Started By
Message
locked post

Who wants to point out the flaws of this healthcare bill?

Posted on 9/21/17 at 5:27 pm
Posted by Adam Banks
District 5
Member since Sep 2009
32247 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 5:27 pm
I keep hearing how it's terrible on this board but no specifics. I'm willing to be convinced but gonna need to hear specifics. From where I sit it gives decision making power to the states for where funds go, allows states to reduce amounts of required care in plans, gets rid of the individual mandate. What am I missing here? Definitely an improvement


Of note in asking this of "conservatives" not liberals. I don't need any fear mongering of granny and baby joey off a cliff
Posted by Esquire
Chiraq
Member since Apr 2014
11952 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 5:28 pm to
It doesn't repeal Obamacare.
Posted by Tigerdev
Member since Feb 2013
12287 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 5:34 pm to
It is pretty clear this is basically just a mechanism to declare victory and get a punch of dimwits to say MAGA!

It seems to accomplish very little...IF you want proof, evaluate this plan as if Obamacare didn't exist and tell me you would support it.
Posted by gthog61
Irving, TX
Member since Nov 2009
71001 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 5:38 pm to
It eliminates the individual mandate, correct?

That means I don't have to buy coverage for pregnancy if I change jobs again and need an individual policy?

I am in.

I learned from dem voters - what is in it for me?
Posted by Antonio Moss
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
48357 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:00 pm to
The insurance lobby has come out against it because they believe some states will simply institute single payer with the block grant.
Posted by frogtown
Member since Aug 2017
5073 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:23 pm to
it allows the states to create their own "individual market" for those not covered by employers/Medicare/Medicaid.

It gets rid of the individual and employer mandate.

It keeps all the Obamacare taxes except the medical device tax which both Dems and Repubs want to get rid of.

It takes the Obamacare taxes and block grants it back to the states. The purpose to cover those people who are chronically ill/sick/have preexisting conditions etc. The states will do this by either granting a subsidy(like Obamacare) or creating a high risk pool.

This can be called medical welfare(it is). But it does create a "cleaner" "healthier" risk pool for everybody else. There should be a trade off.

Getting rid of Obamacare mandates, inducing competition between insurance companies, allow associations, and creating a "cleaner" risk pool wil/should l lower premiums. This can all happen if the states choose to do it.

All the left wingers are bitchin' that the law takes back "some" the Obamacare wording on covering preexisting conditions. This is what happens when you deregulate the ACA. WHO REALLY GIVES A SHAT WHAT HAPPENS TO THIS ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL. States can/will take care of this on the state level.

Insurance companies don't want this. That is a good sign. People need to realize when YOU FORCE people to buy health insurance with all the bells and whistles(Obamacare's Essential Health Benefits mandate) - pregnancy care, birth control, drug rehab, mental health, ambulance service etc that insurance companies are making out $$$ with all this additional crap.


Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
99806 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:29 pm to
The response of libs and Ocare supporters tells me it is more than just window-dressing.

Posted by GumboPot
Member since Mar 2009
119533 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:39 pm to
Listening to Mark Levin he's for the bill. Not happy about it but says it's a step in the right direction. Also said it gets us off the path to single payer.
Posted by Sidicous
Middle of Nowhere
Member since Aug 2015
17529 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:55 pm to
quote:

Of note in asking this of "conservatives" not liberals. I don't need any fear mongering of granny and baby joey off a cliff


How about the question of: Does it pass Constitutional muster?

Last time I read the toilet paper that is the foundation of our Nation, health insurance was not an enumerated power. Since health insurance is not an interstate transaction, the Commerce Clause comes up short too.
Posted by tigersbb
Member since Oct 2012
10443 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 6:58 pm to
quote:

From where I sit it gives decision making power to the states for where funds go, allows states to reduce amounts of required care in plans, gets rid of the individual mandate. What am I missing here? Definitely an improvement


Anything that is finally passed will be a major improvement. Most people with Obamacare policies are unable to access their coverage due to prohibitive deductibles and co - payments. The Affordable Care Act was nothing more than a huge transference of wealth. It is amazing that a benefit which was previously provided by employers on a voluntary basis has now been placed under governmental control, forcing certain employers to provide the benefits or be fined, while telling them how the benefits are to be paid, how much they must pay, what is covered and deciding which of their employees lifestyles are to be subsidized by other employees.

In addition we were also being forced to subsidize health insurers through reimbursement corridors and subsidies when they were required to discard actuarial prognostications to assume any all risks with the knowledge that if their profits dropped accordingly the taxpayers would make up the difference. Now the courts have finally reigned in this assault on our constitution by the Obama administration by ruling these subsidies can only be paid when authorized by Congress. Congress has refused to allocate the funding and the carriers have elected to abandon this sinking vessel.

Yes, the " uninsured rate " may have dropped . Much of this is due to the mandate to purchase ( the first time in the history of this country the populace is forced to purchase a product just for existing) and those who would have been eligible for Medicaid even without the Affordable Care Act. Yet, the new insureds really are no better off as they must absorb large deductibles and co-payments to access their coverage. This is prohibitive for many.

When the Democrats were passing the ACA we were told, depending on the audience that there were 30,000,000 to 50,000,000 uninsured people in the country who would benefit from passing the ACA. Lets split it and call it 40 million uninsured. If those numbers were true then there should have been a stampede to sign up for coverage last year and this year. The Health and Human Services claims the number of signups this year is 10.4 million Remember, though we were not told the truth about 2015 signups. It was eventually exposed and finally admitted by the administration that they had lied and the number of signups was actually 6.3 million and not the 8.7 million they touted until they were exposed. There was no confirmation of how many of the current 10.4 million were previously insured and lost their coverage due to the ACA. In reality there may have been only 5 million newly insured. The total insured may have been well below 8 million by the end of last year.

My premiums have increased 64% since 2013 with higher deductibles and co-payments while I am also forced to subsidize the insurance of others. The president claimed premiums would be reduced $2,500 per family by the Affordable Care Act. The president knew this was not true and deliberately lied to the American people to push for the passage of the act.

The Democrats can be proud of themselves. They gave Obama his signature accomplishment and now the Democrats own it. It has already cost them the Congress and it was a significant factor in costing them the Presidency. It would have been better for Congress to have allocated an assigned risk pool of funds to assist those who were shut out of the standard insurance markets by pre-existing conditions instead of this giant exercise in absurdity and lunacy. The Democrats had to resort to unconstitutional deception and bribery of reluctant Congresspersons from Nebraska, Louisiana and Michigan to get the law passed. We were lied to again and again and again by this administration. Jonathan Gruber, one of the plan's major architects confirmed the level of deceit by the Democrats. Hard working tax paying citizens are being forced to subsidize health care for others, meanwhile many have lost their own coverage and are being forced to purchase insurance with higher premiums and higher deductibles and co-payments.

Despite Obama's claim it would reduce premiums an average of $2,500.00 per family this year's true numbers of participants will continue to drop, primarily due to the cost. A recent report stated more and more Obamacare recipients cancelled their policies even after being afforded great leniency by the very liberal rules set by this administration. So we had to totally disrupt health coverage that many were happy with, had to endure a total revision of the healthcare system all for less than 3% of the population of this country. This continues to prove how incompetent the Obama administration was and so ill prepared to govern. This is yet another example of how liberals operate. They will take what they can get at first. Then having gotten their foot in the door they return to press for the rest at a later date in the guise of fairness. Then anyone who objects is waging a war on those beneficiaries, a meme which their media minions is always willing to trumpet. Look no further than this current push for single payer option and the recent movement in California to cover illegal immigrants.

The Democrat Congress and President Obama passed a defective bill and will continue to pay the price for it. The Democrat Congress had to assure Obama got his signature accomplishment. You Democrats now own it lock, stock and barrel.
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 7:10 pm to
What bothers me is that Republicans are slightly changing Obamacare, and in the process are going to assume responsibility of the new plan.

Since I believe any plan without reform of lobbyists, Tort reform, more efficient end of life care, and more transparency from providers will eventually fail... This healthcare plan will eventually fail thus allowing the democrats to say "see the Republicans plan failed and we told you all along the only solution is single payer" (which is their ultimate goal)

The ball is in the Republicans court and they have all the advantage right now. Don't settle for anything less then the ideal plan because whatever they create here will be theirs

Tldr: the democrats are playing 3D chess better than the Republicans on this issue
Posted by CelticDog
Member since Apr 2015
42867 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 7:17 pm to
Less money in total package.

Nothing in bill addresses costs of services or products that your insurance is billed.

No new federal medical schools, so shortage of mds is addressed by cutting 20 million people out of the system.


Posted by BamaAtl
South of North
Member since Dec 2009
22072 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 7:20 pm to
It eliminates protections for those with pre-existing conditions. They cannot be denied insurance, but insurers can charge whatever they want - which effectively prices people out of the market, as nobody can afford a $100,000 premium for a cancer diagnosis.

It block grants Medicaid. This turns it into a program that would provide for your needs if you qualify into one that will face constant funding shortfalls and an inability to provide care.

The way in which it assigns the funding for block grants disproportionately penalizes those states that chose to expand Medicaid under the ACA, which means states like Louisiana end up losing money to states like Georgia (thanks for the extra money, chumps!).

It will lead to an extra 20-32 Million Americans uninsured by 2026.

It allows states to waive essential health benefits, leaving things like hospitalizations, clinic visits, prescription drugs, etc. uncovered if the insurance company so chooses. This opens up the market to the return of junk plans, which do not provide needed care in the event of illness.

It doesn't repeal ACA taxes, just shifts them around so dupes can think Republicans 'won'.

By introducing extreme variation in state to state health care systems and requirements due to block grants, it makes the Republican dream of selling health care across state lines an impossible fantasy (not that it would ever work, but to support this bill is to admit that you never want to consider it).


In short, it would make health insurance more expensive, cover fewer people, and cover fewer procedures/conditions/encounters. If you think making insurance worse, more expensive, and available to fewer Americans is worth saying you 'won', then Graham-Cassidy is for you!
Posted by LSU Patrick
Member since Jan 2009
73639 posts
Posted on 9/21/17 at 8:46 pm to
There needs to be a guarantee that big liberal states that squander their money don't get bailed out later on.
This post was edited on 9/21/17 at 8:52 pm
Posted by islandtiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2012
1787 posts
Posted on 9/22/17 at 12:16 am to
1 in 4 LA residents get healthcare through medicaid. With reductions in federal medicaid funding, the choices of how to allocate those dollars will create widespread pain for many. It won't affect me or my family, but I do have great concerns for the more vulnerable among us.
Posted by SoulGlo
Shinin' Through
Member since Dec 2011
17248 posts
Posted on 9/22/17 at 1:48 am to
Why would a state want to send money to DC, only to have DC take a cut for itself and then dole out the rest of the cash between the states?

What's in it for Arizona to give up money for heath care to Texas when Arizona is responsible for its own system anyway?
Posted by BigJim
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2010
14541 posts
Posted on 9/22/17 at 11:39 am to
quote:

keep hearing how it's terrible on this board but no specifics. I'm willing to be convinced but gonna need to hear specifics. From where I sit it gives decision making power to the states for where funds go, allows states to reduce amounts of required care in plans, gets rid of the individual mandate. What am I missing here? Definitely an improvement


Of note in asking this of "conservatives" not liberals. I don't need any fear mongering of granny and baby joey off a cliff



Not wading through 7 pages but you leave out the biggest part- it puts a cap on our third largest entitlement program, Medicaid. That is an enormous deal (for better or worse depending on your perspective).

first pageprev pagePage 1 of 1Next pagelast page
refresh

Back to top
logoFollow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News
Follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram to get the latest updates on LSU Football and Recruiting.

FacebookTwitterInstagram