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Message
re: 2021 NCAA MLAX Championship Tourney: UVA 17 vs. MD 16. UVA = Champs (2 in a row)
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:36 am to Crowknowsbest
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:36 am to Crowknowsbest
quote:
Ivies are already dropping off. Hell, they screwed 2 years worth of players due to canceling for Covid. The Ivies reminded everyone what they value & it's not athletics. Families & recruits aren't going to forget that anytime soon. Will other top prospect fill their spots? Of course. But the major talent is looking elsewhere & the landscape is changing.
Yeah it was Yale. Coming off of a great run & now where are they? Can you imagine a D1 Big 3 sport playing IN the Natty 1 year & NOT on the field, by choice the next?!??
They have lost now 2 seasons worth of top recruits over that move. They won't be back on top for a while, if ever again.
quote:
An Ivy was in the most recent national championship game.
Which was now 2 years ago, almost to the day. And what happened since Covid took over: the majority of Ivy league players transferred out to go to some top programs but many other mid to lower tier D1 & even D3 schools to PLAY. Then return for their grad degrees. There are articles all over on lacrosse guys who did this. Yale's top player transferred to Denver Univ. You think his top priority was his Ivy League education over lacrosse...?
When Covid restrictions began lifting in Feb/March, a few Ivies were floating the idea to play an all Ivy conference only schedule just to get the runs in. Only problem: Harvard, Yale, & Princeton didn't have enough guys still on campus/available to practice & play. He'll, Dartmouth lost to Tufts (D3) largely in part to their diminished roster.
quote:
An Ivy education can convince a lot of parents to overlook that.
Not in the lacrosse world, as things are changing & proving this doesn't hold as high regard as it used to. The grad school need for the changing job market of that caliber is requiring it more & more. As mentioned a few times in this discussion-players are choosing D1 lacrosse life with an easier path in undergrad to fuel them into legit grad school acceptances. And that will only continue to grow.
2
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:39 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Not in the lacrosse world, as things are changing & proving this doesn't hold as high regard as it used to. The grad school need for the changing job market of that caliber is requiring it more & more. As mentioned a few times in this discussion-players are choosing D1 lacrosse life with an easier path in undergrad to fuel them into legit grad school acceptances. And that will only continue to grow.
This is absolutely false on Wall Street (which is a major industry for men’s lacrosse graduates)
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:40 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Not in the lacrosse world, as things are changing & proving this doesn't hold as high regard as it used to. The grad school need for the changing job market of that caliber is requiring it more & more. As mentioned a few times in this discussion-players are choosing D1 lacrosse life with an easier path in undergrad to fuel them into legit grad school acceptances. And that will only continue to grow.
Unequivocally false
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:41 am to I Bleed Garnet
quote:
I take back what I said, but as someone said more top recruits are turning down scholarships and acceptance into a top tier university to play club at an SEC school I find that very hard to believe
You just don’t turn down the acceptance to Duke or UNC along with some money to attend, to play club lacrosse. Unless you use that as a spring board to then transfer into a D1 program
It was me that said & foreverlsu30 correctly assumed the context:
They're not choosing the school to play club over D1, they're choosing the school for the lifestyle & because they're burnt out. After 6+ months/up to a year or so off that freshman fall semester or year they realize they miss playing. So they then go join the club & they dominate right away.
Idk what it's going to take to help you see that the kids are doing this more now than ever before. I'm not saying it's a majority or all. But it's a significant enough number that lacrosse coaches are changing their recruiting tactics & expectations of kids these days.
All of this discussion has been GREAT to have & see on this forum. Thank you for the respectful back & forth.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:44 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
You realize & acknowledge that lacrosse, boys & girls, recruit rankings are as flawed as any in the sports world, far below the "accuracy" of fball, bball, & baseball, right?
Really? The teams getting all the 5*s do seem to win an awful lot.
quote:
These fragile white kids are getting high rankings in their middle schools years that they just fizzle by the time their peers catch up in size, weight, speed.
A lot of former highly ranked “fragile white kids” about to suit up in the Final Four this weekend.
quote:
Don't forget we are less than a generation removed from where prospects were committing to top college lax programs in 8th & 9th grade!
Moving past that actually helps blue bloods and decreases the amount of kids falling through the cracks. ACC schools can now wait to offer kids after they’ve seen them physically mature and are now also more willing to go after kids who committed early to other programs.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 9:45 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Idk what it's going to take to help you see that the kids are doing this more now than ever before. I'm not saying it's a majority or all.
Okay well this changes everything then
You spoke of it like the majority were until you said this
quote:
But it's a significant enough number that lacrosse coaches are changing their recruiting tactics & expectations of kids these days.
I still see the top recruits going to the blue bloods though
And the top recruits from the upper middle to upper class will go there as well, since these blue bloods are also near the top in academic ranking.
This post was edited on 5/26/21 at 9:48 am
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:18 am to I Bleed Garnet
quote:
Okay well this changes everything then
You spoke of it like the majority were until you said this
If I misspoke or mislead, I apologize. Thanks for the opportunity to clear that up.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:26 am to slappy dappy doo
Also, let me add to this about your Ivy League comment
Yes they didn’t have a sports season this year, and yes I only have websites to tell me this.
But just looking at commitments for the class of 2021
Penn has 8 top 100 recruits
Cornell has 4
Harvard has 4
Princeton Has 6
Yale has 6
I don’t think the Ivy League lacrosse pipeline is dead
Yes they didn’t have a sports season this year, and yes I only have websites to tell me this.
But just looking at commitments for the class of 2021
Penn has 8 top 100 recruits
Cornell has 4
Harvard has 4
Princeton Has 6
Yale has 6
I don’t think the Ivy League lacrosse pipeline is dead
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:39 am to I Bleed Garnet
Just poking my head in to say kudos to the civil and interesting discussion. Wish more threads could be like this
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:51 am to I Bleed Garnet
Those numbers have to be outdated. NLIs were vacated in droves & social media posts of most top players were being updated like mad over the last year.
Mainly due to the fact that most conferences were honoring the added year of eligibility for the covid issues. Those super super seniors are coming back/staying on rosters (ETA getting those grad degrees) leading more to the point of the younger generation wanting to "the guy" right away.
Mainly due to the fact that most conferences were honoring the added year of eligibility for the covid issues. Those super super seniors are coming back/staying on rosters (ETA getting those grad degrees) leading more to the point of the younger generation wanting to "the guy" right away.
This post was edited on 5/26/21 at 10:54 am
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:55 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Those numbers have to be outdated
Just going by insidelacrosse
And when you click those names, there’s no way these kind of kids are turning down Penn or Princeton for LSU or Ole Miss
But that’s just my opinion
Posted on 5/26/21 at 10:56 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Those super super seniors are coming back/staying on rosters (ETA getting those grad degrees)
Can they do that? I thought the Ivy League was sticking to their rule that they don’t allow grad students to play.
I know a lot of Ivy League players totally withdrew from school for a year to preserve their Undergrad status.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:01 am to Crowknowsbest
quote:
Can they do that? I thought the Ivy League was sticking to their rule that they don’t allow grad students to play.
I know a lot of Ivy League players totally withdrew from school for a year to preserve their Undergrad status.
Also, aren’t most these grad schools (mostly just looking at MBAs at these schools) looking for applicants with work experience?
Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think UPenn or Harvard take many if any MBA students right out of college
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:09 am to I Bleed Garnet
quote:
Also, aren’t most these grad schools (mostly just looking at MBAs at these schools) looking for applicants with work experience?
Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think UPenn or Harvard take many if any MBA students right out of college
Yeah. Very, very few right out of college at good business schools, if any.
A few MBA programs took a few more undergrad graduates during COVID, but that was a one-off decision for most.
ETA: average MBA student at HBS would have worked for 4-5 years after college before enrolling.
This post was edited on 5/26/21 at 11:14 am
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:15 am to Crowknowsbest
quote:
Yeah. Very, very few right out of college at good business schools, if any.
A few MBA programs took a few more undergrad graduates during COVID, but that was a one-off decision for most.
Just looked that Harvard’s MBA program the average experience of an enrolled student was 56 months
shite even South Carolina’s MBA program says applicants should have atleast 2 years of professional work experience
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:26 am to I Bleed Garnet
quote:
Also, aren’t most these grad schools (mostly just looking at MBAs at these schools) looking for applicants with work experience?
I'll fill you in on a not so secret exception known by those in the right circles (not exactly public knowledge, why would it be, rifht?):
This doesn't apply to D1 or even D2/D3 athletes nor even country club kids from the right families.
Daddy gets them on the payroll while they're in undergrad so their employment records are set by the time they finish their 4/5 years of undergrad.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:28 am to I Bleed Garnet
quote:
Just going by insidelacrosse
And when you click those names, there’s no way these kind of kids are turning down Penn or Princeton for LSU or Ole Miss
But that’s just my opinion
I think you're focusing on the wrong aspect of this. The current/historical too prospects are/have been those super connected kids. But the game has exploded. More blue collar/non wall street kids are playing & becoming top prospects. I think if you start to look at it from this angle, you'll see & recognize the changing trend & it's impact in near future.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:29 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
I'll fill you in on a not so secret exception known by those in the right circles (not exactly public knowledge, why would it be, rifht?):
This doesn't apply to D1 or even D2/D3 athletes nor even country club kids from the right families.
Daddy gets them on the payroll while they're in undergrad so their employment records are set by the time they finish their 4/5 years of undergrad.
Not at Ivy League schools. Grad students aren’t allowed to play.
Posted on 5/26/21 at 11:34 am to slappy dappy doo
quote:
I think you're focusing on the wrong aspect of this. The current/historical too prospects are/have been those super connected kids. But the game has exploded. More blue collar/non wall street kids are playing & becoming top prospects. I think if you start to look at it from this angle, you'll see & recognize the changing trend & it's impact in near future.
This is true, but the top prospects are still heavily weighted into one region of the country. Even if that shifts, nothing says the blue blood programs can’t recruit and sign those players from other areas. They already actively recruit nationally.
This post was edited on 5/26/21 at 11:38 am
Posted on 5/26/21 at 12:09 pm to slappy dappy doo
quote:
Daddy gets them on the payroll while they're in undergrad so their employment records are set by the time they finish their 4/5 years of undergrad.
So you’re saying that there are first year Harvard Business School students
That are 21-22 years old and just graduated college?
So let’s just sum this up what you say is going on and what is going to happen more often.
Chad is from the Hamptons, he has a 1200 SAT but is a 5 star recruit.
His dad is a former managing director at Goldman Sachs and now is the head trader at Point 72.
Penn, Duke and UNC are recruiting him. Instead of going to any of those schools, he chooses to play club at South Carolina. During his 4 years, Chad’s dad has “put him on the payroll” at Point72, so that when he graduates from South Carolina, he can go to Harvard Business school because his work experience matches what other applicants have
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