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re: There's a recent new study on the use of Ivermectin for Covid
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:19 am to When in Rome
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:19 am to When in Rome
No I am questioning their credentials and methods. I'm not big on credentials, as long as you have something to back up your statement. One study won't tell me everything
2
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:20 am to macjonesgoat
quote:
No I am questioning their credentials and methods.
go on
be specific
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:21 am to GumboPot
quote:
IVERMECTIN prevents viral entry into the nucleus of the cells.
IN VITRO
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:22 am to Pettifogger
I am pro vaccine in general. I’ve given my son all of his. I got them. But I don’t get the flu one. My wife has to for work. My son doesn’t get it. My wife got the covid one for work. I didn’t. I said in March 2020 that we should have let everyone go about their business except for the elderly who were obviously at high risk. They needed to be told to protect themselves up until we got the hospitals prepared to handle these cases.
But the virtue signaling started immediately and quickly. We went from a canceled NBA basketball game on March 13th to mayors and governors crawling over each other to lockdown for a week, 2 weeks, a month by March 15th. That knee jerk overreaction and the fear porn that was coming out of Europe set the stage for where we are now ignoring the impacts and risks we posed to our mental health and our kids’ education. We were doing things with no regard for the consequences. And we kept doubling down because politicians and leaders can NEVER admit to being wrong or that what they decided to do lead to something worse than what they were trying to fix.
But the virtue signaling started immediately and quickly. We went from a canceled NBA basketball game on March 13th to mayors and governors crawling over each other to lockdown for a week, 2 weeks, a month by March 15th. That knee jerk overreaction and the fear porn that was coming out of Europe set the stage for where we are now ignoring the impacts and risks we posed to our mental health and our kids’ education. We were doing things with no regard for the consequences. And we kept doubling down because politicians and leaders can NEVER admit to being wrong or that what they decided to do lead to something worse than what they were trying to fix.
This post was edited on 8/18/21 at 9:30 am
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:26 am to lsupride87
quote:
Almost all of those studies don’t have a control group
Without a very robust control group, any covid study is basically useless. I’ll explain. If you treat 1000 people with fruity pebbles either as a prophylaxis or as a treatment once sick, 99.5% will have positive results
That’s why we all hate the “double blind control yada yada”,but with a virus in which 99% of people survive, it’s absolutely necessary to know if the meds have any effect
Well... you are completely wrong.
Lol
A placebo effect is real. "How do you feel after you took the meds?" I feel great doc. No pain, irritation, etc"
The nerves go through the brain and the placebo can adjust the brain's output.
However, the brain cannot adjust viral load. The brain cannot cure covid. Lol. Otherwise, everyone would be on sugar pills as protection against covid 19.
The only nervousness about unblinded studies is where a greedy lab switches results. Remember Harrison Ford bursting in the conference room in The Fugitive.
But most of these studies are surrounding areas where ivermectin is already taken (not for covid) and studying the efficacy in those subjects after the fact. There isnt an Ivermectin monopoly involved in the subjects and results at all.
I hate to break it to you.
But you couldnt be more wrong.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:29 am to Cosmo
quote:
IN VITRO
Which is reason enough for broader studies IMO
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:31 am to meansonny
No, im really not. Over 50% of the studies linked in the OP have no control group at all
Of the studies with a control group, 75% have a control size less than 100 patients
Trying to draw any conclusions at all based on that is completely futile
Of the studies with a control group, 75% have a control size less than 100 patients
Trying to draw any conclusions at all based on that is completely futile
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:33 am to stout
Fluvoxamine has shown some promising results recently.
LINK
quote:
McMaster researcher Ed Mills and his team treated 738 randomly selected Brazilian COVID-19 patients with fluvoxamine, while another 733 received a placebo, between Jan. 20 and Aug. 6 of this year.
Every patient receiving fluvoxamine during the trial is tracked for 28 days to determine their health outcomes and if they still need hospital treatment.
Researchers found about a 30-per-cent reduction in events among those receiving fluvoxamine compared to those who did not.
LINK
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:39 am to macjonesgoat
quote:Credentials of the author of the two articles on Medium, or the underlying studies referenced in the articles?
No I am questioning their credentials and methods
If the former, here is the author’s bio:
quote:If the latter, the older article calls into serious question the methods used in the studies comprising a large meta analysis that purported to show ivermectin working to curb covid-19, including a “large” study that was later retracted after it was revealed that the data and statistical analysis were complete garbage. The more recent article refers to a study coming out with excellent methods and a large sample size showing ivermectin to have little effectiveness in treating covid-19.
Gideon Meyerowitz-Katz is an epidemiologist working in chronic disease in Sydney’s west, with a particular focus on the social determinants that control our health. He writes a regular health blog covering science communication, public health, and what that new study you've read about actually means.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:42 am to ell_13
I'm hopeful that Larry Elder can win the recall. In some polls he was leading, and 50%+ of dems thought Gavin should be recalled.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:53 am to stout
the same people who have ruled by the mantra of "if it saves one life" are the same people blocking access to studies on alternative treatments. hypocrisy at its finest
Posted on 8/18/21 at 9:57 am to ell_13
quote:
But the virtue signaling started immediately and quickly. We went from a canceled NBA basketball game on March 13th to mayors and governors crawling over each other to lockdown for a week, 2 weeks, a month by March 15th. That knee jerk overreaction and the fear porn that was coming out of Europe set the stage for where we are now ignoring the impacts and risks we posed to our mental health and our kids’ education. We were doing things with no regard for the consequences. And the. We kept doubling down because politicians and leaders can NEVER admit to being wrong or that what they decided to do lead to something worse than what they were trying to fix.
There was a factor of the unknown in march 2020. Reports of people dropping in the streets were out there. I dont like emergency measures (im a libertarian). But i cant blame a government making rash decisions into the unknown (no one at the time knew that the CDC and WHO were making absolute fools of themselves).
But since April, we absolutely should have taken your approach (protect the at risk. Everyone else do what they need to do to make a living and take care od their family).
It isnt fair to forget how little was known in the beginning. It is tough to cry Fake Science and Fake News before the CDC/WHO prove to be china shills.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:01 am to macjonesgoat
quote:
I'm hopeful that Larry Elder can win the recall. In some polls he was leading, and 50%+ of dems thought Gavin should be recalled.
If Larry wins it will send political shock waves through the entire Democrat party. All the Democrat politicians in purple districts and states would take serious pause with going along with the AOC/Pelosi gang.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:01 am to lsupride87
quote:
No, im really not. Over 50% of the studies linked in the OP have no control group at all
Why is a control group important when we are counting viral loads?
Are you expecting the existence of a placebo to impact viral loads in the studies?
Are you expecting the lack of a control group to effect the viral loads in the groups with ivermectin?
This is not a study that placebo provides any value. People get infected or they dont. They get hospitalized or they dont. They get respirators or they dont.
This isnt a "tell me where it does or does not hurt".
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:03 am to meansonny
quote:
Why is a control group important when we are counting viral loads?
Are you expecting the existence of a placebo to impact viral loads in the studies?
Are you expecting the lack of a control group to effect the viral loads in the groups with ivermectin?
the vast majority of these studies are about outcomes, not viral loads, so
and in that case, a control group is absolutely necessary considering that many people have positive outcomes of COVID with no treatment
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:04 am to lsupride87
quote:
Almost all of those studies don’t have a control group
Without a very robust control group, any covid study is basically useless. I’ll explain. If you treat 1000 people with fruity pebbles either as a prophylaxis or as a treatment once sick, 99.5% will have positive results
That’s why we all hate the “double blind control yada yada”,but with a virus in which 99% of people survive, it’s absolutely necessary to know if the meds have any effect
Well shite. I was reading OP and thought well that's good news.
No control group makes these studies totally worthless.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:04 am to bee Rye
They don't actually care about other people. "I demand that your life is ruined so I can feel safe" doesn't sound so great though does it?
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:09 am to Fun Bunch
These doctors must be wackos for administering ivermectin as part of their protocol:
LINK and MATH protocol.
LINK and MATH protocol.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:27 am to Salmon
quote:
the vast majority of these studies are about outcomes, not viral loads, so
Correct.
The same outcomes that i listed.
Positive test
Hospitalization
Ventilator
How does a placebo effect a positive test for someone who took ivermectin?
How does a placebo effect a hospitalization for someone who took ivermectin?
How does a placebo effect a ventilator for someone who took ivermectin?
Think about your answer.
Seriously.
Posted on 8/18/21 at 10:30 am to meansonny
quote:No there wasn’t. We had excellent natural studies because of the cruise ships. They told us exactly what we needed to know. You had South Korea testing literally everyone. All of that took place before the March madness.
There was a factor of the unknown in march 2020. Reports of people dropping in the streets were out there. I dont like emergency measures (im a libertarian). But i cant blame a government making rash decisions into the unknown (no one at the time knew that the CDC and WHO were making absolute fools of themselves).
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