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re: ATL Thread | offseason hot takes + discussion
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:38 am to VADawg
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:38 am to VADawg
After seeing Wheeler against us, and watching him shut down the Padres last night, I am questioning if we REALLY have anyone like that. His salary looks like this:
2020 - $21,500,000
2021 - $22,500,000
2022 - $26,000,000
2023 - $24,500,000
2024 - $23,500,000
I still am unsure why they gave Morton $20 mil for next year. He obviously isn't a shutdown pitcher, and not even close. They paid Wheeler-esque money to Charlie Morton. I don't understand that at all.
The Braves threw Fried in the first game of the Phillies series. In theory this should be your shutdown/best pitcher. If you had the option who would you choose to pitch game one, Fried or Wheeler? What's worse is they can follow that up with Nola.
Strider was great this year, but it was his first season. I hope he keeps going on the same upward path, but we have seen regression in the staff in the past with young pitchers. It can happen to any team.
What do the Braves do about starting pitching?
2020 - $21,500,000
2021 - $22,500,000
2022 - $26,000,000
2023 - $24,500,000
2024 - $23,500,000
I still am unsure why they gave Morton $20 mil for next year. He obviously isn't a shutdown pitcher, and not even close. They paid Wheeler-esque money to Charlie Morton. I don't understand that at all.
The Braves threw Fried in the first game of the Phillies series. In theory this should be your shutdown/best pitcher. If you had the option who would you choose to pitch game one, Fried or Wheeler? What's worse is they can follow that up with Nola.
Strider was great this year, but it was his first season. I hope he keeps going on the same upward path, but we have seen regression in the staff in the past with young pitchers. It can happen to any team.
What do the Braves do about starting pitching?
3
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:44 am to VADawg
quote:
I think he gets traded in the offseason.
For what? In a bigger package for a SS or LF? A higher end SP to a team trying to save money? A back-end bullpen guy? Trying to restock the farm with some more position players?
(All of these are assuming he’s part of a bigger package and not traded straight up, because I’m not sure how much value he currently has individually)
quote:
While you can never have enough rotation depth, I do think one or two of those guys will get moved and I'm just guessing that Anderson will be one of them
So you’re counting on Elder or Mueller filling out the back end of the rotation? It’d be nice if one of them could establish themselves. Anderson has frustrated me as much as anybody—the University of Tennessee ran out like 5 guys throwing triple digits last year, and our 6’7” guy can’t sit over 94 in 2022. But he’s still so young, I’m still holding out hope he can add some velo, but maybe it’s time to give up on that.
What about Ynoa? We chalking his 1st half dominance in ‘21 up to the sticky stuff that can’t be replicated?
Lots of decisions for AA this off-season. 1st one has to be if he plans on re-signing Dansby and, if not, what to do at SS. Then LF has to be addressed. Grissom in left has been suggested, but Big Thicc seemed to have gotten a bit thiccer after becoming a dad and appeared to me to have gained 5 pounds or so. I always thought he was going to outgrow 3B, but 1B is occupied, so what about Riley to LF and Grissom to 3rd? Or did Grissom catch lightning in a bottle for a month and isn’t ready to play every day in the bigs yet and needs another full year of development in AAA where he can get regular ABs?
I’m still confused about the timing of that Morton extension and hope it doesn’t price us out of free agents and force AA to fill holes with trades. I’d rather hang on to our top prospects, but we may not be in a position to. Should be fun off-season to see how AA puts the team together. We’re too invested into winning now to not figure out a way to put a championship caliber club together ready to go on opening day. How he tries to go about that will certainly be interesting.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:45 am to 21zereaux
quote:
I still am unsure why they gave Morton $20 mil for next year. He obviously isn't a shutdown pitcher, and not even close. They paid Wheeler-esque money to Charlie Morton. I don't understand that at all.
AA talked about it on Chuck and Chernoff yesterday. He said Morton's stuff was still great (which is true) and then he talked a bunch about the differences in Morton's career when he's had a full offseason as opposed to when he hasn't. It made sense and I have some optimism for it.
quote:
The Braves threw Fried in the first game of the Phillies series. In theory this should be your shutdown/best pitcher. If you had the option who would you choose to pitch game one, Fried or Wheeler?
When Fried isn't dying of the flu and pitching with an extremely noticeable velo dip, it's really close. I also did not expect Wheeler to be this good for the Phillies. He was never this good before he got there.
quote:
What do the Braves do about starting pitching?
I and most Braves fans feel pretty good about 1-4. There are significantly worse options out there as a fourth starter than Charlie Morton.
As for the fifth spot, I think the team really wants Soroka to take it but AA said he has told Soroka that the team is not going into the season assuming he's going to be one of the starters.
If it's not Soroka, I think Elder will get the next crack at it.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:46 am to Hot Carl
quote:
What about Ynoa? We chalking his 1st half dominance in ‘21 up to the sticky stuff that can’t be replicated?
I think so. Also, he had Tommy John recently and will not be part of the 2023 plan regardless.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:49 am to 21zereaux
quote:
After seeing Wheeler against us, and watching him shut down the Padres last night, I am questioning if we REALLY have anyone like that.
Fried had a better season than Wheeler. Wheeler also didn't have some great game against us.
Fried had a really bad playoff performance, no doubt. I am not sure I make sweeping changes or assumptions bc of one bad performance. This sickness around Fried the last couple weeks has been strange to say the least.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:54 am to hiltacular
Ok, if you could have any current pitcher on any team start game one of a post-season series right now who would it be?
edit - starting game one this evening, everyone is fresh and rested and ready to pitch
edit - starting game one this evening, everyone is fresh and rested and ready to pitch
This post was edited on 10/19/22 at 10:56 am
Posted on 10/19/22 at 10:59 am to 21zereaux
I guess I would go with Sandy Alcantara or Zach Gallen.
This post was edited on 10/19/22 at 11:03 am
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:02 am to 21zereaux
quote:
After seeing Wheeler against us, and watching him shut down the Padres last night, I am questioning if we REALLY have anyone like that
I mean, are we just acting like Fried didn't completely shut down the Astros in Houston last year in one of the biggest games in Braves history?
And then followed that up with a season that will see him finish second or third in Cy Young.
The Fried slander on this board is ridiculous because he had one bad game.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:19 am to Broski
Yes, he had one bad game this post-season. Yes, he shut down the Astros last year in the WS. I am sure he will finish high in the Cy Young voting as well.
I wouldn't call it slander though. No one said he was a shitty pitcher. He is a very good pitcher during the regular season. He also went 0-1 this post season, and 2-2 in the postseason of 2021. It warrants looking at if his style of pitching is what you want from a post-season ace. Fried is not a blow-it-past-you kind of a pitcher. He can be very hot/cold, especially in the post-season.
It is all just discussion; something to talk about since we are now watching other teams play.
I wouldn't call it slander though. No one said he was a shitty pitcher. He is a very good pitcher during the regular season. He also went 0-1 this post season, and 2-2 in the postseason of 2021. It warrants looking at if his style of pitching is what you want from a post-season ace. Fried is not a blow-it-past-you kind of a pitcher. He can be very hot/cold, especially in the post-season.
It is all just discussion; something to talk about since we are now watching other teams play.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:20 am to 21zereaux
quote:
Ok, if you could have any current pitcher on any team start game one of a post-season series right now who would it be?
Scherzer
I tend to blow off Fried's two bad starts in the 2021 playoffs. Once he stopped tipping his off speed pitches, that shite got cleaned up quickly.
This post was edited on 10/19/22 at 11:21 am
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:23 am to Broski
It wasn't one game though. Game 5 NLCS last year, game 2 World Series, and of course this year. Fried is a very hot/cold pitcher in the postseason.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:29 am to Broski
quote:
The Fried slander on this board is ridiculous because he had one bad game.
Wasn't one bad game. He laid some terds in the playoffs last year. Last 10 games he only went beyond 6 innings twice. And many of those he only went 5 innings. I get that with modern baseball 6 innings is enough. But not for a bona fide ace. I'm not saying he needs to be traded. I'm just saying I'm not comfortable with him being the guy on a staff expected to win multiple WS.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:30 am to Dale Murphy
Hate to break this to you, but every pitcher has bad games.
I mean shite, look at the Mets downfall.
If you're looking for a pitcher to always be "on", good luck.
I mean shite, look at the Mets downfall.
If you're looking for a pitcher to always be "on", good luck.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:33 am to Dale Murphy
quote:
But not for a bona fide ace. I'm not saying he needs to be traded. I'm just saying I'm not comfortable with him being the guy on a staff expected to win multiple WS.
Strider is that motherfricker.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:38 am to Dawgfan247
quote:
Game 5 NLCS last year, game 2 World Series
Again, he was tipping his pitches in both of those games. Matt Diaz was on with MLB Network Radio the night of that World Series loss and he said he was calling out fastball or off speed pitch every time based on how fast Max was fluttering his glove. Houston didn't hit him for the rest of that start or any of his Game 6 start once he got the pitch tipping problem fixed.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:47 am to Dale Murphy
quote:
I'm just saying I'm not comfortable with him being the guy on a staff expected to win multiple WS.
quote:
Fried
Well you're gonna be disappointed, then. He's the bonafide ace of the staff, and rightly so.
He was not well his last RS start and his playoff start. IDK how many times we have to say it.
This Fried bashing from you and others on here is ridiculous.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 11:48 am to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
This Fried bashing from you and others on here is ridiculous.
No one is bashing him. It is just discussion. Something to pass the time until Spring training, that's all.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 1:01 pm to VADawg
quote:
As for the fifth spot, I think the team really wants Soroka to take it but AA said he has told Soroka that the team is not going into the season assuming he's going to be one of the starters.
If it's not Soroka, I think Elder will get the next crack at it.
Yeah those deGrom dreams some people keep spouting should have died with the Morton signing.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 1:02 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
This Fried bashing
Like I said, some people can't handle even mild criticism of the team.
Posted on 10/19/22 at 1:06 pm to Dale Murphy
quote:
I'm just saying I'm not comfortable with him being the guy on a staff expected to win multiple WS.
Our 1 may not be as good as some teams, but our 2 & 3 matches or beats almost anyone and even Charlie as the 4 is capable of the same.
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