re: California school science project that connected race and IQ is pulled after complaints

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Maybe..........call me nuts......questions that call for further and more intense study. And not just by people who are agenda driven to gain one result or the other. But even agenda driven would be superior to "no, we can't look at that........to do so is racist" kind of shite.

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And that’s my issue. I want someone to attempt to answer these questions without getting shutdown by the PC crowd. You don’t solve a problem by pretending it doesn’t exist.

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And that’s my issue. I want someone to attempt to answer these questions without getting shutdown by the PC crowd. You don’t solve a problem by pretending it doesn’t exist.

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I'm of the mind that in all likelihood, the data behind The Bell Curve is solid, accurate and well researched.

But, science, even well researched science, is almost never complete. Just a few points off the top of my head although by no means comprehensive.

1. Assuming there are differences in the distribution of IQs by race/ethnicity, the distributions are STILL largely overlapping(same by sex). Hence, anyone using it for individual assessment is silly. We're simply talking about very similar curves where the median is slightly shifted right or left.

2. There are different types of intelligence. I hate to use dogs as an example, but they make for an easy analogy. A hunter who needs a pointer won't think an Australian Shepherd is very smart. A herder won't think very highly of the Pointer that the hunter uses.......while our societies definitely have a bias towards certain types of intelligence, it isn't universal. The more we know about varying intellectual capacities, the more we'll know about how to maximize EVERYONE's. We won't try to teach a fish to climb trees and then say the fish is dumb because it can't.

I also think that if we genuinely studied the subject without fear of what we'd find, we'd end up fleshing out data like in TBC and discover detail that has heretofore gone unnoticed.

But, we just don't ever want to do that shite. Be it race. Sex. Or any other sacred cow, we run around pretending all humans are alike and by extension, approach every problem as if there can be no causes beyond socially nefarious ones(isms....)

Didn't Watson or Crick, who founded the DNA thread in the 1950s, find a similar results when comparing the intellect of races finding whites academically superior to blacks? It ruined one of them back them. Facts only count when PC.

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You don’t solve a problem by pretending it doesn’t exist.

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you hurt the problem by enabling the marginalized groups to act in the way that made them marginalized

that's why this shite is so annoying

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Well shite, that’s not in lockstep with the preferred vision so I must be a liberal. Post history be damned, actual viewpoint be damned, I don’t agree you damned dirty liberal!

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It was irrelevant to the discussion of the fact it was banned. Don't try to be coy.

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The closest to endorsement I came was offering a rationalization as to why it could not be the cookie cutter assumptions that people are pigeonholing the story into.

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There's no cookie cutter assumption.

It was banned due to subject matter. They don't ban shitty presentations. And you know it. You're just trying to be slick.

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Whites and Asians culturally place a larger emphasis on intellectual nurturing, as opposed to black families (or what remains of them). I fully believe that most black kids are not getting the “nuturing” aspect of intellectual development.

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The best way to explain it is 'the bucket' analogy. IQ is the size of your bucket. 'Nurture/learning/experience is the water you put in it.

If Tarzan's parents (Lord and Lady Graystroke) had IQs of 130 and Tarzan is abandoned in the jungle as a baby and raised by a chimp, then his IQ is still 130 (plus or minus 4). But he can't read nor write and he loves bananas.

If, OTOH, he is rescued by humans at age 10 his IQ is sufficient for him to fill his bucket quickly and get into med school by age 26.

If 2 doctors adopt a child with an IQ of 75 they can supply all the nurturing and mentoring in the world and the kid is never going to be a doctor. His bucket is too small.

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So yeah. Should be criticized.

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Should it be ignored?

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Northern Asians are not considered as people of color or as minority’s

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The term I used was 'non-white'. Are northern Asians considered white?

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It was irrelevant to the discussion of the fact it was banned. Don't try to be coy.

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I was direct responding in agreement to what someone else said.


ARE YOU CALLING MY OPINION IRRELEVANT! DON’T YOU TRY TO CENSOR ME!



The fact that you basically just said that everyone’s comments get viewed through the lens of what you feel is the most germaine issue...well. It explains a lot about your posting method.

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They don't ban shitty presentations. And you know it. You're just trying to be slick.

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Actually no.

I’m just repeating what I’ve already said. But leaving you no room to wiggle with it. Because it’s somehow MY fault and lazy if I grant you room to jump to whatever conclusion you want.

For instance, the above statement:

As stated above in response to your earlier argument.

I didn’t deny they pulled it. That it was censorship. But arguing ANYTHING controversial without strong merit justifying the position is a mine field.

You are damned right I would pull a half assed work whose own provided data contradicts its claimed conclusion but still caused a shite storm.

Here is what we know are undiluted facts:
1) The poster went up Monday
2) It had shitty methods and presentation. He literally spent less than an hour putting it together. fricked up scissor cuts and crooked sheets all over.
3) He remained for 3 days, not an immediate withdrawal.
4) There was a building backlash because of the PC



That’s plenty of time for a teacher to see the presented data, punch it into excell, and t-test it. If that turned out to not fit the data, hell fricking yes I would pull that shite.

Put succinctly, WHY THE frick DO YOU WANT THE PRINCIPAL TO TAKE HEAT OVER SOMETHING THE STUDENT DOESNT GIVE A shite ABOUT.

For fricks sake, here is part of the poster. At a elite, high performing HIGH school student project.
















It’s so over the top shitty that I can’t discount the possibility it’s a deliberate troll job. A “Hey look, I’m smarter than you and look at how shitty this is.”

Only thing missing are the crayons.

Similarly, as stated above, I can’t discount the possibility that his data doesn’t fit his conclusion, starting controversy over nothing and actually poisoning the well of legit conversation.

I feel these both have equal or even higher possibility of being what happened compared to your read that it is definitely censorship because of admin not liking the subject material.

But digging in and recognizing these possibilities are lazy and obtuse. Better to just leap assuming you know all the facts because you heard this story before.


But going back to the whole “liberal” comment: expecting an audience just because is as participation award as they come. And it isn’t like it was banned outright.

Dealing with the consequences of your actions falling short seems to fit in with traditional conservative ideals of self sufficiency

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The critical period of human development is between birth and puberty, but the earlier introduction of the correct nutrition can has a lifetime of impact.

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yeah. intelligence is developed in that early period. so is language (And fetishes, iirc)

that's why i think a lot of IQ data over mass populations is at issue. you can't test kids at like 8-10 and get a picture of what their IQ would have been had they been raised under the most optimal circumstances

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I'd wager that vitamin D levels, which are lower in people with dark skin, might have something to do with intelligence as well, and indeed, there are a couple of papers out there that suggest a causal relationship between vitamin D and cognitive development.

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that's interesting

all the biology becomes irrelevant if intelligence is not harvested and developed, though. that's why culture matters

the sad part is that modern progs reject both the biological and cultural issues involved