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re: Homebrewing: In-Process Thread
Posted on 4/13/15 at 9:27 am to LoneStarTiger
Posted on 4/13/15 at 9:27 am to LoneStarTiger
I seem to have an interesting development in a brett saison that I currently have going. It's about 2 months old, so I decided to check in on it yesterday. When I opened it up, I noticed the color of the beer had darkened, and the pellicle was also a very thin, black/brown, bubbly looking thing. I haven't ever had a beer turn dark or form a pellicle like this. It tasted fine, but has me a little concerned for the beer's future. We shall see.
1
Posted on 4/13/15 at 9:29 am to BottomlandBrew
That's my nightmare with this sour, that at some point it's gonna turn and go wrong
Posted on 4/13/15 at 9:35 am to LoneStarTiger
quote:
3 weeks is enough, but you have to drink it all before it gets to 5 weeks and it fades
Good one.
Dick
Posted on 4/13/15 at 9:36 am to BugAC
quote:
Here's how i ferment with IPA's. Ferment in the primary for 8-10 days. Add dry hops to secondary, rack my beer into the secondary on top of the hops and dry hop for 5-7 days. At the end of the dry hop period, transfer to bottling bucket and bottle.
Oh, okay. Do you cold crash in the secondary?
Mine is relatively high grav, should end up around 8.5% when all is said and done.
This post was edited on 4/13/15 at 9:39 am
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:19 am to rbWarEagle
quote:
Oh, okay. Do you cold crash in the secondary?
No. Fermenting temps are usually around 68-70. Once i move to secondary i drop the temps to about 63-65, just to keep the inside of my ferm fridge from getting moldy with all the moisture in the air. You can if you want but it really isn't necessary. I'm also afraid that if i cold crash, that the bottles won't ferment properly because all of the residual yeast would die off before refermenting (carbonating) in the bottle.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:28 am to BugAC
quote:
No. Fermenting temps are usually around 68-70. Once i move to secondary i drop the temps to about 63-65, just to keep the inside of my ferm fridge from getting moldy with all the moisture in the air. You can if you want but it really isn't necessary. I'm also afraid that if i cold crash, that the bottles won't ferment properly because all of the residual yeast would die off before refermenting (carbonating) in the bottle.
Yeah, hadn't thought of the residual. So, here is my plan: I'm 2 days in to fermentation right now (bubbling well at this point). In about 5-6 days, the fermentation should be slowing or done (right?). Then, I want to rack to secondary for dry hopping with citra pellets. Everything I've read says secondary for at least 2 weeks, so I was thinking I'd dry hop it at the week mark with the pellets in a sanitized paint strainer bag. Then, after those two weeks, rack to bottling bucket, prime, and start bottling (letting them sit at 70 for 3 weeks in the bottle). Any issues there?
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:30 am to rbWarEagle
That should be just fine honestly. 2 weeks is longer than you need but it wont hurt anything either way.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:33 am to rbWarEagle
quote:
In about 5-6 days, the fermentation should be slowing or done (right?).
Wait until at least day 7, take a gravity temp. Or take one on day 6. Then 2 days later take it again. If your gravity hasn't changed, then its done fermenting.
quote:
Then, I want to rack to secondary for dry hopping with citra pellets. Everything I've read says secondary for at least 2 weeks, so I was thinking I'd dry hop it at the week mark with the pellets in a sanitized paint strainer bag.
Don't dry hop for that long. You want those hops fresh. Dry hop from anywhere from 3 - 7 days. Thats my preference. And you don't need a strainer. At least i don't use any when dry hopping. You get better hop utilization if you don't use a hop bag. Just throw your hops in the secondary and rack on top.
quote:
rack to bottling bucket, prime, and start bottling (letting them sit at 70 for 3 weeks in the bottle). Any issues there?
Make sure to make your priming sugar solution and place in bottling bucket before you rack your beer into the bottling bucket. You want as much of your beer in contact with the priming solution.
At 2 weeks, i always crack a tester. It's never at it's sweet spot then, but you'll get a good idea of how it will turn out. Usually by week 3-5 your beer is ideal for drinking.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:34 am to s14suspense
You think a week in secondary would be sufficient? Should I try and get it in the 65-68 range? Personally, I don't really care if the beer is hazy (in fact, after having Heady Topper, I'd prefer if it were).
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:37 am to rbWarEagle
quote:
You think a week in secondary would be sufficient?
Yes.
quote:
Should I try and get it in the 65-68 range?
Preferably, yes. If you can.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:37 am to BugAC
quote:
Wait until at least day 7, take a gravity temp. Or take one on day 6. Then 2 days later take it again. If your gravity hasn't changed, then its done fermenting.
Gotcha, sounds right.
quote:
Don't dry hop for that long. You want those hops fresh. Dry hop from anywhere from 3 - 7 days. Thats my preference. And you don't need a strainer. At least i don't use any when dry hopping. You get better hop utilization if you don't use a hop bag. Just throw your hops in the secondary and rack on top.
I meant that I would dry hop for the last week of the two-week secondary, so I think we're on the same page with that. As far as just throwing them in... if I go that route, should I try and filter the syphon (on the side in the secondary, not the bottling bucket)? I just don't want to end up with hop residue in the bottling bucket and have never racked before so I'm not confident in my ability to avoid the sediment.
quote:
Make sure to make your priming sugar solution and place in bottling bucket before you rack your beer into the bottling bucket. You want as much of your beer in contact with the priming solution.
Gotcha.
quote:
At 2 weeks, i always crack a tester. It's never at it's sweet spot then, but you'll get a good idea of how it will turn out. Usually by week 3-5 your beer is ideal for drinking.
Awesome.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:39 am to s14suspense
quote:
Yes.
Sounds good to me. Why do people insist on 2 weeks? Just so everything can drop out?
Posted on 4/13/15 at 12:10 pm to rbWarEagle
just my opinion, by I think you are over-thinking this and working too hard at it.
I would not use a secondary, but if you want to use one just be careful not to splash, be as gentle as you can to avoid oxidation. Your beer should be finished with fermentation in 5-7 days and ready for the dry hops. You can add the dry hops straight to the primary and get the same results. If you are worried about sediment, you can eliminate some in your bottling bucket by racking to it and letting it sit a little while to settle. The valve will not be exactly on the bottom of the bucket, so you will have about an inch or so of beer left in the bucket when you finish bottling unless you tip the bucket to get that out. That last inch or so will keep most of the residue in the bucket.
I would personally rather have a little residue and hop floaties in my beer than go through all the work you are planning to do, but to each his own
I would not use a secondary, but if you want to use one just be careful not to splash, be as gentle as you can to avoid oxidation. Your beer should be finished with fermentation in 5-7 days and ready for the dry hops. You can add the dry hops straight to the primary and get the same results. If you are worried about sediment, you can eliminate some in your bottling bucket by racking to it and letting it sit a little while to settle. The valve will not be exactly on the bottom of the bucket, so you will have about an inch or so of beer left in the bucket when you finish bottling unless you tip the bucket to get that out. That last inch or so will keep most of the residue in the bucket.
I would personally rather have a little residue and hop floaties in my beer than go through all the work you are planning to do, but to each his own
Posted on 4/13/15 at 12:46 pm to rbWarEagle
quote:
I meant that I would dry hop for the last week of the two-week secondary,
Maybe i'm not understanding, but why would you secondary a beer unless you are dry hopping/adding fruit, etc... Is it just for clarity? Secondary fermentation is unnecessary, IMO, unless you are dry hopping or adding a new yeast strain, etc...
quote:
should I try and filter the syphon (on the side in the secondary, not the bottling bucket)? I just don't want to end up with hop residue in the bottling bucket and have never racked before so I'm not confident in my ability to avoid the sediment.
I wouldn't. You may oxidize your beer by passing it through a filter of some sort. Just take your secondary (after you are done dry hopping) and place it on the counter. Most of the residual hops will have fallen to the bottom by day 4 or so of dry hopping.
Start making your priming solution. Pour your priming solution into your bottling bucket, and then rack into the bottling bucket. Now, do you have an autosiphon racking cane? That's all i've ever used, and it has a sort of stopper to prevent too much sediment from being sucked up. Also, the valve/nozzle of the bottling bucket is about 1/2 inch from the base of the bottling bucket. Unless you swirl around your wort before bottling, whatever trub you pick up will be minimal. Also, majority of the yeast/hop trub that may be picked up in your bottles, will typically stay in the bottle as long as you pour carefully. But generally its not a big deal.
picture of autosiphon
This post was edited on 4/13/15 at 12:48 pm
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:11 pm to LoneStarTiger
quote:
I would personally rather have a little residue and hop floaties in my beer than go through all the work you are planning to do
This x1000.
Just dry hop in primary. Secondary is a totally unnecessary step for the beer you're brewing. Add your dry hops after a week of primary fermentation, and dry hop for no longer than a week. Honestly, 3-5 days is plenty for dry hopping. The hops will settle to the bottom with the yeast trub. Rack from there to your bottling bucket just making sure your siphon isn't touching the trub at the bottom.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:13 pm to LoneStarTiger
quote:
just my opinion, by I think you are over-thinking this and working too hard at it.
The nature of a selective perfectionist.
Yeah, I've read about dry-hopping in the primary and I've heard good and bad things. Some people say the hop oils/molecules have an affinity for yeast cells, so racking to a secondary before dry hopping reduces this chance.
All in all, you're probably right. I'm probably overthinking it.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:15 pm to BugAC
quote:
Start making your priming solution. Pour your priming solution into your bottling bucket, and then rack into the bottling bucket. Now, do you have an autosiphon racking cane? That's all i've ever used, and it has a sort of stopper to prevent too much sediment from being sucked up. Also, the valve/nozzle of the bottling bucket is about 1/2 inch from the base of the bottling bucket. Unless you swirl around your wort before bottling, whatever trub you pick up will be minimal. Also, majority of the yeast/hop trub that may be picked up in your bottles, will typically stay in the bottle as long as you pour carefully. But generally its not a big deal.
Got it. And yeah, I'm using an autosiphon racking cane.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:18 pm to BugAC
To update the thread on my NHC mis-catergorized beer. If anyone recalls, I committed to sending a beer before taking a look at the categories, I assumed that NHC would have moved to the new BCJP style guidelines. However I made an arse out of myself for assuming. I said F it and sent a sour Belgian Pale Ale with figs anyways. I am a huge fan of the beer as are most of the people who try it so I wanted to throw it into the ring. Unfortunately had to enter 16E (Belgian Specialty) where it got pummeled for being too sour....LAME. Oh well, will have to save some for next time. Ended up with a 29.5 
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:19 pm to rbWarEagle
quote:
Some people say the hop oils/molecules have an affinity for yeast cells, so racking to a secondary before dry hopping reduces this chance.
Might want to tell all the professional brewers this. No commercial brewers move their beer to another vessel to dry hop.
Now, if you add your dry hops before your beer has reached FG, then the hop character could be affected.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:21 pm to BMoney
quote:
Just dry hop in primary. Secondary is a totally unnecessary step for the beer you're brewing. Add your dry hops after a week of primary fermentation, and dry hop for no longer than a week. Honestly, 3-5 days is plenty for dry hopping. The hops will settle to the bottom with the yeast trub. Rack from there to your bottling bucket just making sure your siphon isn't touching the trub at the bottom.
Trust me, I like the sound of less work, but I think I'm going to dry hop in the secondary just to see how it works for me. The supposed brewing gurus I read about all say something to the effect of "clear the beer before dry hopping".
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