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Started By
Message
re: Distance Roll Back
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:02 pm to The Johnny Lawrence
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:02 pm to The Johnny Lawrence
quote:
think "tiger proofing" the courses made it easier for him to win.
It really did. Almost, like…..it was on purpose. 
2
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:10 pm to CoachChappy
Growing the rough high doesn’t really mean much any more when they have a 480 yd par 4, bomb it 340 and hack a wedge out and on the green. I went to the PGA at Shoal Creek both times and the rough was so thick they were chipping out to the fairway. It was because to get it to the green they needed to hit 6 irons.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:45 pm to CoachChappy
quote:
It really did.
As it turns out, he was not only better than everyone from the fairway, but from under trees in 4” rough, too.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 2:12 am to redfishfan
quote:
IMO. If you want to keep guys from pounding drivers way down there narrow in the fairways down there and grow the rough up tall and thick.
That is the opposite of what you need to do and creates boring monotonous golf. If everyone is hitting their driver in the rough, the longest hitters BY FAR have the best advantage. There are some tournaments (US Open and PGA a few times) where it feels like there are only 10 guys in the field who can win.
Looks like Dire Wolf beat me to this point
This post was edited on 3/15/23 at 2:14 am
Posted on 3/15/23 at 9:15 am to Dawgsontop34
I don’t really understand the gripe from hackers or professionals on this one. Us weekend warriors are the lifeblood of the game, without us, no courses or manufacturers would be able to survive.
Manufacturers may have a gripe bc they are the ones that will have to foot the bill on developing a new ball that they won’t make money from the masses on. A ball they basically give away to their sponsored athletes.
On that same token, manufacturers are the ones that have been pushing out new equipment every single season and claiming “our longest yet”. They make a ton of money on hackers with this claim, and justify it by showing us their sponsored professionals are pummeling their products around the course.
I don’t think this rule would change who is good at golf at the professional level. What it could do ( and I’m all for this) is have the professionals play courses as the designers intended. This would require pga players to be more thoughtful and tactical in their approach to some of these courses.
I’m starting to ramble, but the usga and manufacturers need to figure this out. Are these huge gains because of any or a combination of the following:
1. Ball technology
2. Club technology
3. Sports science (athletes are just getting stronger and faster)
So many people on have said 3 is the main culprit. If that’s the case, then their marketing claims of creating longer clubs is bs, and they have marketed lies to the masses. If it’s 1 or 2, then let’s dial it back a bit on the professional level so the courses can be played as designed. In my opinion, it’s a combination of all 3. That’s how sports work, evolution happens.
Nothing can be done about point 3, so we can’t change that. Changing the courses every couple years, adding hazards, and growing thicker rough is just not feasible long term. So what you’re left with is either change the balls or change the club regulations.
Should there be a bifurcation between professional and us? I really don’t care. If it impacts distance that much, then I’ll move up a set of tees, shoot in the 90’s, and still have fun plying the game. Probably lose less balls if my drives didn’t fly as far lol.
Manufacturers may have a gripe bc they are the ones that will have to foot the bill on developing a new ball that they won’t make money from the masses on. A ball they basically give away to their sponsored athletes.
On that same token, manufacturers are the ones that have been pushing out new equipment every single season and claiming “our longest yet”. They make a ton of money on hackers with this claim, and justify it by showing us their sponsored professionals are pummeling their products around the course.
I don’t think this rule would change who is good at golf at the professional level. What it could do ( and I’m all for this) is have the professionals play courses as the designers intended. This would require pga players to be more thoughtful and tactical in their approach to some of these courses.
I’m starting to ramble, but the usga and manufacturers need to figure this out. Are these huge gains because of any or a combination of the following:
1. Ball technology
2. Club technology
3. Sports science (athletes are just getting stronger and faster)
So many people on have said 3 is the main culprit. If that’s the case, then their marketing claims of creating longer clubs is bs, and they have marketed lies to the masses. If it’s 1 or 2, then let’s dial it back a bit on the professional level so the courses can be played as designed. In my opinion, it’s a combination of all 3. That’s how sports work, evolution happens.
Nothing can be done about point 3, so we can’t change that. Changing the courses every couple years, adding hazards, and growing thicker rough is just not feasible long term. So what you’re left with is either change the balls or change the club regulations.
Should there be a bifurcation between professional and us? I really don’t care. If it impacts distance that much, then I’ll move up a set of tees, shoot in the 90’s, and still have fun plying the game. Probably lose less balls if my drives didn’t fly as far lol.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 9:21 am to MikeD
How is this different than wood bats for MLB vs aluminum bats for college and softball and everything by else …
Seems like right now pebble beach is obsolete due to distance… for us open etc… I don’t think it’s a bad idea … but also don’t feel it needs to go down below PGA
Seems like right now pebble beach is obsolete due to distance… for us open etc… I don’t think it’s a bad idea … but also don’t feel it needs to go down below PGA
Posted on 3/15/23 at 9:57 am to makersmark1
quote:
Then “they” are not taking advantage of matching their ball to the swing speed and skill level
I have several guys in my league that play ProV1, Chromesofts and TP5's. They are lucky to break 90 but you can't tell them to get a ball that fits their game.
Sometimes we are too enamored with branding.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 12:40 pm to Dawgsontop34
quote:
That is the opposite of what you need to do and creates boring monotonous golf. If everyone is hitting their driver in the rough, the longest hitters BY FAR have the best advantage. There are some tournaments (US Open and PGA a few times) where it feels like there are only 10 guys in the field who can win.
I think some are missing the point. If you ultimate goal is to keep scores somewhat down and not allow somebody to just bomb away there are other options than rolling the ball back. Widen the fairway from 290-315 and narrow the fairway past 315. Grow the rough thicker past 315/320. Add more dogleg holes that discourage bombing.
If you narrow the fairways everywhere and grow the rough up thick everywhere then yes the advantage goes to the long hitters.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 12:47 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
Everyone hits it into the rough at the US Open, it is better to be hitting 8/9/PW than 6/7/8 out of it.
Grow the living shite out of the rough at all venues & narrow the fairways. When they start breaking their wrists, accuracy will become paramount.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 12:47 pm to redfishfan
quote:
Widen the fairway from 290-315 and narrow the fairway past 315. Grow the rough thicker past 315/320. Add more dogleg holes that discourage bombing.
this is the Oymlpic and Bethpage way of handling the open.
Just dont see the tech slowing down, i don't blame the tour and USGA for looking for a way to standardize the balls
Posted on 3/15/23 at 2:15 pm to redfishfan
quote:
Add more dogleg holes that discourage bombing.
It’s not that simple. A lot of dogleg holes encourage bombing, especially if you grow the rough up everywhere.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 4:25 pm to redfishfan
quote:
Add more dogleg holes that discourage bombing.
Also very tough to "add doglegs" to courses built 100 years ago.
Posted on 3/15/23 at 5:02 pm to redfishfan
quote:
Add more dogleg holes that discourage bombing.
Ah, of course. St Andrews, Augusta, and Pebble just need to build new holes with doglegs
Posted on 3/15/23 at 5:15 pm to GEAUXLPOST
The USGA / R&A are supposed to be the stewards of the sport. They should have stopped this progression a long time ago. But I guess they are cashing checks from the manufacturers too.
PGA and tournaments I understand, they are there to make money. Augusta is probably the only course that could take a stand and not get blackballed, but they just go along and say frick Bobby jones.
PGA and tournaments I understand, they are there to make money. Augusta is probably the only course that could take a stand and not get blackballed, but they just go along and say frick Bobby jones.
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