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Just picked up a used Seagull dreadnought cutaway for 200 bucks,
Posted on 10/26/17 at 4:02 pm
Posted on 10/26/17 at 4:02 pm
It has a Godin pick up,and looks brand new. This is my first Seagull guitar,damn it sounds great for the price.
I guess the model is Entourage Rustic? CW QI?
It seems like a great deal,but I have never paid much attention to The Seagulls. Is that a decent buy,or about average?
I do have 1 of the A&L dreadnoughts that was given to me years ago,I haven't played that one in years,but it is a pretty high quality guitar IMO.
Why are these so cheap? Seems like they should be more expensive.
I guess the model is Entourage Rustic? CW QI?
It seems like a great deal,but I have never paid much attention to The Seagulls. Is that a decent buy,or about average?
I do have 1 of the A&L dreadnoughts that was given to me years ago,I haven't played that one in years,but it is a pretty high quality guitar IMO.
Why are these so cheap? Seems like they should be more expensive.
Posted on 10/26/17 at 4:55 pm to auggie
I'm pretty sure they're the best acoustic guitars for the money, particularly used.
Posted on 10/26/17 at 5:02 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
I'm pretty sure they're the best acoustic guitars for the money, particularly used.
I have no doubt about that,but they've been around a long time,30 years or so,seems like they would command higher prices by now.
Posted on 10/26/17 at 5:34 pm to auggie
quote:
seems like they would command higher prices by now.
Martin, Taylor and (Westerly) Guilds tend to hold their value quite well. Certain Gibson and Fender acoustics do, too, but that's highly year and model dependent.
You're right that Seagull is far more likely to depreciate like a Yamaha or even an Ovation (and I love Ovations) - and I can't explain it beyond quirky styling and just the impression of it as a value brand to begin with.
Posted on 10/26/17 at 5:41 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
quirky styling
I don't much care for the headstock design.
Posted on 10/26/17 at 9:56 pm to auggie
Seagull and its sister Lasido brands, Godin, La Patrie, Simon and Patrick, Art and Lutherie, are stellar guitars and there are nothing cheap about them from a materials, craftsmanship and general luthiery perspective. I have said for decades now that one would be hard pressed to find a better value in a guitar, new or in particular used. And they have been in the U.S. marketplace long enough so that they are plentiful on the used market.
The general reason they are so cheap is that:
a.) Lasido utilizes a program in which Canadian companies which utilize domestic commodities to make export goods get a sweet government subsidy for doing so. In the case of Lasido, the commodity is lumber. More specifically, the spruces and cedars used for soundboards, wild cherries used for sides and backs, walnuts for headstock veneers, etc. Keep in mind those Canadian forests that feed Lasido that prime tonewood are also feeding Martin, Taylor and the rest of North America's reputable luthiers their great wood stocks.
b.) Lasido has generally relied on grassroots, word-of-mouth marketing from their dealers and fans like myself for decades. They have never invested heavily in costly advertising and marketing campaigns in the vein of what we see from Martin, Taylor or other major manufacturers. Reduced marketing costs transcribes to reduced production costs.
The general reason they are so cheap is that:
a.) Lasido utilizes a program in which Canadian companies which utilize domestic commodities to make export goods get a sweet government subsidy for doing so. In the case of Lasido, the commodity is lumber. More specifically, the spruces and cedars used for soundboards, wild cherries used for sides and backs, walnuts for headstock veneers, etc. Keep in mind those Canadian forests that feed Lasido that prime tonewood are also feeding Martin, Taylor and the rest of North America's reputable luthiers their great wood stocks.
b.) Lasido has generally relied on grassroots, word-of-mouth marketing from their dealers and fans like myself for decades. They have never invested heavily in costly advertising and marketing campaigns in the vein of what we see from Martin, Taylor or other major manufacturers. Reduced marketing costs transcribes to reduced production costs.
Posted on 10/27/17 at 3:42 am to TheFretShack
You know, I get the part about advertising costs,but Martin and Taylor aren't exactly advertising during football games.
As a matter of fact, I have never seen much advertising for either one,that you didn't have to buy yourself.
Maybe dealers get free stuff that doesn't reach the pickers?
As a matter of fact, I have never seen much advertising for either one,that you didn't have to buy yourself.
Maybe dealers get free stuff that doesn't reach the pickers?
This post was edited on 10/27/17 at 4:40 am
Posted on 10/27/17 at 7:32 am to auggie
I worked in a major advertising and marketing firm or 18 years before I opened my shop, and a multi-faceted ad and marketing campaign is more far reaching and more costly than one would think. According to Guitar World magazine's 2016 advertising card, one full-color full page ad alone was about $16K a hit. You get discounts in the advertising world for multiple placements, but you still have to consider you have a year's worth of issues, you have banner ads on the magazine's online site, you have other guitar magazines, you have other guitar mag online sites ... then add in the ad placements with Guitar Center, Musician's Friend, Sweetwater and all those other places we guitar players go online. Just effective blanketing via traditional and electronic advertising adds up FAST.
As for marketing endeavors, cutting edge business websites that are as big and good looking as Martin and Taylor's websites are expensive to create and update/maintain. You will need either an in-house department or a contracted outsider for not only the advertising agency artsy presentation but an IT firm to build it, tweak it for SEO, track usage statistically and tweak the sites visuals and functions accordingly ...
Promotional ... A major booth presence at two annual NAMM shows are VERY expensive to create and put on. Free giveaway guitars you periodically see in contests are free only for the winner.
That's just a few examples of ad and marketing costs that have to be absorbed in sales per unit. I'm sure I only scratched the surface.
As for marketing endeavors, cutting edge business websites that are as big and good looking as Martin and Taylor's websites are expensive to create and update/maintain. You will need either an in-house department or a contracted outsider for not only the advertising agency artsy presentation but an IT firm to build it, tweak it for SEO, track usage statistically and tweak the sites visuals and functions accordingly ...
Promotional ... A major booth presence at two annual NAMM shows are VERY expensive to create and put on. Free giveaway guitars you periodically see in contests are free only for the winner.
That's just a few examples of ad and marketing costs that have to be absorbed in sales per unit. I'm sure I only scratched the surface.
Posted on 10/27/17 at 7:38 am to TheFretShack
quote:
worked in a major advertising and marketing firm or 18 years before I opened my shop, a
Don Draper/Dick Whitman?!!!
You have to be 85 going on 130 with all that hard living!
Posted on 10/27/17 at 7:54 am to LSU alum wannabe
LOL, I've got a few miles on my chassis, no question!
Posted on 10/27/17 at 8:59 am to auggie
Didn't seagulls have that sort of matte finish a lot of the time?
I used to love those guitars as a kid
I used to love those guitars as a kid
Posted on 10/27/17 at 10:34 am to Pettifogger
quote:
Didn't seagulls have that sort of matte finish a lot of the time?
Yes. I don't think I've seen a glossy one. They are great but I'm glad I never got one. Dependent on woods they can be Taylor bright in tone. Overly so to my ear. And I've never found a comfortable neck. That is all personal preference though. Anybody crapping on them though is incorrect. Best made North American guitar for under a grand. I believe they are better than Mexican Taylors.
Posted on 10/27/17 at 11:01 am to auggie
I haven't seen a Seagull in years, but I remember playing one in college. I thought it had an interesting look, sound, and feel when playing it. I've wanted one since then. Maybe I'll add it to my wishlist.
Posted on 10/27/17 at 11:31 am to SUB
Most Seagulls are mattes/satins, but they offer gloss coats on the top only within their line and then full gloss finishes on some upper tier models, just like Martin and Taylor. In the world of guitars in general, mattes/satins are not only the least restrictive as it pertains to natural soundboard vibration and resonance (never a bad thing), they are cheaper because they are less labor intensive to make, so you see more at the retail level. The same applies to Gibson's "faded" series guitars - among the reasons they are cheaper than "standards" or "customs" is a less labor intensive finishing process.
Posted on 10/27/17 at 11:44 am to TheFretShack
quote:
they are cheaper because they are less labor intensive to make, so you see more at the retail level.
Yeah the finish doesn't have to be "perfect" like with a high gloss. A decent number of those have to be stripped and refinished before shipping - especially high dollar models.
Posted on 10/28/17 at 1:21 pm to TheFretShack
yeah, this one is a light satin sunburst,which I really like.
Not crazy about gloss finish on acoustic guitars anyway. I just never knew that it could make such a difference in manufacturing costs.
Not crazy about gloss finish on acoustic guitars anyway. I just never knew that it could make such a difference in manufacturing costs.
Posted on 10/28/17 at 4:55 pm to auggie
Check out French-polishing shellac and you'll get an idea. Once watched a Yairi shop video and even finishes in assembly line mode are surprising involved.
This post was edited on 10/28/17 at 9:52 pm
Posted on 10/29/17 at 1:13 am to SUB
quote:
I haven't seen a Seagull in years, but I remember playing one in college. I thought it had an interesting look, sound, and feel when playing it. I've wanted one since then. Maybe I'll add it to my wishlist.
Well,you know,anytime you buy a new guitar,it just sounds so great for a while,but I think this one will keep me interested.
It's kind of funny really, I have decided that I am going to get out and do more live performing..just acoustic stuff you know. I have an old Takamine so I went and bought a single coil soundhole pick up for it and put it in,walked right past this Seagull.
went back a couple of days later to buy some odds and ends,picks,new capo etc..just happened to pick this one up,and I swear, it sounds almost identical to the Takamine. Blindfolded I couldn't tell the difference,and neck and action are almost identical feeling.
When he told me what he could take for it,I was a little mad at myself for not picking it up before I bought the Fishman.,but Oh WEll.
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