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MT Business Folk - "An offer letter is not a promise" - thoughts?
Posted on 8/1/23 at 11:44 am
Posted on 8/1/23 at 11:44 am
Young guy in our business, we're discussing some items in the business and he suggested changing some terms in recent hires' employment status.
I recommended we stick with the 6 or so new hires terms as they are written.
He's recommending we change them. And dropped that nugget.
Am I wrong?
Context for those
MJ: no degree, 30 years in bus with both successes and failures
YG: Around 28-30 yo, new baby, Harvard MBA completing soon
I recommended we stick with the 6 or so new hires terms as they are written.
He's recommending we change them. And dropped that nugget.
Am I wrong?
Context for those
MJ: no degree, 30 years in bus with both successes and failures
YG: Around 28-30 yo, new baby, Harvard MBA completing soon
This post was edited on 8/1/23 at 11:48 am
11
Posted on 8/1/23 at 11:52 am to Meauxjeaux
quote:
YG: Around 28-30 yo, new baby, Harvard MBA completing soon
So terrible "managers" are made, not born.
What he is proposing sounds like something an a-hole would say, that no one will ever want to work for or with.
If you are going to start treating your employees like crap (and changing offer letter terms after issuance is that), then you better be an employer that has such a well known reputation that people will want to still work for you.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 12:17 pm to Meauxjeaux
Technically, he is not wrong, but it would be really weird to have the statement "an offer letter is not a promise..." in paperwork for someone you already hired.
I agree with you on not including this, but hope you aren't dismissing his suggestions just because you are more experienced.
I agree with you on not including this, but hope you aren't dismissing his suggestions just because you are more experienced.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 12:22 pm to Meauxjeaux
Offer might not be legally enforceable but it is you word / reputation no?
Posted on 8/1/23 at 12:36 pm to thelawnwranglers
Agree - as you and LFH mention, it's not technically a promise, but you sure do expose your character as a business with these kinds of actions.
And them you double down on that with a "hey and we're hiring 20 new people over here on this other side of the business" comment while you ask these 6-7 (nearly lowest paid people in the business) to sacrifice, it sets up long term problems and dont-give-a-poop worker attitudes.
And them you double down on that with a "hey and we're hiring 20 new people over here on this other side of the business" comment while you ask these 6-7 (nearly lowest paid people in the business) to sacrifice, it sets up long term problems and dont-give-a-poop worker attitudes.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 1:07 pm to Meauxjeaux
Not only is it suboptimal from a reputation standpoint, If you hired decent candidates with options there is a risk of turnover or unhappy employees
Seems like a shortsighted idea. Any immediate gains from changing the terms could quickly evaporate and then some.
Seems like a shortsighted idea. Any immediate gains from changing the terms could quickly evaporate and then some.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 1:14 pm to Meauxjeaux
You could probably get sued by at least one of the new hires if the term changes are drastic enough.
Sure you can make your argument that an offer letter isn't a promise. Maybe you even have a good chance of winning the case.
Now explain that to anyone who does any modicum of research on your company when deciding if they want to apply/interview/accept a position.
Sure you can make your argument that an offer letter isn't a promise. Maybe you even have a good chance of winning the case.
Now explain that to anyone who does any modicum of research on your company when deciding if they want to apply/interview/accept a position.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 1:33 pm to Meauxjeaux
If your company's offer letters are appropriately drafted and you are in an at-will state (Louisiana is one), then he is absolutely right.
If your offer letters are poorly drafted, there is risk there.
In either case, changing a recent hire's employment terms is bush league and makes your company out to be an awful place to work.
If your offer letters are poorly drafted, there is risk there.
In either case, changing a recent hire's employment terms is bush league and makes your company out to be an awful place to work.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 1:40 pm to DallasTiger45
quote:
Not only is it suboptimal from a reputation standpoint, If you hired decent candidates with options there is a risk of turnover or unhappy employees
If a business creates a corporate culture that mistreats employees the predictable outcome will be a gradual loss of the better employees to competitors with better culture (employee morale).
What you end up disproportionately retaining are the employees other people don't want to hire.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 2:24 pm to Meauxjeaux
My oldest received an offer letter for a federal job which he had acknowledged and accepted. A couple of days later he called to talk about his start date. The agency HR didn't return calls or emails. So, he called the department he interviewed with and they said they would go talk to HR.
An hour or so later he received an email from HR saying the offer was rescinded. He was angry at first but then I explained to him he dodged a bullet and those folks were assholes.
An hour or so later he received an email from HR saying the offer was rescinded. He was angry at first but then I explained to him he dodged a bullet and those folks were assholes.
Posted on 8/1/23 at 2:33 pm to Meauxjeaux
Even if you legally can change the terms, its a terrible idea. Sounds like a great way to have your new hires either quit right away, be unhappy employees right off the start, and/or be actively seeking opportunity elsewhere to jump ship.
Even worse if you're in a specialized type of work where the potential labor pool is small and/or lots of people in the industry have connections with one another...where word gets around that damages the company's reputation and deters others from applying to work for the company.
Even worse if you're in a specialized type of work where the potential labor pool is small and/or lots of people in the industry have connections with one another...where word gets around that damages the company's reputation and deters others from applying to work for the company.
quote:Book sense but lacking common sense
YG: Around 28-30 yo, new baby, Harvard MBA completing soon
Posted on 8/1/23 at 9:58 pm to Meauxjeaux
I have no opinion on this matter, but as someone who spent time in DC and the beltway, I just want to say some of the dumbest ppl I have ever encountered have Harvard degrees, as well as a fully enhanced intellectual ego.
Posted on 8/2/23 at 5:39 am to Meauxjeaux
A Harvard education is meaningless in 2023, they are legacy or DEI students.
Look at the Fedgov, it is FILLED with Ivy league retards
Look at the Fedgov, it is FILLED with Ivy league retards
Posted on 8/2/23 at 7:00 am to Strannix
Yeah, it takes an idiot to know one, so take Strannix’s word for it.
Posted on 8/2/23 at 7:31 am to slackster
quote:
Yeah, it takes an idiot to know one, so take Strannix’s word for it.
Vaxx regret post
Posted on 8/2/23 at 8:48 am to Meauxjeaux
quote:My thoughts are that an a-hole would say that. You make an offer and people make decisions that change the course of their professional and family life. That is more than an ooopppssssiieee.
"An offer letter is not a promise" - thoughts?
Posted on 8/2/23 at 8:10 pm to Meauxjeaux
Tell him to sit his arse down. He has an MBA, but he’s not an attorney. I’d seek the advice of your company’s counsel regarding your state’s employment laws and whether an employment offer is a promise for performance.
Don’t take the legal advice of a non-lawyer 30 year old kid who has never had a real job
Don’t take the legal advice of a non-lawyer 30 year old kid who has never had a real job
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