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Started By
Message
new flowerbed construction
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:33 pm
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:33 pm
I'm about to put two new flowerbeds in my back yard. I paid a guy to put one in my front yard and he didn't really do a good job, and I felt like I overpaid for what I got. Based on what I've read, I could probably save half the cost otherwise in doing it myself.
I have several questions for anybody that's done this themselves before, and this seems to be the place to ask. My reading (mostly here) says that I should do the following:
(1) spray paint a layout of the bed,
(2) cut the sod up from inside the bed (will probably rent a sod cutter for this),
(3) lay down landscape fabric and leave an edge around the bed to keep the grass from growing into the bed,
(4) buy bulk soil to build up the bed,
(5) plant, and then
(6) mulch with pine straw.
Most of that is pretty self-explanatory, but I'd like to set this up the right way and make it as low-maintenance as possible. I'd also like to get it done in the next couple weeks so hopefully I can get some blooms out of whatever I plant this year.
So, questions:
1. I'm in Madisonville. Does anybody recommend any place on the northshore where I can buy bulk garden soil?
2. This is obviously a loaded question depending on composition of the soil I get, but should garden soil be all that I need? In other words, would y'all recommend amending with compost/fertilizer? If so, which kind?
3. How high should I build my bed up? I've read everywhere from 6" to 16'. FWIW, these beds will be going up against a square patio slab that's about 8" high.
4. Plant recommendations. The beds will be in full sun. I definitely want to put two dwarf citrus trees in each bed. Will this be okay to plant them so close to the slab? My front bed has boxwoods, agapanthus, holly, hydrangea, and azaleas in it. These are great, but my wife wants something that has more fragrant flowers, and I'd like to plant something to attract bees for my vegetable garden.
After some reading, it seems that Frostproof Gardenias, Agapanthus, and Lantanas may be a good candidate. I'd like to stay away from taller trees like a crepe myrtle, because I don't want to shade out my vegetable garden in the winter, which is north of these beds. What do y'all think?
5. Where should I go to get the best prices on plants like this? There are some stores in Mandeville and Covington, but they seem pretty expensive. Anybody have any recommendations for nurseries (in Folsom or Lacombe) maybe that will sell to the public?
Thanks for any and all help.
I have several questions for anybody that's done this themselves before, and this seems to be the place to ask. My reading (mostly here) says that I should do the following:
(1) spray paint a layout of the bed,
(2) cut the sod up from inside the bed (will probably rent a sod cutter for this),
(3) lay down landscape fabric and leave an edge around the bed to keep the grass from growing into the bed,
(4) buy bulk soil to build up the bed,
(5) plant, and then
(6) mulch with pine straw.
Most of that is pretty self-explanatory, but I'd like to set this up the right way and make it as low-maintenance as possible. I'd also like to get it done in the next couple weeks so hopefully I can get some blooms out of whatever I plant this year.
So, questions:
1. I'm in Madisonville. Does anybody recommend any place on the northshore where I can buy bulk garden soil?
2. This is obviously a loaded question depending on composition of the soil I get, but should garden soil be all that I need? In other words, would y'all recommend amending with compost/fertilizer? If so, which kind?
3. How high should I build my bed up? I've read everywhere from 6" to 16'. FWIW, these beds will be going up against a square patio slab that's about 8" high.
4. Plant recommendations. The beds will be in full sun. I definitely want to put two dwarf citrus trees in each bed. Will this be okay to plant them so close to the slab? My front bed has boxwoods, agapanthus, holly, hydrangea, and azaleas in it. These are great, but my wife wants something that has more fragrant flowers, and I'd like to plant something to attract bees for my vegetable garden.
After some reading, it seems that Frostproof Gardenias, Agapanthus, and Lantanas may be a good candidate. I'd like to stay away from taller trees like a crepe myrtle, because I don't want to shade out my vegetable garden in the winter, which is north of these beds. What do y'all think?
5. Where should I go to get the best prices on plants like this? There are some stores in Mandeville and Covington, but they seem pretty expensive. Anybody have any recommendations for nurseries (in Folsom or Lacombe) maybe that will sell to the public?
Thanks for any and all help.
This post was edited on 4/4/19 at 1:33 pm
4
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:43 pm to atom1505
I'm not a fan of "dirt mound on landscape fabric" beds. Yes, I know this is how landscapers quickly install bulk plantings atop terrible, compacted, builder grade clay. But I'd rather dig up the sod, till a bit, and amend the soil: depending on what's there, you might need sand, peat moss, garden soil, compost, etc. Rather than simply pile soil on top, you are working with what's already there.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:48 pm to hungryone
quote:
But I'd rather dig up the sod, till a bit, and amend the soil:
This is what I did, the only downside to that is im now 7 years later and my beds are just getting to a height that is appropriate. There is a lot of settling that happens when you do them this way.
This post was edited on 4/4/19 at 2:05 pm
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:50 pm to hungryone
hungryone is right.
If you want a healthy growth year after year, do not use landscape fabric under flower bed. The landscape fabric will limit mature root growth. Simply remove the soil and fill with a combination of top soil and various soil conditioners as you have stated in the OP.
If you want a healthy growth year after year, do not use landscape fabric under flower bed. The landscape fabric will limit mature root growth. Simply remove the soil and fill with a combination of top soil and various soil conditioners as you have stated in the OP.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 1:50 pm to hungryone
I definitely see your point there, but my soil is awful. It's exactly as you said - crap compacted builder-grade clay. It's difficult for the damn grass to grow. It seems like a much cheaper and less labor intensive option to just add bulk soil on top after cutting the sod.
I can definitely do without the fabric though, and just add the bulk soil on top of the tilled area where the bed will go. One less step for me.
I can definitely do without the fabric though, and just add the bulk soil on top of the tilled area where the bed will go. One less step for me.
This post was edited on 4/4/19 at 1:53 pm
Posted on 4/4/19 at 2:04 pm to atom1505
quote:
just add the bulk soil on top of the tilled area where the bed will go. One less step for me.
Re-read what I said. Don't just add bulk soil. If it's compacted clay, add a 3" layer of sand, till it in. Then add a bunch of compost (NO Compost Network will sell it by the cubic yard, if you've got a truck), and then add garden soil on top. You've got to do a bit more than simply plopping down mixed garden soil. But if you want healthy, drought resistant landscaping that needs significantly less watering, do it this way.
Plenty of those "insta-beds" require year round watering because of the "anthill" bed construction. The plants, esp larger shrubs, don't have deep root systems. Frequent watering encourages shallow roots as well.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 2:18 pm to atom1505
Ditch the fabric. It’s not going to stop weeds or grass.
Buy organic soil. There’s soil and garden depot in mandeville that will likely deliver. I’d excavate a few inches of soil below grade if your soil is shite. Rent a tiller and mix in the new organic soil with the existing.
Beds should be crowned about 6” total. More than that looks absurd next to a slab of a patio
Citrus trees need some space. Would t use these as an accent plant. Put them out in the yard in full sun.
Lantana is going to take over wherever you plant it. I would avoid using this unless you want a mass planting of it to take up some space. The other items are fine for the most part. Hydrangeas can’t take too much sun and heat unless they are limelight hydrangeas.
Bantings on the north shore is your best bet. Not sure many wholesalers around there sell to the public. Windmill and bracy’s definitely don’t
Buy organic soil. There’s soil and garden depot in mandeville that will likely deliver. I’d excavate a few inches of soil below grade if your soil is shite. Rent a tiller and mix in the new organic soil with the existing.
Beds should be crowned about 6” total. More than that looks absurd next to a slab of a patio
Citrus trees need some space. Would t use these as an accent plant. Put them out in the yard in full sun.
Lantana is going to take over wherever you plant it. I would avoid using this unless you want a mass planting of it to take up some space. The other items are fine for the most part. Hydrangeas can’t take too much sun and heat unless they are limelight hydrangeas.
Bantings on the north shore is your best bet. Not sure many wholesalers around there sell to the public. Windmill and bracy’s definitely don’t
Posted on 4/4/19 at 2:25 pm to atom1505
No to the fabric. If your existing soil is bad, add 4" of good plant bed soil and til it into the existing soil to a depth of 6". Then add 4" of bed soil and plant in that. The bad soil will want to migrate up so add a couple inches of compost on top of beds every year to mitigate this and improve your overall soil.
This post was edited on 4/4/19 at 2:26 pm
Posted on 4/4/19 at 4:48 pm to Zappas Stache
Thanks for all the replies. I'll ditch the fabric.
You guys think that even putting dwarf citrus trees next to the slab would cause a problem? If that's the case, I may just work it out to put them in the bed in some type of decent looking container.
What about the gardenias?
You guys think that even putting dwarf citrus trees next to the slab would cause a problem? If that's the case, I may just work it out to put them in the bed in some type of decent looking container.
What about the gardenias?
Posted on 4/4/19 at 4:58 pm to atom1505
If you have clay, the best thing to add is peat moss and sand.
Till that in really good then add some compose and top soil.
Till that in really good then add some compose and top soil.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 5:58 pm to atom1505
I know nothing about this topic but it seems to me if you put soil on top of the weed barrier, then weeds will just grow in the soil on top the barrier defeating the purpose of the barrier.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 6:41 pm to atom1505
Send your number to my email and I can call you and walk you through it if ya want.
This post was edited on 4/4/19 at 9:35 pm
Posted on 4/4/19 at 6:46 pm to bbvdd
quote:
If you have clay, the best thing to add is peat moss and sand.
sand will eventually bind with the clay making a concrete like soil. Peat Moss, while cheap, has a lot of negatives such has enhancing pathogen formation. Better to use compost, a good bedding soil mix (that contains compost) or other organic material such as pine bark.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 8:15 pm to Daponch
Thanks dude. Got it if you want to take your email off
Posted on 4/4/19 at 8:20 pm to Zappas Stache
quote:
sand will eventually bind with the clay making a concrete like soil. Peat Moss, while cheap, has a lot of negatives such has enhancing pathogen formation. Better to use compost, a good bedding soil mix (that contains compost) or other organic material such as pine bark.
I talked to a garden store here today and they recommended Accardo's materials in Mandeville. The guy told me they sell a garden/bedding soil that's amended with some compost, it's sold by the yard, and they deliver. I'll let you guys know what comes of it when I talk to them for future reference.
Posted on 4/4/19 at 8:55 pm to atom1505
Do a 1 call before you dig as well
Posted on 4/5/19 at 4:39 am to atom1505
I’m not familiar with any type of dwarf citrus trees, but I would hesitate to plant any type of tree near the slab. Roots have to go somewhere and it seems like your house would limit the amount of direct sunlight for the tree.
My house used to have gardenias as foundation plants. I pulled them up a few weeks ago due to them being too close to my foundation/crawl, but their root systems were surprisingly compact
TL;DR I’d go with gardenias over citrus trees as a foundation plant
My house used to have gardenias as foundation plants. I pulled them up a few weeks ago due to them being too close to my foundation/crawl, but their root systems were surprisingly compact
TL;DR I’d go with gardenias over citrus trees as a foundation plant
Posted on 4/5/19 at 2:17 pm to atom1505
quote:
I have several questions for anybody that's done this themselves before, and this seems to be the place to ask. My reading (mostly here) says that I should do the following:
(1) spray paint a layout of the bed,
(2) cut the sod up from inside the bed (will probably rent a sod cutter for this),
(3) lay down landscape fabric and leave an edge around the bed to keep the grass from growing into the bed, (4) buy bulk soil to build up the bed,
(5) plant, and then
(6) mulch with pine straw.
As many have said,
Till in the new soil with the existing soil.
THEN, instead of landscape cloth, use old newspapers. The newspapers will retain moisture, block weeds from germinating.
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