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re: Why would a depth limited team like LSU start an ACE against a lower seeded team?

Posted on 5/29/24 at 12:54 pm to
Posted by FireawayLSU
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2023
1057 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 12:54 pm to
Because the idiots like you that have jumped on the new rantard topic “pitching ace game 1” would be on the streets protesting if you lost to Wofford game one with your Ace or even 2nd starter on the bench.
This post was edited on 5/29/24 at 1:03 pm
Posted by WuShock
Metairie
Member since Aug 2018
1366 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:16 pm to
quote:

Why would a team that only has 2 days of starting quality pitchers (LSU) start one of their 2 game changing pitchers against an objectively inferior team?

1. Wofford is 3rd in the country in batting average. Stop acting like they aren't going to be able to get hits against average pitching.
2. If you lose game one, you have to win four more games to make it out of the regional. If you're worried about depth, losing game one puts you in a worse position than pitching your #1 in the first game.
Posted by Double Down
Mayor of St. George
Member since Dec 2007
7483 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:16 pm to
quote:

I understand alot


I understand you like down votes.
Posted by TigerBait2008
Boulder,CO
Member since Jun 2008
35282 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:17 pm to
You
Are
Dumb
Posted by alwaysknow
baton rouge
Member since May 2007
351 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:17 pm to
quote:

I'm also not claiming to be a baseball expert, I'm most definitely not.


Maybe JJ is an expert and has already considered this scenario?
Posted by Hurricane2020
Member since Apr 2020
2998 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:20 pm to
I am using my head.

The question is extremely simple.

Is LSU's day 3 group good enough to beat UNC's day 4 group in game 2?

What if UNC doesn't use their friday starters against the 4 seed?

Then could our 3s beat their 3s?

They are a better offense than us, with similar pitching. I personally don't think we have a chance to win game 2 vs UNC assuming we win game 1 vs them. Their bats will slaughter our day 3 guys.

Here's how my brain sees it.

Our day 3 staff has a 50% chance to beat Wofford, our day 1 staff has a 75% chance to beat UNC game 1, our day 2 has a 75% chance to beat UNC game 2, and our day 4 staff has a 10% chance to beat UNC game 3.

Whereas

Our day 1 staff has a 90% chance to beat Wofford, our day 2 staff has a 75% chance to beat UNC game 1, our day 3 has a 25% chance to beat UNC game 2, and our day 4 staff has a 10% chance to beat UNC game 3.

I just feel more confident rolling the dice against wofford vs rolling it vs UNC.
Posted by poncho villa
DALLAS
Member since Jul 2010
18278 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:21 pm to
I think the only scenario I would see JJ not starting gage or luke would be seeing LSU get out to massive lead super early (like 10 runs in the first two innings).

If I was Jay I would gamble and then sit Jump or Luke for a potential comeback on Monday and use johnny wholestaff to get you through the game.
Posted by Hurricane2020
Member since Apr 2020
2998 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:30 pm to
I'm not acting like they aren't going to get hits against average pitching. Statistically they are one of the best offenses in the country, albeit against poor competition. UNC on the otherhand is statistically just as good, against MUCH better competition.

It doesn't matter if you win games 1 and 2 if you know you will get blown out games 3 and 4. Not much of a consolation prize. We don't have the arguably best offense in the country like we did in 2023 to win games 13-12.
Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
32054 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:37 pm to
quote:

What is the ERA on Sunday in the SEC? UNC is going to be much better than the average SEC team.

Is that a winning strategy?


UNC doesn't exactly have a great 3rd starter either.

If LSU goes 2-0 the next time they would face UNC would be in UNC's 4th game of the regional and (likely) UNC's second game of the DAY since the winner of the first game on Sunday would turn around and play the team that went 2-0 on Friday/Saturday.

UNC has two guys who started all 10 weekends of ACC play. After that, they have two guys who started 5 games each in conference play. One has an ERA of 5.18 in those games. The other has an ERA of 9.00. And considering LSU would be seeing UNC's 4th starter in a scenario where UNC would have to beat LSU twice, I'd say even LSU's inconsistent bullpen would have the advantage in that situation.

In your scenario of making Friday a "bullpen" game you have made that game basically a must win. A "must win" with an inconsistent bullpen. Because if you don't LSU would then face a scenario where they have to win 4 games in 3 days. And they would have to do it with a bullpen that was likely taxed in Game 1 and maybe game 2. Which means that even if you were somehow able to save Jump and Holman for games 3 and 4 , you STILL have to win another game without those two plus a depleted bullpen against a much fresher UNC staff.
Posted by TigerCub
Team Boxtard
Member since May 2006
21450 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:52 pm to
quote:

They are a better offense than us, with similar pitching. I personally don't think we have a chance to win game 2 vs UNC assuming we win game 1 vs them. Their bats will slaughter our day 3 guys.


Our pitching held a better Tennessee offense to 4 runs the other day. I think they could hold their own against UNC.
Posted by AlwysATgr
Member since Apr 2008
19015 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:55 pm to
Not dismissing the OP's question out of hand. Nor do I know what kind of team Wofford is. Maybe we could handle them sans Jump/Holman.

But, if you lose game 1, you have to play 5 games to win the regional. That's to be avoided.

Our 'G3' pitching has looked much better recently. I like our chances.



Posted by geauxpurple
New Orleans
Member since Jul 2014
14760 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 1:57 pm to
I suggested this several times this week and got overwhelmingly downvoted just like you are getting. There was a post today saying that Skip Bertman was on the radio agreeing with us.
Posted by tigerbait3488
River Ridge
Member since Dec 2007
11028 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 2:10 pm to
OP didnt learn shite from last season. Ignorance at its finest.
Posted by DRock88
Member since Aug 2015
10009 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 2:15 pm to
All of these people wanted to fire Jay for starting Skenes against Tulane last year. The argument is that Wofford is a way better team than Tulane. I just don't know that I even agree with that, stats aside. Personally, I felt like Skenes neded to go against Tulane last year. Put the hot, in-state team to rest. Oregon St was not a dangerous 2, despite our pitching questions after Skenes. They had major pitching issues. We could just out hit Oregon St anyway. UNC is not as flawed. They're a 1 seed.

I'll go back to what I said last year: No decision is wrong if it works. We started Skenes in game 1 and it worked so it was the right decision. Whoever starts game 1 against Wofford will be the right decision if we advance to supers.
Posted by TigerMonkey7
Member since Jul 2021
3135 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 2:17 pm to
Jump x Guidry vs Wofford

Holman x Herring vs UNC game 1

Ideally go 2-0 in that stretch

Ack, Hurd, and whoever else (maybe Hellmers looked really good) game 2 vs UNC to win regional

Posted by Tigerik
Franklin, TN
Member since Mar 2007
1714 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 2:28 pm to
Simple answer is "Failure" is not an option for game 1. Therefore you start the guy who gives you your best chance to win, and potentially saves the entire rest of the staff by going longer into the game.
Everyone knows in this Regional format, you MUST win game 1 period!
Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
32054 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 3:09 pm to
quote:

The argument is that Wofford is a way better team than Tulane. I just don't know that I even agree with that, stats aside.


Tulane was 19-40 entering the regional. Not only did the have the worst record of all the teams in the tournament field. they had one of the worst winning percentages of any team to make the tournament in tournament history. Their futility was even worse when you consider they won 4 games in the AAC tournament. Which means their regular season record was 15-38!

Wofford is 41-18. No, they didn't play in a great conference against great competition. But they still won' 2/3rds of their games and they are 3rd in the nation in batting average.

Tulane was historically bad for a NCAA Tournament by every objective measurement. On the flip side, the 2023 LSU team was SIGNIFICANTLY better than this current team. Meaning the margin between 2023 LSU and 2023 Tulane was much greater than the margin between 2024 LSU and 2024 Wofford.

Last year the conversation to hold Skenes was reasonable given the variables in play. The conversation to do the same thing this year is ridiculous. And I bet the first person to agree with that statement would be Jay Johnson
This post was edited on 5/29/24 at 3:10 pm
Posted by MikeTheTiger71
Member since Dec 2021
3669 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 3:38 pm to
quote:

Our pitching held a better Tennessee offense to 4 runs the other day. I think they could hold their own against UNC.


But is Tennessee a better offense? UNC went 9-1 in Game 3s in conference averaging 11.2 R/G. Tennessee went 8-2 and averaged 9.1 R/G. Underneath the averages, Tennessee had Sunday games scoring 0, 3, 4 and 6. UNC had games of 3 and 6, but the other 8 were 9+.
Posted by tigerfoot
Alexandria
Member since Sep 2006
58947 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 3:44 pm to
quote:

This is more along the lines of, "Unless UNC seriously shits the bed in game 1 and game 2, we are going to have to beat them AT LEAST once but likely twice to make the CWS." kind of question.
we will beat them one of their first two. Then it’s time for Ack, Hering, Littke,Guidry to earn that money
Posted by MikeTheTiger71
Member since Dec 2021
3669 posts
Posted on 5/29/24 at 3:56 pm to
quote:

Last year the conversation to hold Skenes was reasonable given the variables in play. The conversation to do the same thing this year is ridiculous.


There are variables in play other than the strength of the Game 1 opponent. There’s no question that pitching off against Wofford is more of a risk than pitching off against Tulane last year. That’s only one part of the equation. The other part is the potential Game 3 matchup. Last year, LSU was at home playing against a 2-seed whose pitching staff was decimated by injuries and was piecing things together. UNC has lost starters as well, but they have the guys they have started all conference season and their key relievers. LSU also had one of the top offenses in the country facing a good, but not great Oregon St offense. This year UNC is the home team with one of the top offenses on the country facing a good, but not great LSU offense. The only advantage LSU has are their top 2 starters. It’s not ridiculous to consider gambling against Wofford to keep that advantage in place vs UNC. Of course it’s a giant risk, but the circumstances may require it.
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