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re: Dave Ramsey
Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:33 am to Double Oh
Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:33 am to Double Oh
Yes. Does way more good than this board would make you think. He’s not teaching you to maximize your investment income. He’s teaching you how to correct your life if you’ve fricked it up financially, and how to maintain a low financial risk lifestyle. If everyone in the country followed Dave Ramsey we’d be way better off. Many people are addicted to using debt to create or maintain a lifestyle that they can’t afford or haven’t earned yet. Many others have never been taught basic financials. It’s far more than you would think. Those two groups should not be using debt except for a mortgage. That is his audience. Most of Money Talk is not his audience and they need to realize that
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Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:37 am to Hopeful Doc
quote:
This is really the one that bothers me most. My household graduated residency with ~$270,000 in educational debt. We also came out making ~1.5x that.
His plan would have us pay off all of that before slotting those year-limited input retirement account dollars and only having $1,000 to fall back on (and he does occasionally "loosen" his rules when talking to higher earners, but not really).
His plan actually says to stop before you got the $270k in debt. He says there are better ways to pay for school than getting a loan, but most do because it is easy.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:37 am to Athletix
quote:
No He plays fear tactics too much. “The bank can call your loan due at a whim!!” Anyone who gives someone the advice to not take advantage of employer match in a 401k is a fool. He stands behind this advice. We’ve got a Dave Ramsey disciple at work. He was passing up a 6% company match, to pay off his house which was at around a 4% rate. He was convinced he’d be richer in the future with this approach. We laid out the math on how he was costing himself potentially over 100k of retirement dollars in the future. Didn’t care. Dave had him convinced. His rules are too stringent and restricts folks from taking advantage of low interest rate debts to maximize opportunities. With all that said. The vast majority of people aren’t very smart. They should listen to Dave Ramsey.
Either your coworker is an idiot or you need to do your research before you post bullshite. Dave says put 15% into 401k/retirement before paying off your house note
Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:42 am to RedStickBR
Responding to your whole post with one thought:
Dave created his baby steps to be a far encompassing, but simple approach. Something to fit any intelligence level and all walks of life.
It’s not perfect, but the only way you’re getting something more accurate for you is to either get too many details (would make the plan too difficult) or to get personal finance help (costs too much for most people)
Dave created his baby steps to be a far encompassing, but simple approach. Something to fit any intelligence level and all walks of life.
It’s not perfect, but the only way you’re getting something more accurate for you is to either get too many details (would make the plan too difficult) or to get personal finance help (costs too much for most people)
Posted on 4/20/20 at 11:46 am to Double Oh
quote:
You like him or not? It’s either a Yes or No
The fact that you are asking this means you don't understand finance. Every situation is different. He's a lifeline for some and completely useless (and maybe even detrimental) for others.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 2:52 pm to Paul Allen
What about his 401k allocation? Do you follow that[quote]What about his 401k allocation? Do you follow that.
I was following it but I'm trying to stockpile cash.
I was following it but I'm trying to stockpile cash.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 3:52 pm to Double Oh
Yes. He is a motivational speaker with imperfect information targeted to people in debt or with low financial knowledge. A good message that gets people to take action is sometime better then the ideal message people won’t follow.
His baby steps are pretty dumb/simplistic if you have some financial literacy.
His baby steps are pretty dumb/simplistic if you have some financial literacy.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 5:33 pm to Hopeful Doc
Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn’t Dave’s “rules” make it near impossible for most people to ever attend med school?
Posted on 4/20/20 at 6:01 pm to Double Oh
No. I've listened to him for several years, though, because I find him entertaining.
I really like his conservative approach to accumulate savings, but his investment advice borders on criminal. People will call in, and he will calculate their projected retirement growth using the S&P average of 13%, which is mind-boggling and completely out-of-step with his very conservative savings advice. He also recommends those stupid ELPs which all push front-end loaded fees on their mutual funds. There's a reason a lot of other financial experts hate him - his investment advice is downright shitty.
He's also a massive a-hole on the show, which I personally find hilarious and is the main reason I tune in from time to time. That and the people who call in and go "Hey Dave I am 100k in credit card debt and want to finance an emu farm for 1 million dollars. Is this a good idea?"
I really like his conservative approach to accumulate savings, but his investment advice borders on criminal. People will call in, and he will calculate their projected retirement growth using the S&P average of 13%, which is mind-boggling and completely out-of-step with his very conservative savings advice. He also recommends those stupid ELPs which all push front-end loaded fees on their mutual funds. There's a reason a lot of other financial experts hate him - his investment advice is downright shitty.
He's also a massive a-hole on the show, which I personally find hilarious and is the main reason I tune in from time to time. That and the people who call in and go "Hey Dave I am 100k in credit card debt and want to finance an emu farm for 1 million dollars. Is this a good idea?"
Posted on 4/20/20 at 9:26 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
The fact that you are asking this means you don't understand finance. Every situation is different. He's a lifeline for some and completely useless (and maybe even detrimental) for others.
Homie i understand finance just fine. Im just wanting to know if you like him or not. Simple question. Do you like him or not?
Posted on 4/20/20 at 9:28 pm to FinleyStreet
quote:
No. I've listened to him for several years, though, because I find him entertaining.
I really like his conservative approach to accumulate savings, but his investment advice borders on criminal. People will call in, and he will calculate their projected retirement growth using the S&P average of 13%, which is mind-boggling and completely out-of-step with his very conservative savings advice. He also recommends those stupid ELPs which all push front-end loaded fees on their mutual funds. There's a reason a lot of other financial experts hate him - his investment advice is downright shitty.
He's also a massive a-hole on the show, which I personally find hilarious and is the main reason I tune in from time to time. That and the people who call in and go "Hey Dave I am 100k in credit card debt and want to finance an emu farm for 1 million dollars. Is this a good idea?"
Some times he has to be a an a-hole hes trying to get his point across to someone who is deeply in debt. Nothing wrong with that.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 9:29 pm to Double Oh
For the record i like him. Might not agree with him on everything but i like him. His message is good.
Posted on 4/20/20 at 10:30 pm to BearsFan
quote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn’t Dave’s “rules” make it near impossible for most people to ever attend med school?
Yeah, I would've had to be an HVAC guy so that I could pay for my non-existent children's medical school or something like that.
Posted on 4/21/20 at 8:32 am to UltimaParadox
quote:
No..
I'm jealous I couldn't get rich by talking about common sense stuff
It's not common sense if it is not common. The large majority of America does not tie into he theology at all.
Posted on 4/21/20 at 9:45 am to Athletix
quote:
Anyone who gives someone the advice to not take advantage of employer match in a 401k is a fool. He stands behind this advice. We’ve got a Dave Ramsey disciple at work. He was passing up a 6% company match, to pay off his house which was at around a 4% rate. He was convinced he’d be richer in the future with this approach. We laid out the math on how he was costing himself potentially over 100k of retirement dollars in the future. Didn’t care. Dave had him convinced.
Your coworker needs to listen to Dave's advice again. That's not what his method is.
Posted on 4/21/20 at 9:53 am to Hopeful Doc
I get the marketability of offering a “one size fits all” strategy with hard and fast rules, but med school has got to be one of the few logical reasons to dive into that kind of debt.
I think this highlights how his advice isn’t for everyone. But for consumer debt ridden people, he is great.
I think this highlights how his advice isn’t for everyone. But for consumer debt ridden people, he is great.
Posted on 4/21/20 at 11:39 am to BearsFan
quote:
I get the marketability of offering a “one size fits all” strategy with hard and fast rules, but med school has got to be one of the few logical reasons to dive into that kind of debt.
I haven’t listened to dave in many years, but I remember him getting calls from people with $200k in student loan debt, and he would usually ask “whose the Dr?”. He never criticized them for taking on the dept, but he would come down on them if they were 55 years old and still paying off the student loans. The one “professional” school where he would come down pretty hard on someone for borrowing a couple of hundred grand to attend was chiropractic school.
Posted on 4/21/20 at 9:20 pm to EA6B
So is it safe to assume more people like Dave than dont like him in this thread?
Posted on 4/21/20 at 10:00 pm to Double Oh
Dave Ramsey is not perfect but I’d love to hear someone make a case for someone else who has done more to teach people how to get themselves out of bad money situations. The people who follow Dave Ramsey are not the problem in our society currently
Posted on 4/21/20 at 11:10 pm to RebelExpress38
(1) I think there is a consensus on this board that Ramsey is great for the overly indebted.
(2) I think the remaining debate concerns his advice for what to do if/once you are not in (or on the road to being in) a debt crisis.
(3) I think a consensus is beginning to be developed that his advice referenced in (2) is grossly inadequate (and perhaps even harmful from an opportunity cost perspective).
(4) People should distinguish between (1) and (2) when expressing praise/disdain for Ramsey so as not to mislead MTers into thinking either (a) all of his advice is good or (b) all of his advice is bad.
(2) I think the remaining debate concerns his advice for what to do if/once you are not in (or on the road to being in) a debt crisis.
(3) I think a consensus is beginning to be developed that his advice referenced in (2) is grossly inadequate (and perhaps even harmful from an opportunity cost perspective).
(4) People should distinguish between (1) and (2) when expressing praise/disdain for Ramsey so as not to mislead MTers into thinking either (a) all of his advice is good or (b) all of his advice is bad.
This post was edited on 4/21/20 at 11:16 pm
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