re: If Andrew Luck Wins the Rookie of the Year

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Feel free to show me the QBs who had more efficient passing seasons. By all means, prove me wrong, don't get condescending, which I view as just throwing in the towel to be honest.

Prove me wrong, I don't mind.

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2010 Vick is pretty damn comparable.

I am totally fine with RG3 winning ROY; however, that does not change the fact that Luck has been impressive in my eyes.

I even said that RG3 is having the statistically greater year, but a part of the factor is that RG3 has been really lucky as well as good.

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RG3 has two games left to regress to Michael Vick.

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Ugh boy

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For people weighing the Colts' improvement from 2 to 9 wins, consider that the Colts had great incentive to lose last year (i.e., to draft Luck) and almost no reason to win, particularly late in the season.


This as well

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So an NFL team tanked a whole season for a QB with zero NFL experience? Y'all do realized they won two of their last three games?

Get out of here with that shite!

My vote goes to Morris.

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That hardly tells us anything about whether a running QB can or can't win a title.

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Steve Young has a title.

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Nope, but RG3 hasn't done that either, has he?

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Couldn't find the Dallas highlights so this is the best I could do. In the St Louis clips there's a throw that looks like it's from about the 25 and caught at about the 15 so that'd be 60 yards. The Cowboys one was longer.

RG3 is The Truth

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Steve Young wasn't running the ball 12 times a game either. The year he won the SB he only ran 58 times. He threw it 461.

I don't really care he wins, but I would note when Young won that I wouldn't classify him as a running qb. He wasn't even average 4 carries a game at that point in his career.

Edit: Just to go a little deeper. The most rushing attempts Young ever had in one season was 76. RG3 already has 112.

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Some follow-up questions:

1. Did you ever watch Steve Young play or are you only looking at numbers?

2. If Question 1 is a "Yes", would you dispute the fact that Steve Young was a mobile QB?

3. If Question 2 is a "No", do you not think it's slightly possible that had the spread read option been prevalent during Young's career that he would be utilized in a similar manner? Especially given that his Offensive Coordinator in his glory years was Mike Shanahan, the same man who is using RG3 in such a way?

If you think Young wasn't a mobile, running QB you're crazy. He was second only to Cunningham in rushing yards by a QB when he retired (he's now third given Vick's emergence). He owns rushing TD records for QBs and is by far the most rushing yards for a QB in the postseason. This was at a time when his QB runs were almost exclusively scrambles and not designed plays.

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Some follow-up questions:

1. Did you ever watch Steve Young play or are you only looking at numbers?

2. If Question 1 is a "Yes", would you dispute the fact that Steve Young was a mobile QB?

3. If Question 2 is a "No", do you not think it's slightly possible that had the spread read option been prevalent during Young's career that he would be utilized in a similar manner? Especially given that his Offensive Coordinator in his glory years was Mike Shanahan, the same man who is using RG3 in such a way?

If you think Young wasn't a mobile, running QB you're crazy. He was second only to Cunningham in rushing yards by a QB when he retired (he's now third given Vick's emergence). He owns rushing TD records for QBs and is by far the most rushing yards for a QB in the postseason. This was at a time when his QB runs were almost exclusively scrambles and not designed plays.

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I saw Young play. Obviously he was a mobile qb. I get that. But we were talking about qb's who won the SB. When he won the SB he didn't run all that much. That was the only thing I was trying to say.

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I saw Young play. Obviously he was a mobile qb. I get that. But we were talking about qb's who won the SB. When he won the SB he didn't run all that much. That was the only thing I was trying to say.

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Yea and I completely agree with that.

However, what I'm saying is, all of Young's runs were scrambles. So him running 5 times a game seems microscopic compared to RG3, but in reality they probably scrambled the exact amount per game. RG3's increase in runs per game is off of designed run plays, plays that weren't being used during Young's day.

All I'm saying is, when Young came into the league he was as athletic a QB as any we'd ever seen outside of Cunningham, but I really think Young's athleticism has been underrated over the years. I mean the guy could fvcking move.

I would say RG3's level of athleticism compared to the QBs of his day is on par with Young's athleticism compared to those of his era (if not greater). My argument is had this offensive scheme been around during Young's era, Shanahan would have used Young in the exact same way he's using RG3 as their skill-sets are so similar.

So in reality Young "scrambled" just as much as RG3 and had this system been around when Shannahan was his Offensive Coordinator I fully believe he would have used him in the same manner he's using RG3 and thus their numbers of carries a game would be more similar.

This argument is getting old. Your argument for Griffin is one of style over substance. The substance is that the teams of 3 rookie QB's are winning at unexpected rates. Based on substance an argument can be made for each of them. If I had a vote I would base it on my expectations for the players' teams and the players' respective contributions to their team's exceeding expectations.

On that basis I'd give the award to Luck. My expectations for the Colts were that they'd be lucky to win 6 games this season with no chances of making the playoffs. They have far exceeded those expectations, and they aren't winning with defense.

I expected the Redskins and Seahawks to be about 8 win teams this year with outside chances of making the playoffs. They have both exceeded my expectations, but not as much as the Colts. And I've watched the Redskins offense with Griffin and Cousins as QB. The scheme is effective with either playing, so Cousins' success detracts from Griffin, and makes me think the coaches are the ones who have made the difference. I will even concede that the coaches adopted the offensive scheme in anticipation of Griffin's unusual talents, but the scheme appears to work well with or without Griffin.

Wilson has been a pleasant surprise, but Seattle was 7-9 each of the last two seasons with journeymen, at best, QB's. Wilson beating out expensive free agent Matt Flynn indicates he is likely a step up from journeyman, and the improvement to the Seahawks has been good, but not exceptional.