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re: Baseball Hall of Fame ballot out today....felt dirty looking at it..who gets in?
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:28 am to Tiger n Miami AU83
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:28 am to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Probably won't be a poular opinion, but I say Clemens and Bonds should go in.
They were HOF's, likely first ballot, before the steriod use.
With the steriod use they arguably are the best hitter and pitcher to ever play the game.
Not to mention the majority of their competition was juicing as well.
Put them in, first ballot, says me.
i agree with you.
1
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:29 am to lukesbro
I would never vote for somebody linked to steroids. It makes the players that played clean in a decided disadvantage. How many hits or how many more years would a guy like Mark Grace have had if he used steroids? He would probably be in the HOF too if he used.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:29 am to LSUGrad9295
quote:
Bonds, Sosa, and Clemens are the headliners....needed a shower after seeing their filthy names.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:30 am to LSUGrad9295
this is the year Dale Murphy gets in or else I give the HOF zero credibility
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:30 am to SabiDojo
quote:and Rose was a first ballot before being a coach and gambling.
They were HOF's, likely first ballot, before the steriod use.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:49 am to lukesbro
Biggio is a great guy, but he is a juicer.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:51 am to GynoSandberg
quote:
Biggio is a great guy, but he is a juicer.
LINK?
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:54 am to GynoSandberg
quote:
Biggio is a great guy, but he is a juicer.
Because he played til he was 40?
Posted on 11/28/12 at 11:54 am to lukesbro
quote:
They were HOF's, likely first ballot, before the steriod use.
quote:
SabiDojo
I didn't say this.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:01 pm to LSUGrad9295
Had his 2 highest HR seasons at age 39 and 40. 3 straight 20 HR seasons at 38, 39, and 40.
Coincidentally, it also aligns with his move to the OF at age 37, where he would have needed extra speed, stamina, and a better throwing arm.
Richard Hidaldo, Bagwell, Clemens, Pettite, Jason Lane, and Biggio all took turns sticking each other.
Coincidentally, it also aligns with his move to the OF at age 37, where he would have needed extra speed, stamina, and a better throwing arm.
Richard Hidaldo, Bagwell, Clemens, Pettite, Jason Lane, and Biggio all took turns sticking each other.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:07 pm to LSUGrad9295
I'd vote in Piazza as a first ballot.
The first three probably get in eventually, but it needs to be delayed a few years.
Schilling and Morris should make it eventually but not Schilling as a first timer and I am not sure how many more Morris has left. Same with McGwire, Palmiero, Bags. Probably could make a case for all of them eventually, Raines would be the weakest in my opinion though.
So, bottom line, my votes would be:
Piazza
Morris, McGwire, Palmiero only if it is their last run.
Fairly certain Bags has a couple years left.
The first three probably get in eventually, but it needs to be delayed a few years.
Schilling and Morris should make it eventually but not Schilling as a first timer and I am not sure how many more Morris has left. Same with McGwire, Palmiero, Bags. Probably could make a case for all of them eventually, Raines would be the weakest in my opinion though.
So, bottom line, my votes would be:
Piazza
Morris, McGwire, Palmiero only if it is their last run.
Fairly certain Bags has a couple years left.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:07 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
Had his 2 highest HR seasons at age 39 and 40. 3 straight 20 HR seasons at 38, 39, and 40.
His move to the outfield might have made him feel like he needed to be more of a run producer? His average went down those years when he was hitting more homers...maybe he was swinging for the fences too much?
quote:
Coincidentally, it also aligns with his move to the OF at age 37, where he would have needed extra speed, stamina, and a better throwing arm.
The extra speed sure didn't kick in...his stolen bases dwindled to almost nothing by this point.
Maybe he juiced...maybe he didn't...but your argument is not a strong one.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:12 pm to LSUGrad9295
FWIW if I had to lean one way or the other on Biggio, I would say he was a juicer.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:12 pm to LSUGrad9295
quote:
Biggio, Piazza
these two are worthy
can't on the others, just can't
Morris yes, Curt yes but not first time
roid heads no never no thanks but no
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:13 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
Had his 2 highest HR seasons at age 39 and 40. 3 straight 20 HR seasons at 38, 39, and 40. Coincidentally, it also aligns with his move to the OF at age 37, where he would have needed extra speed, stamina, and a better throwing arm.
Richard Hidaldo, Bagwell, Clemens, Pettite, Jason Lane, and Biggio all took turns sticking each other.
This is exactly why I believe the steroids issue shouldn't be considered with voting, because if they do it turns into a Salem Witch Trial situation with speculation running rampant whether or not someone juiced.
I understand players that didn't take them are put at an unfair disadvantage, but you really have to choose which evil is lesser, voting players that possibly took PEDs or letting public perception that somebody took PEDs determine voting.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:14 pm to LSUGrad9295
quote:
Baseball Hall of Fame ballot out today....felt dirty looking at it..who gets in?
And, I just want to say something. Before we start bashing guys like Sosa, Clemens, and Bonds, let's remember that Bud Selig turned a blind eye to steroids/PED's for the longest time. It became part of the baseball culture. Does that make guys like Sosa and Clemens blameless? Of course not, but let's realize that much of the blame also falls on the League Offices.
Should they have an asterisk next to their names? HELL NO! Babe Ruth played in a league full of white men. He didn't have to deal with African American pitchers, Cuban hitters, or Japanese hitters. Where is his asterisk?
My point is that I find it ironic and disgusting that MLB puts an asterisk next to these names saying, "What they did was wrong because it wasn't a level playing field." Well, before Jackie Robinson broke the race barrier, the playing field wasn't fair either.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:15 pm to LSUGrad9295
quote:
His move to the outfield might have made him feel like he needed to be more of a run producer? His average went down those years when he was hitting more homers...maybe he was swinging for the fences too much?
He wasn't producing more runs, only home runs. His run and RBI totals were down from a typical Biggio season.
quote:
The extra speed sure didn't kick in...his stolen bases dwindled to almost nothing by this point.
His SBs dwindled in 2000. 3 years before he moved to the OF and 4 years before his big HR jump.
You dont have to believe it. It's not like I have proof. Just speculating.
quote:
This is exactly why I believe the steroids issue shouldn't be considered with voting, because if they do it turns into a Salem Witch Trial situation with speculation running rampant whether or not someone juiced.
I understand players that didn't take them are put at an unfair disadvantage, but you really have to choose which evil is lesser, voting players that possibly took PEDs or letting public perception that somebody took PEDs determine voting.
I agree. I'd vote Bonds, Clemens, Sosa, McGwire, and Palmiero in.
This post was edited on 11/28/12 at 12:16 pm
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:15 pm to LSUGrad9295
Piazza & Morris get in. Raines should get in but won't.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:18 pm to LSUGrad9295
I'd vote for the following:
Bonds
Sosa
Clemens
Biggio
Piazza
Schilling
Bagwell
Raines
McGwire
Palmeiro
Every one of them had a HOF career and I don't really give a shite about the steroids.
Bonds
Sosa
Clemens
Biggio
Piazza
Schilling
Bagwell
Raines
McGwire
Palmeiro
Every one of them had a HOF career and I don't really give a shite about the steroids.
Posted on 11/28/12 at 12:20 pm to TigerintheNO
quote:
Piazza & Morris get in. Raines should get in but won't.
Piazza put 15 years in and has a career batting average of over .300. What a career.
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