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re: McMahon may prove to be a solid hire.

Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:14 pm to
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
59912 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:14 pm to
Yea that didn’t happen.
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:22 pm to
quote:

He did run a pretty simple offense. For me it just seemed like the team wasn't drilled enough on certain aspects.
Yeah, it was too simple and not prepared enough. We had to settle for top 25 Kenpom offensive efficiency. If only he knew an X or maybe even an O. Damn shame.

At least we got all the Xs and Os now to finish 99th in efficiency.
Posted by Primeminister337
Member since Apr 2016
530 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:24 pm to
Someone asked what they don’t like about Coach Mac’s offense. These are my reasons.

1. Takes a lot of time from the shot clock for it to start
2. High pick and roll/pop isn’t terrible, but your ph has to really really be able to fill it up off that screen. Also I don’t like how it’s a chip screen instead of a solid one, but I Donna if that’s the player or the way it’s intended to be

3. When the pick and roll/pop is not open we kick it to the wing, but usually it’s so late in the clock we are forced to put up a guarded shot.
4. We limit ouraelf for offensive rebounds when we pick and pop with the center, I get that we want the option to give him a few looks, but if that’s the case we need to recruit a legit stretch

Lastly, and this is just opinion and preference, with all the guard we have been recruiting, of run a fast break peddle to the metal offense, ya got the bodies for it, use a lot of traps, half court and full court press to create yourself extra possessions, especially if your defense is already shakey. Just find an identity to what ya do, right now we are in no mans land. I really hope coach Mac figures it out this year, I love March too much to not have a player in it
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
59912 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:25 pm to
Speaking of posters who claim we’re getting great recruits in the offseason then saying we have no talent during the season he’s #1 on that list.
Posted by mmcgrath
Indianapolis
Member since Feb 2010
36654 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:27 pm to
quote:

Yeah, it was too simple and not prepared enough.
I said "pretty simple", not "too simple". Simple isn't always a bad thing, especially in basketball. And especially when you had some talented scorers.
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:29 pm to
quote:

Speaking of posters who claim we’re getting great recruits in the offseason then saying we have no talent during the season he’s #1 on that list.
Yeah, I know who he is.

Posted by Alt26
Member since Mar 2010
32265 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:35 pm to
quote:

High pick and roll/pop isn’t terrible,


It will be interesting to see what he does this year because for the first time at LSU he doesn't have a "stretch 5" or a least one who seems comfortable and reliable from 3. KJ was just as comfortable, maybe more, in shooting 3's as he was playing inside. Baker had decent back to the basket moves, but he was terribly slow in executing them, and didn't have enough strength/athleticism to win inside battles with other big men. He was also happier to step out and shoot threes.

LSU doesn't seem to have that guy on this roster. Jalen Reed can make a three. But he's averaged about 1 per game and he hasn't been terribly consistent. Same for Fountain. Collins doesn't seem like a pick and pop guy either.

Does McMahon try to force Reed into that role, hoping in year 3 he has developed a consistent shot? Or, does he accept he may not have that type of player on this roster and choose to go with a different approach?
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:35 pm to
quote:

4. We limit ouraelf for offensive rebounds when we pick and pop with the center, I get that we want the option to give him a few looks, but if that’s the case we need to recruit a legit stretch
We talking Will Baker here? If so, he had a better chance to hold on to a rebound the further away he was from the basket.
Posted by mmcgrath
Indianapolis
Member since Feb 2010
36654 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:38 pm to
quote:

Someone asked what they don’t like about Coach Mac’s offense. These are my reasons.

1. Takes a lot of time from the shot clock for it to start
2. High pick and roll/pop isn’t terrible, but your ph has to really really be able to fill it up off that screen. Also I don’t like how it’s a chip screen instead of a solid one, but I Donna if that’s the player or the way it’s intended to be

3. When the pick and roll/pop is not open we kick it to the wing, but usually it’s so late in the clock we are forced to put up a guarded shot.
4. We limit ouraelf for offensive rebounds when we pick and pop with the center, I get that we want the option to give him a few looks, but if that’s the case we need to recruit a legit stretch
Valid takes.
quote:

Lastly, and this is just opinion and preference, with all the guard we have been recruiting, of run a fast break peddle to the metal offense, ya got the bodies for it, use a lot of traps, half court and full court press to create yourself extra possessions, especially if your defense is already shakey. Just find an identity to what ya do, right now we are in no mans land. I really hope coach Mac figures it out this year, I love March too much to not have a player in it
I don't think we have had the strong point guard play to do that for a full season. In year 0 Hill had a bad year and we didn't have anyone who could push the ball. Last year Cook was here on a limited basis and Mike Williams was still fairly new to the position. Trae came on late and we ran some more.

This year Sears looks like he is ready to start, Williams is more seasoned, and CG3 is a natural point who looks like he can push the pace. We just need Reed and Chest (and the guards) to finish off defensive possessions to start the break.
Posted by Primeminister337
Member since Apr 2016
530 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:38 pm to
Just to clarify, when I talk about identity, this is an example of what I mean

Tennesse- slow paced, elite defense

Auburn- pressure and let it fly from 3


Bama- track meet, everyone has the green light

Texas AM- kill ya on the boards, run at some opportunities

South Carolina- slow paced, grind it out on defense
Posted by redfishfan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2015
4980 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:41 pm to
quote:

Yeah, it was too simple and not prepared enough. We had to settle for top 25 Kenpom offensive efficiency. If only he knew an X or maybe even an O. Damn shame.


Wade was very clever on how he coached his offense. Free flowing hard to scout type of offense with set plays he ran when he needed a bucket. I have some issues with Wade on his defensive X and Os but offensively he was borderline elite.
Posted by JWill409
Beaumont, TX
Member since Sep 2010
1362 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:43 pm to
quote:

Sometimes with all the dummy actions going on the main action can take a while to execute so if the defense covers it up then we end up in a late clock high ball screen and don't get the best looks. That type of offense is sometimes easier to scout as well.

My preference is an offense that relies less on set actions and more on actions that are trigger and read based. This is much harder to do and takes more time to implement but is more effective if you can do it. In today's modern basketball, teams are going away from that because they have so much turnover year after year which makes these offenses hard to be good at. It's why you see these mid majors in the tourney have success with 4 year guys. They are running much more complex offenses compared to what Coach Cal could run at Kentucky.



Yeah, that's way too much thinking involved.

Most offenses now days are the "free flowing" offenses you speak of. It's all read and react, which is not the most successful style of basketball in my opinion. Sets are never "set in stone". Coaches today are essentially trying to dumb down the game, because as you say, the transfer portal is alive and well, and players come and go. They don't have time to learn a system. It also is why a lot of your big time programs struggle. Simplicity and execution is the key. You can ask any NBA player, they know exactly what the other team will run. The key is stopping it.

So I actually think the reason the mid major programs are having success is because they don't "read and react", they are in a system that executes better than others.
Posted by Primeminister337
Member since Apr 2016
530 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:43 pm to
quote:

quote: High pick and roll/pop isn’t terrible, It will be interesting to see what he does this year because for the first time at LSU he doesn't have a "stretch 5" or a least one who seems comfortable and reliable from 3. KJ was just as comfortable, maybe more, in shooting 3's as he was playing inside. Baker had decent back to the basket moves, but he was terribly slow in executing them, and didn't have enough strength/athleticism to win inside battles with other big men. He was also happier to step out and shoot threes.


I was thinking the same thing, without a big who can shoot, I wonder how he’s gonna tweak it, of course I’m just assuming none of them can shoot? Can they?
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

I have some issues with Wade on his defensive X and Os but offensively he was borderline elite.
Nah, it was all streetball. I kid.

Wade himself would tell you about the defensive shortcomings and his attempts to improve. His last season we were seemingly coming around, I think we were top 40-ish? in defensive efficiency (I don’t have the stats in front of me). But we took a step back offensively, although I think that was really due to injuries.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
59912 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:53 pm to
It was worse than street ball, if Wade caught someone with a white board he’d break it in half and if you even said the letters X or O he’d make you do laps around the lake.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
59912 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 4:56 pm to
We were 4th nationally in defensive efficiency Wade’s last year.
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 5:00 pm to
quote:

We were 4th nationally in defensive efficiency Wade’s last year.
Oh shite, yeah, it’s starting to come back to me.
Posted by Primeminister337
Member since Apr 2016
530 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 5:04 pm to
Off the subject, but one of my favorite offenses was Jay Wrights at Nova. I wanted to learn it and downloaded the E book. I love the spacing on it. As I read more about it, I can see why Nova had to recruit only system guys who would be around 3-4 years. Kinda complex and hard to teach cause after every pass, certain positions had “options” and you had to really be in tune with each other. That being said, recruiting rankings don’t mean dick if you are not getting players who A. Fit your system, and B a few who are gonna stick around. I love the way Jay Wright ran his system
Posted by redfishfan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2015
4980 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 5:12 pm to
quote:

Off the subject, but one of my favorite offenses was Jay Wrights at Nova. I wanted to learn it and downloaded the E book. I love the spacing on it. As I read more about it, I can see why Nova had to recruit only system guys who would be around 3-4 years. Kinda complex and hard to teach cause after every pass, certain positions had “options” and you had to really be in tune with each other. That being said, recruiting rankings don’t mean dick if you are not getting players who A. Fit your system, and B a few who are gonna stick around. I love the way Jay Wright ran his system


Always put a major emphasis on playing on 2 feet as well. That were masters of it.
Posted by drizztiger
Deal With it!
Member since Mar 2007
42963 posts
Posted on 10/3/24 at 5:14 pm to
quote:

I love the way Jay Wright ran his system
Can we get him out of retirement?
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