, out of curiosity, why does the level of performance progress so much over time in the sports(track, swimming, weightlifting, rowing, biking,etc) where marks can be recorded and compared objectively but regress in sports where there are no objective marks but rather conjecture?

---

I disagree with you a lot, but this is a great way to frame this discussion. Unless you can measure things against an unwavering measuring stick, people will always disagree.

quote:

---

as he olympic level? He high jumped 6'6". That's not any good for an elite athlete of that size. But don't let an inconvenient thing like track and field where the results are standardized across different eras get in the way of your belief that Wilt would be some super-human athlete in todays game.

---

Wilt's high jump records are from 1957. The Fosbury Flop wasn't invented until 1965. Let that sink in.

The high jump record in 1957 was a shade over 7'. If you can't understand that a 7'1"+ man playing at track & field jumping 6'6" (6 inches less than the world record) as a glorified high-hurdle is ridiculous, I can't help you.

quote:

---

What do you want his assist numbers to be? He does everything else imaginable.

---

The ceiling of an offense led by a guy who's not an exceptional passer for his position is not very high. That is just a fact.

quote:

---

No, it's not a bad percentage. But we're talking about a guy who only lays the ball up and dunks who was taller and more athletic than just about everybody in his era.

---

You're bring silly . Its early but Wilts go to shot in his youth was a turnaround bank shot .

Just google Wilt Chamberlain turnaround bank shot & many articles will mention his patented shot . Plus his finger roll among other things.

He did not just dunk & lay the ball up.


Its obvious you have something personal with Wilt ,but with his track & field accomplishment, speed & strength that startled bodybuilders like Schwarzenegger .

Just stop it.

quote:

---

Like someone said earlier, if they didn't time track and field, there is zero question in my mind that people on here would claim Jesse Owens to be faster than Asafa Powell.

---

You mean the dirty Assafa Powell who has been banned from Track & Field?


Ironically you pick one of the dirtiest athletes in one of the dirtiest sports full of cheats like Powell, Linford Chrstie, Ben Johnson , Justin Gatlin, Tyson Gay, Maurice Greene,etc.....

In fact only Donovan Bailey (96) & Usain Bolt are the only 100 meter champions since 1984 not to fail drug test (and Carl Lewis did have a positive test for a ban substance).. The only 2 in the past 30 years not caught.


If you're going to dismiss the great Jesse Owens(who also ran on inferior tracks/equipment with no supplememts) at least don't use drug cheats.


Calvin Smith(world record 1983 ) was probably the last 'clean' sprinter & he was 5'10 / 160 soaking wet just like Owens. Not some muscled up 'dirty' modern sprinter who have the benefit of better tracks/shoes & supplements.

quote:

---

If you're going to dismiss the great Jesse Owens(who also ran on inferior tracks/equipment with no supplememts) at least don't use drug cheats.

---

You missed the point. Obviously, they are drug cheats. My point is people struggle to get past relativity of athletes. Jesse Owens beat all his competition while Asafa Powell was handily bested by a contemporary(Bolt). Luckily, its timed, but imagine if it weren't. Imagine how much ill-informed legend and conjecture there would be.

quote:

---

You missed the point. Obviously, they are drug cheats. M

---

No you missed my damn point & obviously you don't get perspective.

In 1936 :

1) Owens ran without a starting block -(imagine no starting block)

2) Owens ran on a slow uneven cinder track that became slower when wet (Not these blazing artificial tracks

3) Owens ran with heavy leather shoes & not the lighter footwear of today


Plus Owens never lifted weights (would have scoffed at it probably) & never heard of 'supplements'. And despite all of these disadvantages Jesse Owens ran a 10.2 .. His 10.2 looks even more impressive with perspective.


He easily goes sub 10 on better tracks , shoes & a damn starting block to power out of . Not to mention the supplements & weights the supposed 'superior modern athletes ' use.


I forgot to add Tim Montgomery to the list of record holders/Olympic champions along with Powell,Gay, Johnson,Christie,etc.......who were dirty.


Calvin Smith takes pride in being the last great 'natural' sprinter who at 5'10 /150 broke the world record in 1983(9.93). Evelyn Ashford the last female .

Its called perspective & like Marion Jones & Flo Jo(she looked almost transgendered) many sprinters today just haven't got caught with a dirty test.

quote:

---

sugar71

---

Posting very solidly, Sir!

quote:

---

Someone already named all the All-Star and HoF centers Wilt played against, so can we drop this overplayed BS?

---

I haven't bothered to see the names ,but that 6'6 White guys stuff is very ignorant & played out:

Walt Bellamy -6'11(HOF) 1961-74

Nate Thurmond- 6'11(HOF) 1963-77(Kareem played from 1969-89 & considered Thurmond his toughest defender ever followed by Wilt. Wilt agreed that Thurmond was probably his toughest individual defender).

Bill Russell - 6'9(HOF) (Nothing else to say besides these are barefoot/actual heights & not modern fudging if heights)

Willis Reed- 6'9 (HOF)


Walter Dukes- 7'0- 1953-69. (No HOF ,but a couple all star appearances).



Later career

Kareem- 7'2( considered Wilt his toughest defender ever behind only Thurmond perhaps.


Bob Lanier-6'11(HOF)

Wes Unseld was certainly only 6'7 but HOF player who made all star teams in the 60's ,70's & early 80's.

Plus there were only about 10-17 teams in the NBA during Wilts career so he played Russell,Thurmond, Bellamy,Reed, etc & others anywhere from 7 .9 times per season