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Message
LIV officially removes request for OWGR points
Posted on 3/5/24 at 7:08 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 7:08 am
Greg Norman says in a letter obtained by Bob Harig of SI:
“a resolution which protects the accuracy, credibility and integrity of the OWGR rankings no longer exists. “We have made significant efforts to fight for you and ensure your accomplishments are recognized within the existing ranking system. Unfortunately, OWGR has shown little willingness to productively work with us.”
I mean, players have a right to be pissed at LIV and Norman here
“a resolution which protects the accuracy, credibility and integrity of the OWGR rankings no longer exists. “We have made significant efforts to fight for you and ensure your accomplishments are recognized within the existing ranking system. Unfortunately, OWGR has shown little willingness to productively work with us.”
I mean, players have a right to be pissed at LIV and Norman here
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 7:19 am
6
Posted on 3/5/24 at 7:18 am to TDTOM
When Norman told the players at signing they were getting points, I wonder if it was put in any of the “contracts”?
Posted on 3/5/24 at 7:40 am to lsupride87
For guys like Nieman and such that were already established there is paths
What does Surratt do? It going to be hard to get into the majors just with Asian tour events. Will the money be enough to maybe not play majors the next 5 years while his buddy Dunlap still makes a ton of money too and plays majors?
What does Surratt do? It going to be hard to get into the majors just with Asian tour events. Will the money be enough to maybe not play majors the next 5 years while his buddy Dunlap still makes a ton of money too and plays majors?
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 7:42 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 8:16 am to lsupride87
The OWGR is a dying system. They have Niemann ranked #76 which is an absolute joke. DJ is 226, Bryson is 182… They have lost their credibility
Either the majors & Olympics will change their qualifications/exemptions or it will all be fixed when the PGA/PIF deal happens. Not that LIV will start getting OWGR pts then, but the players will play PGA events again.
You really don’t think the PGA/PIF deal happens & things don’t get sorted out by then?
Either the majors & Olympics will change their qualifications/exemptions or it will all be fixed when the PGA/PIF deal happens. Not that LIV will start getting OWGR pts then, but the players will play PGA events again.
quote:
to maybe not play majors the next 5 years
You really don’t think the PGA/PIF deal happens & things don’t get sorted out by then?
Posted on 3/5/24 at 8:20 am to JimTiger72
quote:no, they haven’t. They rank players that play pro golf on qualifying open tours. LIV just isn’t that, and it’s fine. Enjoy it if you chose to. But it shouldn’t get ranking points as it is
The OWGR is a dying system. They have Niemann ranked #76 which is an absolute joke. DJ is 226, Bryson is 182… They have lost their credibility
quote:The Majors are the OWGR. They will work with certain players like Nieman but they clearly aren’t making a major change for LIV
Either the majors & Olympics will change their qualifications/exemptions
quote:I think it’s a crapshoot when/if that happens
You really don’t think the PGA/PIF deal happens & things don’t get sorted out by then?
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 8:22 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 8:23 am to lsupride87
quote:
They rank players that play pro golf on qualifying open tours.
Yes, that’s what they do. Their job is to accurately rank the best players in the world
Posted on 3/5/24 at 8:27 am to JimTiger72
And you can’t do that when a tour has guranteed contracts and a closed tour
Rickie Fowler went from top 10 to out of the top 100
If the pga tour was setup like LIV that never comes close to happening. Look, anyone that is impartial understands LIV not bending on this is its own fault. Even their biggest fanboy flushing it can see this
If LIV changed this and was still blocked I would be impartial enough to say they are getting screwed.
Rickie Fowler went from top 10 to out of the top 100
If the pga tour was setup like LIV that never comes close to happening. Look, anyone that is impartial understands LIV not bending on this is its own fault. Even their biggest fanboy flushing it can see this
quote:
But, I don’t see much effort from LIV to actually change things. One of the biggest issues is pathways and player rotation. Last season, just 1 player gained access to the league via their feeder tour, making up less than 2% of the field. Even if you add in the 3 players from the promotion event, they still gave more spots to guys with guaranteed contracts than they did qualifiers. That’s a problem. It’s very easy to stand back and blame other organisations, but what are LIV actually doing themselves to get players access to majors?
If LIV changed this and was still blocked I would be impartial enough to say they are getting screwed.
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 8:37 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 9:43 am to lsupride87
The OWGR can change their criteria in a heartbeat if they want to in order to rank LIV players. They are just choosing not to. I don't give a flip one way or the other about LIV, but they have a stronger field than any other tour not named the PGA Tour week in and week out and are not getting points.
If the PGA Tour can change the way they operate (no cut Signature events, etc.), then surely the OWGR can find a way to incorporate LIV, even if they are awarded fewer points for being smaller fields with 54 hole events. This shouldn't be that difficult.
Everyone is being obstinate here.
If the PGA Tour can change the way they operate (no cut Signature events, etc.), then surely the OWGR can find a way to incorporate LIV, even if they are awarded fewer points for being smaller fields with 54 hole events. This shouldn't be that difficult.
Everyone is being obstinate here.
Posted on 3/5/24 at 9:48 am to BMoney
quote:Or, the rationale way to look at it, LIv can change their format in order to get ranked by the established metrics everyone else followed. They are choosing not to
The OWGR can change their criteria in a heartbeat if they want to in order to rank LIV players. They are just choosing not to.
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 9:49 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 9:57 am to lsupride87
quote:
Or, the rationale way to look at it, LIv can change their format in order to get ranked by the established metrics everyone else followed. They are choosing not to
Or simply give them 3/4s of the potential points, with more deductions for not meeting the open system piece.
It's a golf tour. Rank them. This shouldn't be that difficult.
Posted on 3/5/24 at 9:59 am to BMoney
OWGR made it very clear they can work with liv with the 54 holes etc. They simply want them to be an actual open golf tour. I can’t fault them for that being a true requirement. It’s completely logical
Posted on 3/5/24 at 10:31 am to BMoney
If they wanted to rank the best players in the world, then they could have worked with LIV. Only award the top 24 OWGR pts or something.
They were more interested in playing politics than having an accurate ranking system for the best golfers in the world
They were more interested in playing politics than having an accurate ranking system for the best golfers in the world
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:00 am to JimTiger72
If liv was interested in ranking points they would have followed the format. It’s so weird you can’t just say that
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:09 am to lsupride87
If they *needed* ranking points, then they would have made changes. They don’t need it.
For the sake of having an accurate ranking system, they should have been awarded points but that’s not up to them to keep OWGR accurate.
It’s possible for LIV guys to move up OWGR playing Asian & DP Tour events, if they want to. See Burmester, Oosthuizen, Puig, Reed, etc
There are some guys on LIV who aren’t interested in doing that. Thankfully some guys can just play well in Majors & move back up. Then there’s other guys like Gooch, Paul Casey, HV3, etc who are left out to dry if they don’t play additional events.
I still think a PGA/PIF deal gets made eventually & the professional golf climate looks different a year from now.
For the sake of having an accurate ranking system, they should have been awarded points but that’s not up to them to keep OWGR accurate.
It’s possible for LIV guys to move up OWGR playing Asian & DP Tour events, if they want to. See Burmester, Oosthuizen, Puig, Reed, etc
There are some guys on LIV who aren’t interested in doing that. Thankfully some guys can just play well in Majors & move back up. Then there’s other guys like Gooch, Paul Casey, HV3, etc who are left out to dry if they don’t play additional events.
I still think a PGA/PIF deal gets made eventually & the professional golf climate looks different a year from now.
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:15 am to lsupride87
If the majors want to keep the best players (and ratings), all they have to do is change the criteria. Not a big deal.
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:17 am to BMoney
quote:This
The OWGR can change their criteria in a heartbeat if they want to in order to rank LIV players. They are just choosing not to. I don't give a flip one way or the other about LIV, but they have a stronger field than any other tour not named the PGA Tour week in and week out and are not getting points.
If the PGA Tour can change the way they operate (no cut Signature events, etc.), then surely the OWGR can find a way to incorporate LIV, even if they are awarded fewer points for being smaller fields with 54 hole events. This shouldn't be that difficult.
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:19 am to ell_13
LIV has done a good job with their own point system for season standings.
Assuming things stay the same between LIV/PGA/PIF, then I could see majors moving to a system of top 10-12 LIV guys (not already exempt) getting invites.
Maybe top 5 & individual winners?
Assuming things stay the same between LIV/PGA/PIF, then I could see majors moving to a system of top 10-12 LIV guys (not already exempt) getting invites.
Maybe top 5 & individual winners?
This post was edited on 3/5/24 at 11:29 am
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:28 am to JimTiger72
quote:It would be the top 6-10 golfers. And it would t be “not already exempt”. That makes no sense
Assuming things stay the same between LIV/PGA/PIF, then I could see majors moving to a system of top 10-12 LIV guys (not already exempt) getting invites.
If the top 10 are all exempt, they aren’t going to get 20 guys
Posted on 3/5/24 at 11:48 am to lsupride87
quote:
I mean, players have a right to be pissed at LIV and Norman here
No they don't. They knew going in that they weren't getting points. They can be mad at the OWGR and themselves. Norman and LIV tried about as hard as you can I'm sure.
I've been a decent fan of LIV from the beginning/mainly not blaming players for leaving and calling out the Tours BS. That being said, as LIV stands right now, they don't deserve OWGR and if they did, it should be a decent amount less than what a PGA tournament gives out.
They took the money and knew going in there would be consequences going in with OWGR. That was part of what they had to weigh when deciding to switch or not. Do I take the money and potential to earn much more money each tournament or do I stay and have the potential to keep rising/stay at a high enough spot in the rankings to earn my way into the majors.
Now there are PGA events that 100% shouldn't be giving out the points that they do, especially events like the Hero World Challenge and now even some of the 54 hole tournaments (at least have a reduced amount). So the system is flawed, but it's too bad, there are consequences for leaving and taking the money. They knew from the get go that you can't have your cake and eat it to but now they want to.
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