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Started By
Message
re: LSU is not a rebuild. LSU hired O to avoid a rebuild.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:13 pm to moneyg
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:13 pm to moneyg
quote:
While a fair argument, you can admit that this has nothing to do with what happened on Saturday, or in relation to the OP, right?
uh, keeping Aranda has everything to do with "rebuild v. continuity"
making retaining Aranda a top priority is a sign of continuity, not rebuild
1
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:13 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
OP was one of the main ones dismissing my point
wait, what?
Yep
I would say this team is going 8-4/7-5 because of the roster and you said that was unacceptable because O was hired for continuity.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:14 pm to Deactived
the bad part is how badly Alleva has penny pinched to squeeze every little penny from the diehard/posis
shite like paying for parking and ruining the tailgating experience is going to have major rammifications if we don't put out an elite product
basically Alleva has done everything to ostracize the die hards and he's going to need them if O isn't really good
shite like paying for parking and ruining the tailgating experience is going to have major rammifications if we don't put out an elite product
basically Alleva has done everything to ostracize the die hards and he's going to need them if O isn't really good
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:15 pm to skullhawk
quote:
I would say this team is going 8-4/7-5 because of the roster and you said that was unacceptable because O was hired for continuity.
it is unacceptable because he was hired for continuity
that statement is not dismissing your point. it's making a separate point about the hire itself
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:17 pm to tigerfoot
quote:
It was November and we were a top 6 rated team. We will be out of the top 25 soon in September. People say we have been having the same problems for 5-6 years. Crazy the possible differences in productivity.
I understand that but the fan base was melting in 2015 as well. It was not rosy around here. 7-0 meant nothing.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
So Slow, I'm living in Lake Charles for the next few years, what are McNeese games like? Worth going to? 
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
that statement is not dismissing your point. it's making a separate point about the hire itself
That's fair.
My point is, no matter who got the job, a major roster overhaul needed to occur and a shift in recruiting philosophy had to happen.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:18 pm to The Godfather
lol i'm the wrong person to ask that question to
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:18 pm to skullhawk
quote:
My point is, no matter who got the job, a major roster overhaul needed to occur and a shift in recruiting philosophy had to happen.
and like i said earlier
hiring O for continuity is bad
hiring O for a rebuild is incomprehensible
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:21 pm to TigerFan4040
quote:
Promote a new guy to HC and OC in ANY program and there will be "rebuilding"
Bobby Bowden 7-6 2009
Jimbo Fisher 10-4 2010 (won division)
Gene Chizik 3-9 2012
Gus Malzahn 12-2 2013 (won SEC, played for national championship)
Steve Sarkisian (3-2 fired)/Clay Helton (5-4 interim) 2015
Clay Helton 10-3 2016 (won the Rose Bowl)
Mark Heflich 4-8 2016
Willie Taggart 3-0 so far beating Nebraska (bad, but better than BYU) and a group of 5 favorite Wyoming in 2017. Averaging over 600 yards of offense and 56 points per game. In all his games he has been up by at least 3 TDs at half time and scoring 42 points before halftime in each game.
Oklahoma lost Stoops right before the season started. Oklahoma is 3-0 including a beatdown of Urban Meyer.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:22 pm to skullhawk
quote:
My point is, no matter who got the job, a major roster overhaul needed to occur and a shift in recruiting philosophy had to happen.
Can you provide examples of the needed overhaul and philosophy?
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:22 pm to MOT
quote:
Can you provide examples of the needed overhaul and philosophy?
are you going to send this info to O?
do you need me to translated it into "binder" for you to help?
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:23 pm to Datbayoubengal
quote:
Willie Taggart
I've wanted him as an LSU coach since we played WKU in 2011. Least intimidated team to come into Tiger Stadium that year.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:23 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
it's not a straw man
Of course it is.
quote:
we were told he was hired for continuity and a rebuild was not necessary
by whom. And, even if that came from Alleva himself, so what? It doesn't change reality. Are you saying that we actually aren't undertalented/thin up front on both offense and defense? Are you saying it's just an excuse?
quote:
there are probably 40 head coaches who are better than O and maybe another 60+ coordinators who would be better HCs than O. he wasn't hired b/c he was the best coach that LSU could have hired.
And there is your strawman. He was hired because Alleva couldn't successfully perform a coaching search and Orgeron was the easy selection. That argument was understood from anyone paying attention in November last year. The "continuity" straw man you are building isn't necessary to suggest that, on paper, Orgeron wasn't a good hire.
But, now he's here. I don't have to pretend that he isn't facing the rebuilding of the OL and DL in order to justify my opinion on the hire. You seem to have to do that for some reason.
quote:
is anyone happy that Ed Orgeron is the guiding hand of this team rebuild?
I don't think that's the real important question...at all. The question is, are we going to be able to consistently get elite talent on campus moving forward? If we do, Orgeron is probably going to be pretty successful.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:24 pm to skullhawk
quote:
My point is, no matter who got the job, a major roster overhaul needed to occur and a shift in recruiting philosophy had to happen.
So again, where is the upside in hiring someone for an overhaul that has not proven he can overhaul a team?
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:26 pm to SlowFlowPro
They're pricing the average fan out regardless of how good the team is.
With the way this team is looking, they are in an uphill battle.
Dropping a few grand every year spending an entire Saturday parking, walking, tailgating, paying absurd prices for concessions, watching terrible ooc and sec teams, and the traffic debacle getting home
Vs
Having friends over at my house, grilling way better food, drinking good liquor and beer, cigars, no bathroom line, and watching on a big screen HD tv. All for what, 1/5th the cost or less
With the way this team is looking, they are in an uphill battle.
Dropping a few grand every year spending an entire Saturday parking, walking, tailgating, paying absurd prices for concessions, watching terrible ooc and sec teams, and the traffic debacle getting home
Vs
Having friends over at my house, grilling way better food, drinking good liquor and beer, cigars, no bathroom line, and watching on a big screen HD tv. All for what, 1/5th the cost or less
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:26 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
are you going to send this info to O?
do you need me to translated it into "binder" for you to help?
I'm awaiting his response but I suspect he is another who doesn't realize Orgeron did nothing but add to, while not doing anything to address, the problems he's going to mention for this year's team.
And yes, I thought I would do Derek a solid so he doesn't have so many posts to sift through while he is taking notes.
This post was edited on 9/19/17 at 12:28 pm
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:27 pm to moneyg
quote:
by whom.
Alleva and the media puppets who were reporting the talking points from Fat Goebels
quote:
And, even if that came from Alleva himself, so what? It doesn't change reality.
it means he's either a liar or an unequivocal idiot
reality isn't changed, but the words describing our AD clearly do
quote:
Are you saying that we actually aren't undertalented/thin up front on both offense and defense?
no
not at all
quote:
And there is your strawman. He was hired because Alleva couldn't successfully perform a coaching search and Orgeron was the easy selection.
that means my comment is the truth and not a straw man
quote:
That argument was understood from anyone paying attention in November last year. The "continuity" straw man you are building isn't necessary to suggest that, on paper, Orgeron wasn't a good hire.
the continuity argument is the only argument that makes the O decision somewhat logical
if that was a lie or O/Alleva are truly that stupid, then we are completely derailed as a major CFB program
quote:
I don't think that's the real important question...at all. The question is, are we going to be able to consistently get elite talent on campus moving forward? If we do, Orgeron is probably going to be pretty successful.
he got elite talent for Ole Miss and guided them to the worst period of their program's history
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:27 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
this plan only makes sense if we believe Aranda is going to be here for 3-4 more years. does ANYONE believe that?
Whoa. You are changing the argument. This is an argument that could easily be had without pretending that we don't have significant talent and depth issues right now. To that point, you do reailze Aranda was the coach whose defense was run over on Saturday, right?
Like I said in my original post that you disagreed with, there are many easy arguments against Orgeron on paper. The elite coordinator argument is certainly one of them.
Posted on 9/19/17 at 12:28 pm to Deactived
quote:
Dropping a few grand every year spending an entire Saturday parking, walking, tailgating, paying absurd prices for concessions, watching terrible ooc and sec teams, and the traffic debacle getting home
Vs
Having friends over at my house, grilling way better food, drinking good liquor and beer, cigars, no bathroom line, and watching on a big screen HD tv. All for what, 1/5th the cost or less
look i've been making the "home watch parties > game days at LSU" argument since before Miles was hired as LSU coach
you don't have to sell me on that
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